Mesa F-series Lounge. Come on in and share your secrets.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Hey Brothers,

This is a thread for those interested in Mesa's stealth amp, and wondering how to get the most of them live, when recording or at home.

Tommi Inkila has been wowing everyone with his fantastic clips, and he suggested that such a thread would be cool to exchange production ideas, have a tube-discussion and especially hear experiences with the F-series in a live situation.

So share your experiences, and help the brothers (and sisters) here get the very best out of the Mesa F-series! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. The F-series Lounge is already a one-stop shop for information, now it's a one-stop shop for clips too! :thu:

_______________________________________


F-series Clip Library

Clean
F-50 - Until You Suffer Some - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/MesaF50Clean_Miked.MP3)
F-50 - Until You Suffer Some (Direct) - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/MesaF50Clean_Direct.MP3)
F-50 - Amazing Dissonance - musicdog400 (http://www.oz.net/~markw/ag2.mp3)
F-50 - Eminence Screaming Eagle Open back test - jrc6 (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000166004_000027492.mp3)
F-50 - VIDEO: Soon and Very Soon - Dann'sTheMan (http://www.tagnet.org/newlifeberlin/Admin/SoonAndVerySoon.avi)
F-50 - VIDEO: Overture - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman/music/OvertureClip.avi)
F-50 - Clean Sample - Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-50 - Blues - Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-30 - Clean - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Clean.mp3)
F-30 - Clean (Direct - PODXTL Cab+Mic Sim) - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Mesa_Cabsim_Clean.mp3)
F-30 - Stereo Clean - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Stereo_Clean.mp3)
F-30 - Clean - Roosevelt (http://showfile.file.sc/6442/GtrbsHp0/f30clean.htm)


Low Gain
F-50 - You're In Love - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/YoureInLove_Extended.mp3)
F-50 - I Want To Live With You - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/IWannaLiveWithYou_Remix.mp3)
F-50 - VIDEO: Mary Had A Baby - Dann'sTheMan (http://www.tagnet.org/newlifeberlin/Admin/MaryHadABaby.avi)
F-50 - VIDEO: The Trumpet Shall Sound - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman/music/TrumpetShallSoundIntro.avi)
F-50 - Sultans - Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-50 - Koin - musicdog400 (http://www.oz.net/~markw/koin.mp3)
F-100 - Haunting - hal9000 (http://www.soundclick.com/util/downloadSong.cfm?ID=3077669&key=5B5D9D86-0)
F-100 - One Night's Sleep - hal9000 (http://www.soundclick.com/util/downloadSong.cfm?ID=3077676&key=5B5D9D86-0)
F-50 - Classic 6L6 Boutique Drive - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman/music2/Revelation_F_50BoostedTest.mp3)
F-30 - Come Around - Bi-Polar (http://media.putfile.com/Bi-Polar-Come_Around)
F-30 - Strumming and arpeggiating - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Strumming.mp3)
F-30 - Stereo Noodling - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Stereo_Noodle.mp3)


Medium Gain
F-50 - Revelation - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/Revelation.mp3)
F-50 - Is It Alright To? - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/IsItAlrightTo.mp3)
F-50 - Fisher Of Men - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/FisherOfMen_Solo.MP3)
F-50 - Ascension - Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-50 - Medium Gain Sample - Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-30 - Singing Lead - Takis aka Mr. Blues (http://mp3.openmusicsource.net/artists/101874/melody.mp3)
F-100 - Strong Woman - hal9000 (http://www.soundclick.com/util/downloadSong.cfm?ID=3078769&key=5B5D9D86-0)
F-30 - Feeling Free - Bi-Polar (http://media.putfile.com/Bi-Polar-Feeling_Free)
F-30 - Armchair Soldiers - Bi-Polar (http://media.putfile.com/Bi-Polar-Armchair_Solders)
F-30 - Oblivion - Bi-Polar (http://media.putfile.com/Bi-Polar-Oblivion)
F-30 - Overdrive - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Drive.mp3)
F-30 - Stereo Drive - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Stereo_Drive.mp3)
F-30 - Stereo Crunch - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Stereo_Crunch.mp3)
F-30 - Stereo Lead - Antti Loponen (hhttp://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Stereo_Lead.mp3)
F-50 - 647 Elm Street - musicdog400 (http://www.oz.net/~markw/647mix.mp3)
F-50 - Voodoo Child - mangojeep66 (http://www.geocities.com/miramontes012966/voodoo_chile.mp3)
F-50 - Purple Haze - mangojeep66 (http://www.geocities.com/miramontes012966/puple_haze.mp3)
F-50 - Two Notes - musicdog400 (http://www.oz.net/~markw/2note_mix.mp3)
F-100 - Recording Tests - snakum (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=638062)



High Gain
F-50 - From This Moment - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/FromThis_MomentSolo_STRATTON.MP3)
F-50 - I Will Be Here For You - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/IWillBeHereForYouSolo.mp3)
F-50 - Place In This World- Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/PlaceInThisWorld_Solo.MP3)
F-50 - So Help Me God - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/MesaF50GainWithHBs.MP3)
F-50 - Downfall-like Crunch - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/DOWNFALL.MP3)
F-50 - Classic High Gain Mike Placement test - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman/music/MicPlacementClassicHighGain.mp3)
F-50 - Midnight Jam (Direct)- Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-50 - Deflep- Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-50 - High Gain Sample - Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-50 - Shut Up - Jacks Down featuring doggage5050 (http://www.jacksdown.com/03_Track_3.wma)
F-50 - The Plaque - mrelusive (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000179982_000012243_proj.mp3)
F-50 - Eastern 50 - mrelusive (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000179982_000012296_proj.mp3)
F-100 - Dig - hal9000 (http://www.soundclick.com/util/downloadSong.cfm?ID=3093990&key=2F0FB10E-E)
F-30 - Digital Times - Bi-Polar (http://media.putfile.com/Bi-Polar-Digital_Times)
F-30 - Shredding with wah and delay - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Shred.mp3)
F-30 - Drive (Direct - PODXTL Cab+Mic Sim) - Antti Loponen (http://www.cs.uta.fi/~al76016/mp3/Mesa_Cabsim_Drive.mp3)
F-30 - Murder In A Tuxedo music page (CLING TO and ONE MINUTE are both F-30....) - Japetus (www.myspace.com/murderinatuxedo)
F-30 - Dirty w/Contour - Roosevelt (http://showfile.file.sc/6443/OxA74rv6/f30dirty%20contour.htm)
F-50 - Bury You ---- False Positive - John Denver (http://www.blackvulturestudios.com/files/FALSE.mp3)
F-30 - VIDEO: Drunk and having Fun - RonniePentatonic (http://members.cox.net/rfust2/f30_shortvideo.wmv)
F-30 - VIDEO: Suhr and PRS Jam - RonniePentatonic (http://members.cox.net/ronnie_ward/F30_Suhr_vidclips.wmv)



Metal
F-50 - Sneak Peaker - Tommi Inkila (http://www.scenerychannel.com/broadcast/Tommi%20Inkila%20-%20F50%20Sneak%20Peaker.mp3)
F-50 - Building The Mood - Tommi Inkila (http://www.scenerychannel.com/broadcast/Tommi%20Inkila%20-%20Building%20The%20Mood.mp3)
F-50 - Seveno - Tommi Inkila (http://koti.mbnet.fi/scenery/Tommi%20Inkila%20-%20Seveno.mp3)
F-50 - Metal Riffin' - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/WhatIfMetalRiffin.mp3)
F-50 - Exile - Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-50 - Exile (boosted) - Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-50 - Detuned Riff (Direct) - Surfcaster (http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandid=381358)
F-50 - Amp-on-loan Metal - Rock_Borg (http://slick.nu/uploads/Borgs/f50.mp3)
F-50 - Early HB Recordin' & Widdlin' - Dann'sTheMan (http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman2/homerec1/MesaF50GainSalvaged.mp3)
F-30 - Various Metal & Hard Rock Clips - andershoeg (http://www.soundvenue.com/band.asp?id=1032)
F-100 - Sludge (direct) - hal9000 (http://www.64graphics.com/clips/hal9000F-100_Heavy_USB.mp3)
F-100 - Infinite War (direct) - hal9000 (http://www.64graphics.com/clips/hal9000COC_%20Infinite_War_F-100.mp3)
F-100 - It Is That Way (direct) - hal9000 (http://www.64graphics.com/clips/hal9000_COC_It_is_that_way_F-100_Xilisoft_%20Rev_%20B.mp3)




F-series Settings Archive

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000sF-SeriesAuditionSettingsrevA.jpg

[Dann'sTheMan]

Let me kick off with a tip that may be useful Live for integrating an F-series into a MIDI set up. I've posted this information before, but this thread is certainly a good place to document this.

I have made up a custom cable to allow me to switch my Amp and my FX Unit with one stomp on my MIDI footcontroller. I used it to switch live, for example, from a clean tone with fat chorus, to a thick crunch tone with Delay and Chorus - all without tap dancing. :cool:

Check out the cable diagram here (http://training.tcelectronic.tc/Files/Training/TCSI/images/answers/770/Rect-o-verb_GMajor.pdf). The F-series also uses a similar 5 pin DIN, but the pins are wired slightly differently - they are:

Pin 1 - Ground
Pin 4 - Channel 1/2 toggling
Pin 2 - Contour On/Off
Pin 5 - Reverb On/Off
Pin 3 - Not Used

They work like this, whenever a "Function" Pin is connected to Ground (Pin 1), the function of that Pin is selected i.e. to toggle between Channels 1 and 2, connect and disconnect Pins 1 and 4; to switch Contour On and Off, connect and disconnect Pins 2 and 1; to switch Reverb On and Off, connect and disconnect Pins 5 and 1. You can check this yourself by pulling the cable out of the Mesa footswitch, and connecting these pins, two at a time, with a piece of wire (you aren't likely to harm anything).
At the other end of the cable, I don't have a stereo jack (Tip, Ring, Sleeve), but rather mono jacks (Tip, Sleeve). I suspect it will be the same connection on many MIDI Switchers. All of the Sleeves must connect to Ground (Pin1). All of the Tips will connect to the Function Pins (4, 2 and 5).
http://www.dspglobal.com/adapt%205-pin%20DIN%20schem.jpg
Back at the other end of the cable, I used a 5 pin DIN socket so that I could simply unplug the Mesa cable from the footswitch, and plug it into my custom cable instead. You can see my custom cable here:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2251/1722471089_696fc69179_b.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2404/1723318964_a2045d3988_b.jpg

Big smiles,

Andy.

F-series Miscellaneous Tips

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-SeriesMixPotMasterRevB.jpg

[Tommi Inkila]

Wow, this thread started quickly... I was just imagining that something like this would be cool... and now here it is :)

At this point I would like everyone to participate, F-owner or not.

Here's my findings so far (a week with F-50) ...

Andy's instructions are really handy... I managed to do that cable right on the third time... mostly the problem was that I wasn't paying enough attention and the cable I was soldering had different colors on the cable.

I'd like to also address that F-series is 3-channel amp in real-life. The contour switch is so carefully tuned that the tone controls don't need any altering... at least in live situation where little tone alteration doesn't bring much in to the sound like in studio situation.

Then some findings about tubes... beforehand I were told that the stock tubes aren't really good on Mesa... at least on F-series that doesn't show to me at anyway. Still, I'm an experimentalist so I had to put in JJ electronics 12AX7 on V1 that supposedly does wondrous things on Mesa amps... especially in Rectifier series. The JJ tightened the sound, gave more defined high-end and increased the gain (and hum slightly). I can imagine that those qualities are something to thrive for in Rectifier series. F-series doesn't necessarily benefit on those aspects, because I find it to be more defined than recto. Of course JJ gives meaner sound to F-series, but the amp might lose some of it's fatness that appeal to many. I'll be getting some tested Svetlanas (Billington Gold) and chinese tubes (Golden Dragon) next week... I'll update you on that once I get some results that are saying-worthy, it may take a while.

Production: I've received many thanks about my production quality, big thanks for that... for a year I have studied recording all the time, but my findings are somewhat sad truths.

1. quality amps and instruments
2. quality recording equipment

After that you don't have to be the a magic engineer for capturing great sounds (of course that helps).

I may sound quite harsh, but I'll take purposefully a little bit aggressive approach to this subject so please bare with me :)

There has to be some differences between, let's say, a 60-bucks rec-preamp (actually ART Tube MP on that price range has great value) with a 1000-bucks machine.

Somewhere there's a point where the price/better sound -ratio comes quite bad, but to a certain point spending more money to the equipment is well worth the money. Just like in guitars... I'm getting sidetracked :) Anyway if you are really interested in recording, some of the money you wanted to spent on guitar gear should be spended on recording gear instead. This way your recording equipment grows along with the guitar equipment and you are able to capture the real sound of the amp finally.

How to change the overall sound with other stuff

1. mic choice
2. mic placement (took 3-4 hours for me)
3. the mix (there can be done some magic, but this shouldn't be the place where everything happens... fix it in the mix, I wouldn't sign on that)
4. tube choices, but this starts to get in to the territory of nit-picking

My SM57 is straight on axis directly to grille... 4" from left of the cab's edge and 6" from the bottom (bottom left element on my 4x12").

Bonus... if you want a massive guitar wall... double-tracking (or even super-stereo, 2 tracks on left and right) is a necessity. This takes some skill, because the playing has to be tight... it's also very effective way to improve your playing.

I think also that compression is a must for that guitar wall... at the moment I'm using freeware VST plugin from www.kjaerhusaudio.com called Classic Compressor... their other plugins are good too, like the limiter. My settings are normally something like this:

Threshold: -20dB
Ratio: 4:1
Soft compression
Attack: around 7-8ms
Release: 70-90ms
Gain: set with taste

Also it's wise to listen your mixes through monitors you're familiar with... with two different volume levels. If it sounds good quiet, it sounds great louder :D Listening through headphones is also recommendable.

It's often considered that a tube amp should be recorded with almost full volume and volcano-hot tube. With at least my F-50 that's not true. I recorded my latest clip with volume at 9:00 o'clock. Of course, the sound will most likely get even better when I turn the amplifier louder, but didn't find this as effective as I assumed.

There's some of my thoughts... quite long text, hopefully there's something usable within those lines. I'm happy to elaborate if I can :)

Oh, here's my latest clip: http://koti.mbnet.fi/ojakola/Tommi Inkila - Building The Mood.mp3

[Tommi Inkila]

One point about mic choice:

I have completely tested two dynamic mics for guitar recording and live use: Shure SM57 and Audix D3.

The minus of SM57 is that it starts to cut the frequencies already around 400Hz so it has to be carefully placed if you want the full bass frequencies created by the proximity effect. That's one of the reasons why I prefer it directly on the cab's cloth (grille)... in live situation 1"-2" away could be reasonable if you don't want to lose the bass by turning the knobs on the amplifier. This may be something that you have to fight with the mixer/engineer if they have they own preferences.

The plus of SM57 is it's upper-end "snap" quality that is often desired... also it gives the guitar some vocal qualities.

Finally, I'm not sure if I remember the numbers correctly, but it gives you some clues what I'm talking about:
If you happen to use SM57 and a cab with Celestion Vintage30's you get side-effect that can be good or bad. The resonant peak of V30-cab is somewhere around 2.8kHz and the resonant peak of SM57 is around 5.7kHz... that's close to having to octaves "ringing" at the same time (2.8 * 2 = 5.6 ~ 5.7) ... so those frequencies are emphasized with SM57 and V30 -combination. It's always present and very hard to get rid of if wanted. To some people this actually is the magic tone characteristics that they thrive for.

Audix D3 is more hifi mic with it's frequency range (about 50hz-19kHz). The sound is quite balanced and full already so it's not so critical to place. This mic could be a solution if you have some problems in getting the bass out of the traditional SM57. In live situation Audix is quite easy to work with because it doesn't pickup other instruments easily like drums from behind. Also the even response is a nice feature, because it gives more room to mix-man to work with. Sometimes in live situation SM57s snapness may come quite annoying to the audience, therefore Audix is nowadays quite common equipment in gig-places around here.

Hopefully I get to use some other mics so I can form some thoughts about them :)

[jrc6]

Great post tommi,

I like to mix and match different mic's when recording as well. I prefer to use condenser mic's on the rhythm tone, and dynamics with leads. The condenser's preserve the low mid & fullness of the guitar tone. The dynamics help sharpen the tone, and allow the lead to cut through.

I have both the Shure 57 & the audix d3. The D3 can easily take an SPL beating, even without a 10 db switch. I find the low mids are recorded better with the 57. The D3 is very clear, much clearer than a 57, but it has a unique flavor that I don't prefer for rhythm guitars. I think the low end is left out.

I have been experimenting with different speakers. I find the celestions are better for the F50, since they have more midrange punch. The F50 is fairly dark, and once the 6L6's kick in, it gives you a more balanced mid range tone. Therefore a speaker with a lot of mids (celestion v30, cl 80, green backs) will balance things out, and allow it to cut through the mix.

I have been trying the patriot series speakers (black powder & screaming eagle). It definitely offers a different tone, more dark & warmer. With both speakers, the F50 takes on more of a fender tone. You lose a lot of the nasal buzz of the celestions. The black powder is a great speaker with a heavy dose of low mid punch! Better suited for the F50 open back, as the close back has too much low mid punch & sounds too dark.

The screaming eagle, on the other hand, works much better. It is very, very bright, and helps better define the F50 high gain. It may be too bright for some people, but records like a dream. It makes the clean channel even more "poppy," and "bell like." It definitely has more of a fender vibe, bright & snappy.

The countor is a great channel, but I think there is too much bass!!! I typically back off the bass eq to about 10 O clock, crank the mids to 3 o clock, and crank the highs to 2-3 O clock. The high gain tone becomes much more clearer. This is especially true if you are cranking the amp, and pushing those 6l6's!

I hope to explore more with tube options as well. I am looking into the THD yellow jackets. Perhaps I can get an F30 sound out of the F50. I will post results in the future.

sorry for the long post

jrc

[Tommi Inkila]

Don't be sorry for long post jrc! I like those long texts :cool:

Few comments to your text... nothing negative :)

I will be having two mikes on the cabinet when I start to record our upcoming. Shure SM57 and one condenser (Rode NT-2A most likely).

That combination gives me the full tonal range... I'm a little bit worried though, because condenser will take some of the rooms sound and I like that "in your face" type of sound... well, we are going to see how that will sound :rolleyes:

BTW, your perception of feeling that dynamics will help you cut may come from the "snappiness" I mentioned in SM57.

I slightly disagree with you about the D3, but this may be caused by seeing the thing from an different angle. D3 is so even that it makes it feel to lack some bass and on the other hand it makes it so clear at the same time.

I personally prefer SM57 over D3 when used with F-series voicing... my former amp (now as backup), zenAmp, sounded much better with D3. So that's really case sensitive.

Experimenting with the elements would be cool, but it's out of my budget at the moment and I'm very pleased with those v30's... I'm glad you wrote about your experiences, now I know more, and if I have some questions sometime, I know who to contact :)

Overall I think ie. Nomad is even darker amp from Mesa. Actually I find F to be very bright Mesa. Anyway I have my bass knob set at 11:00 so we are not so far off :)

Let us know how those THD's work. It sounds very promising.

Let's have long posts on this thread and allow all the ideas and perceptions come out :cool:

[Tommi Inkila]

Hei! (finnish hello)

Just wanted to ask something about tubes... a minor thing that's been bothering me.

With the original tubes on my amp I started to get some really strange and loud "squeek" right after note that had a pause after it. Then suddenly the clean side was completely mute, dist was working fine. I put in JJ and the problem was cured.

Today, on practise I thought I heard same, but nanosecond long "squeek" once. It didn't happen for another time or I'm not sure if my ears were tricking me.

I presume this type of thing has something to do with tubes or components related to them. Do you think that it was the tube or could the problem be in the barrels (is that the correct term?) in which the preamp tubes are connected? Can someone describe how it sounds if one of preamp tubes sort of disconnects in the middle of playing. Also, I was wondering if these problems occur when the resonance causes some rumble to the amp and tubes...

Thanks in advance for your thoughts :)

[Dann'sTheMan]

I use an SM57 also, utilising one of two miking techniques.

The first is the popular on-axis approach, perpendicular with the speaker grill. I keep the mike on axis and move it between the centre of the dust cap and the edge of the cone until I have the right balance of treble and bass. I used this approach for many years both live and recording...

However last Spring, I learnt another technique from a respected Australian sound engineer that was flown in for a satellite TV show I was recording. He positioned the mic near the centre of the speaker, but with the capsule pointing back towards the edge of the cone. The barrel of the microphone making perhaps a 30 degree angle with the speaker grill. I've found this approach results in quite a balanced tone, but perhaps there is less proximity effect. The TV show mixed the audio live before broadcasting 24 hours later, and I was very pleased with the results of this approach.

I certainly recommend experimenting with these approaches, :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. BTW, Tommi, I've never experienced the squealing and silence symptoms that you described but then I've never touched the stock tubes in my F-50. It may be a "shorting" problem - I was wondering if maybe any of the tube socket contacts might have been damaged when you were experimenting with different tubes? If it happens again, it may be worth having the amp looked at properly so that you can have piece of mind (fwiw, my F-50 has been totally reliable).

[Guerrilla]

i dont have any secrets.... i rely on you guys.

[Tommi Inkila]

Thanks Andy for your experience on miking!

I'm also familiar with that miking technique... haven't really used it, but I guess that position works nicely on live situation especially. It's easy position, because it's easy to measure where to put the mike.

Thanks for your insight on the tubes... I was really careful when changing the tubes. I think that the bad tube may be the source of the problem most likely and hopefully. Well, there's always a warranty so I have much time to invistigate if there is any real problem. Because Mesas are known to be very reliable and my F-50 is brand new I refuse to believe that the problem lies inside the F-50. That would be too typical (bad luck) for me :rolleyes:

PS. guerrilla, I hope we are worth of your trust.

[-=MYK=-]

Hey Tommi, where can I find some more f-series clips?

[Tommi Inkila]

Hmmm... I have made these two clips.

http://koti.mbnet.fi/ojakola/Tommi Inkila - F50 Sneak Peaker.mp3
http://koti.mbnet.fi/ojakola/Tommi Inkila - Building The Mood.mp3

Dann'sTheMan has good clips on his signature ... hal9000 have some... and few other guys on this forum. I guess a search is in order to do here in the forum.

When I was searching clips of F-series, googling didn't do much for me. :rolleyes:

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Guerrilla
i dont have any secrets.... i rely on you guys.

Maybe I should have entitled this thread, "...share your experiences"? :p

This thread is meant to be more a relaxed Lounge than an academic exercise. If you have anything to share: settings, anecdotes - then please do. Even if you don't expect it, I'm sure others will find the posts valuable - I've already learnt some new things from both Tommi and jrc6! :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Guerrilla]

one thing i would add, although i'm sure it's apparent to anyone who's spent more than half an hour letting the 50 roar, is that you cant fine tune the amp at high volume levels while standing right next to it.... gotta adjust, step away 10 ft, then repeat.

[yourguitarhero]

it's a fucking hassle to change pre-amp tubes without taking the chassis out of the head cabinet.

the footswitch and power cord jacks are difficult to access.

Dunno if this is just for me or not:

The footswitch.

no led for reverb.

if on clean - 1 green LED
if on lead - NO LEDs
if on contour - 1 red LED that is only on when you access the lead channel.

so it looks weird if I'm rocking out because there are no lights, but there are when I'm on clean.

If I forgot whether I'm on contour mode or not, I can't find out til I turn on the dirt - kind of annoying for live use.

Anyone else getting this or is my footswitch broke (I bougth used)

Loving the amp though, but these are my quibbles.

http://gallery.aberdeen-music.com/data/500/90rig2-med.jpg

Craig

[Tommi Inkila]

I don't have those problems with leds... must be annoying problem.

I agree with you about those tube replaces. The cables are attached firmly for a reason, but I have also felt that they could be differently connected.

I still think that those tubes are easier to replace without dismantling the amp. Takes some nerves though and you have to know in which direction the sockets are. So far the best way for me to change those tubes is to put the F on the floor so that it's frontplate is facing to floor. One tube can be replaced in a minute at the worst... specially the V1 and V2 because they are behind the transformer.

[hal9000]

I’ve had my F-100 2x12 combo for over two years now and it has been a great ride. In that time I have played tons of gigs and I’ve never had a problem. First, I’d like to share my audition settings even though I post them all the time for people thinking about an F-series amp (check out the printable and blank versions in my sig):

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000sF-SeriesAuditionSettingsrevA.jpg

In my band Afraid Dave which is alternative rock, the lead singer and I write all the songs. I need everything from ultra clean through blues, classic rock, vintage high gain and modern high gain, which is why I chose the F-100. Many would ask, “Why does anyone ever need a 100 W tube amp?” Well, I wanted a ton of clean headroom and boy do I get it. Since I’m in a two guitar band, cutting through the mix is paramount, especially for lead guitar, so I usually have my mids at 1-2:00 on the OD channel. I use the contour function as a solo boost when I don’t feel like hooking up my homebrew FX loop solo boost. This leads me to my second image, my gig rig:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000GigRig11_7_05RevB.jpg

I mainly use effects out front into the clean channel and I run the OD channel almost dry as the effects just get lost in a live venue anyway. The Guv‘nor 2 pedal gives me a boost on the clean channel for dirty solos, and the EQ boosts for clean solos. BTW, I use the little triangular stickers from an office supply store to mark my clean and OD masters for equal volume. I find they stay on very well, and are completely removable. That way, I can have a consistent volume and always get back to home base.

If I only take my F-100 to a gig as the gig rig shows, then I employ a combo stand (Quik-Lok BS-317):

http://www.quiklok.com/200x200/sku_BS_317.jpg

This stand is great and I can get away with more volume since I’m the only one in the bore sight of the speakers. Otherwise, I run my amp with an Avatar 2x12 extension cab with Vintage 30s (Closed Back). I really love the combination of the 3/4 tuned-back of the F-100 and the closed back of the 2x12 since I get airy open clean and sucker punch bass at the same time. IMO, this setup is easier to move and sounds better than a single closed back 4x12 cab. Also, my backup rig is the PODxt Live, plus a Carvin DCM 150 SS PA. Should my amp ever fail, I use the combo as a 2x12 cab, the PODxt Live replaces my floorboard, and the Carvin produces the muscle.

As far as recording, I use an SM57 close to the grill on one side, another SM57 about 3-4 inches away on the other speaker, and the line-out through a DI box. Surprisingly, the speaker emulated output of the amp adds a lot of bass to the signal, which when added to the mic’ed recordings creates a monster sound. You have to be careful of phase of course, but if you get it right the results are great. I have also been experimenting with an Audio-Technica AT3035 condenser for a room mic about 10 feet from the amp, time corrected of course, to get a more airy feel to the sound. I can’t get too huge with the recorded sounds, because I have to leave room for my other guitar player, but for test recordings the sky’s the limit.

I’ve found that using the Hot Plate gives me a final master volume, which is nice at gigs since I can get equal levels for both channels and then turn the whole amp down for practice. I don’t really use the Hot Plate to crank my amp up to ridiculous volumes; it’s more so I can open the amp up to between 10:00 and 11:00 on the masters depending on the gig. I usually leave the attenuation set for -12 dB, which is the most I’m willing to go tone-wise. Obviously, there are lots of other uses for the Hot Plate, which leads me to my wet/dry setup:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000WetDrySetup6_7_05.jpg

Oh, man, there’s some fun to be had here; all the goodness of the F-100, with crazy FX post-power amp. I also like to run the same setup with the Hot Plate set to load for a low volume alternative with the DCM 150 driving both 2x12 cabs for full wet stereo.

To answer yourguitarhero,
“…no led for reverb, clean - 1 green LED, if on lead - NO LEDs, if on contour - 1 red LED that is only on when you access the lead channel…” Yes that’s the way it works, but you can see if Contour is on because during clean mode there is a faint red glow from the LED, which is easy to see when there isn’t a ton of light on the footswitch. It really wouldn’t be hard to mod the footswitch if you wanted different operation, such as switch for each channel. I’ve actually thought about moding the footswitch to always connect reverb, and use that switch to control my homebrew solo boost (with an additional LED of Course) I just haven’t gotten around to planning it out.

Finally, I made a fantasy rig just for all you F-series nuts out of a nonexistent F-100 head and 4x12 cab:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000sMesaF-100HalfStackPimpedOut2.jpg

[Tommi Inkila]

Cool Hal... that was nice to read... and the picture in the end... I'd want one of those sets. Tan grille looks cool, but I've been dreaming having those cabs with pewter grille. Gold grille looks cool on paper, but I haven't seen any good real-life pics about it... not even on Mesas site.

Do the leds work like that? I guess I must pay some attention to them when I see my baby next time :D

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila
Cool Hal... that was nice to read... and the picture in the end... I'd want one of those sets. Tan grille looks cool, but I've been dreaming having those cabs with pewter grille. Gold grille looks cool on paper, but I haven't seen any good real-life pics about it... not even on Mesas site.

Do the leds work like that? I guess I must pay some attention to them when I see my baby next time :D Like this: http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000PewterF-100Headandcab.jpg

[hal9000]

This is the closest I could find for an F-50:
http://www.mesaboogie.com/gallery/images/f50_bt.jpg

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by hal9000
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000PewterF-100Headandcab.jpg
save picture as... :)

Yep, I've found that Mesa picture also... looks really nice... I wish someone would order F-amps with every possible combination so we could get more pics :eek:

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila

save picture as... :)

Yep, I've found that Mesa picture also... looks really nice... I wish someone would order F-amps with every possible combination so we could get more pics :eek: If you want to see something that doesn't have a picture, I can make a prototype in no time...

[Dann'sTheMan]

hal9000! I just couldn't let this go without commenting about your posts in this thread - they are probably the best posts I've ever seen at HCAF, and undoubtedly the most beautiful.

I had hoped that you would join in this thread because you always make such valuable contributions. However, I was completely blown away by your hand-drawn works of art! Neil - you rule! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[UconnJack]

I'm loving my Custom F-50. Although, I've gone through two sets of power amp tubes in two months. Hopefully it's just a run of bad tubes, but we'll see.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v214/uconnjack/100_1727.jpg


DansTheMan, your post's and enthusiasm contributed to my interest in this amp, thanks very much, it's a tone machine. Thanks also for creating the "Lounge".

Hal9000, I'm considering a POD XT Live, to use in front as an effects processor. Have you tried that configuration? And also, I'm looking for a stand that can put the F-50 as low as possible while facing it almost straight up, similar to a monitor. Can the Quick-Lock stand do that?

Thanks Guys
UJ

[markmann]

"As far as recording, I use an SM57 close to the grill on one side, another SM57 about 3-4 inches away on the other speaker, and the line-out through a DI box. Surprisingly, the speaker emulated output of the amp adds a lot of bass to the signal, which when added to the mic’ed recordings creates a monster sound."

Hal, Doesn't the Hotplate have a line out? If so is it not good enough for recording purposes? I was hoping that if I was to buy a Hotplate that it could be set for a dummy load with speaker off and send an output to the mixer for silent practice or recording. I've tried the F-50 record out to headphones and found it was OK for practice and programming effects but not good for recording although I have not run it through my H&K Redbox yet.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by UconnJack

Hal9000, I'm considering a POD XT Live, to use in front as an effects processor. Have you tried that configuration? And also, I'm looking for a stand that can put the F-50 as low as possible while facing it almost straight up, similar to a monitor. Can the Quick-Lock stand do that?

Thanks Guys
UJ 1) Sweet custom F-50!
2) The PODxt Live is very good for live effects, but I prefer to use time-based stuff in the loop. If your aim is to use the stomp boxes out front for OD, compression, etc, then you’re on the right track.
3) The Quik-lok stand can very easily lean the amp almost parallel to the floor. It is very well constructed with good welds and strong steel. I highly recommend one for anybody with a combo. I use mine so I'm in the bore sight about 10 ft. away and 6 feet up. At close to horizontal, the amp would be about 6 inches off the ground at the lowest point.

Back to the PODxt Live: I've used the XTL in front with all amp models running and it sounds ok, I much prefer to run the XTL (sans cab models) into the FX return if I'm only using the F-100 as a power amp. One really interesting use of the PODxt Live is a setup I have been considering for some time. Imagine if you will what an XTL running in the loop would give you:

1) An F-Series amp where all three channels are directly footswitchable only using the XTL (more on this later).
2) Each channel has independent volume control (where contour is +3 dB now), making the F into a legitimate 3-channel amp.
3) The FX loop could be attenuated so the master can be turned higher than 9:00 and each patch would use midi to switch channels on the F by employing a CFX4 or equivalent:

http://www.axess-electronics.com/images/p_cfx4.jpg

4) The XTL could then give you tons of time based effects like reverb, delay, modulation, and tremolo, more control over final volume, additional level for solo boost, no need for the existing foot switch, plus you have your backup already on stage with you.

Many people like the Boss GT-6/8 and Tonelab SE so have a look at them as well. Personally, I preferred the PODxt Live as it had the right features, sound, and price.

BTW, I thought you guys could appreciate a little manipulation:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/PODxtLiveFaceplateF-SeriesAmpsRule.jpg

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
Hal, Doesn't the Hotplate have a line out? If so is it not good enough for recording purposes? I was hoping that if I was to buy a Hotplate that it could be set for a dummy load with speaker off and send an output to the mixer for silent practice or recording. I've tried the F-50 record out to headphones and found it was OK for practice and programming effects but not good for recording although I have not run it through my H&K Redbox yet. Yes, the Hot Plate has a line out, but you'll still need cab emulation. In using the Hot Plate as a load with my Behringer Ultra-G as the speaker sim, the amp sounds pretty good. However, I prefer to open up the amp to ridiculous levels when we record for real so I don't use the Hot Plate in that situation.

If you're going to use the Hot Plate as a dummy load, make sure to put the DI before the Hot Plate because I've found that it sounds better that way. BTW, the Ultra-G can take speaker level inputs and pass through to the load. This setup will sound better than the recording out since it is post power amp. Maybe I should try running the Ultra-G sans Hot Plate for another line level option, hmmm...

[JeffB]

I don't really have any secrets per-se, but I would like to reiterate some things that prospective F series buyers should know that have been mentioned in past threads.

Being that the F series amps are MESA's least expensive, I believe it's the "Gateway drug" for those who want a MESA but have never owned one before and/or cannot afford the Recto's, Marks, etc. If you are coming from a Marshall, Peavey, Laney, Fender or other similar amp it's VERY important to note that ALL the controls on the F series (and MESAs in general) are MUCH more interdependant on each other than you may be used to.

The amp requires tweaking. You cannot run all the tone controls 3/4 to full and expect it to sound decent like you can with a Marshall. It will sound like @$$. Flubby low end, harsh fuzzy top. Its best to set everything at 11-12 o'clock (including gain), and the Master at 8-11 o'clock and tweak from there.

If you are thinking about buying an F-series, chances are the manual will not be readily available when you are playing at the store. Download it for free from the MESA site beforehand and read it. There's alot of really useful info in there how everything interacts (unlike most amp user manuals).

As a longtime Marshall fanatic, I had some difficulty when I first got home with the amp because I was control happy (spinal tap mentality I guess). Once I read the manual and understood exactly how interactive they were, I started getting some absolutely incredible sounds out the amp.

Also don't ignore the Channel 2 plus contour and the gain set very low (8-10 o'clock). You can get some very nice vintage Marshall crunch type sounds with proper mid/treble/bass tweaking.

The F series are voiced a bit "dark" on the gain channels. A somewhat bright guitar and/or somewhat bright pups help.

Oh and finally. If you are looking at an F-30 combo. I would recommend a speaker swap, or jes get a head and 1x12 cab. The V-30 speaker in the half-open cab in a F30 combo makes the amp sound quite nasily and somewhat harsh. Of course tone is subjective. But thats the general concensus I hear re: the 30, so I must not be the only one. I intitially dismissed the 30 because of that. But once I played a head version through a closed cab with Black Shadow 90's, it was a totally different animal. Brutal if need be, smooth and sweet if thats your thing.

Great thread :D

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
If you're going to use the Hot Plate as a dummy load, make sure to put the DI before the Hot Plate because I've found that it sounds better that way. BTW, the Ultra-G can take speaker level inputs and pass through to the load. This setup will sound better than the recording out since it is post power amp. Maybe I should try running the Ultra-G sans Hot Plate for another line level option, hmmm...

...is why I asked. My H&K can also handle amp level so please let me know what you find out.

Mark

[markmann]

This might be a usful tip:

When I need or want to dial in a new sound, or many sounds as I'm doing now with my new F-50, it helps to have a second reference amp to compare to. Before I bought the F-50 I went to several stores and always had two amps set up. It's amazing what I hear when I do that and is how I zero'd in on the F-50 in particular. Now that I have it at home and immersed in tone tweaking, I'm using my old familiar Hiwatt Custom 50 as a benchmark for comparison. It might just be me but I tend to get tone deaf after listening to the same amp for long periods of time and it helps a lot to have something different to reference.

[thriftyshirt]

Hey guys, I'm not an F-series owner, but i've got a relevant experience.

I'm planning on going on a month or two long tour this summer, and I'm looking for a backup for my main amp, an Orange AD30TC and 2x12 Orange cab w/V30's. I wanted something with two channels, EL84's, big sound, takes up little room, and doesn't weigh too much (since it would be a backup). Poking around yesterday at GC in West Palm I saw that they had just gotten in a bunch of Lonestars (like 6 of them), a couple of tridents, and one F-30 combo.

Now, i had played the Trident before, and knew it wasn't for me at all, but from what i had heard, i was really interested in playing the lonestar. But when i saw the F-30 sitting there i plugged into that first. I hadn't even considered the F-30 despite the fact that it pretty much fits all the criteria that i wanted for a backup amp.

Long story short, I sat there and played the F-30 for an hour straight, and never plugged into anything else. Man that little amp was killer. I love the simplicity of the controls (other than the reverb, the control setup is the same as my Orange, although from what i've read the knobs interact differently, maybe). I love the versatility of the amp. So many sounds were available from just two channels. I like to set my Orange up live with one channel being a lightly overdriven clean, and the other being a fuller overdriven sound. That capability was there in the F-30. The addition of the contour boost was even better. I can imagine as a solo boost or as a slightly different voicing option, there are very few sounds that wouldn't be available in this amp.

My only complaint (which is not a big one by any means) was that, as i turned the gain knob up, the overdrive became more "compressed" at higher levels. I think this is mainly due to the fact that the F-series is mean't to do much higher gain than my Orange. With the Orange, the gain stays very open sounding and uncompressed, even at high volume and gain settings, but the gain from the F-30 was almost twice the level of what my Orange is capable of.

Either way, I think i've found my backup/next amp. If the sounds that i was getting out of it semi-cranked in the loud room at GC, and through the 1x12 V30 in the combo are any indication, this amp will absolutely destroy running through my Orange 2x12 V30 loaded cab.

I've got half a mind to drag my cab and guitar back down to GC, just to check it out. *rant* I had to use some Hum-equipped LP standard, because for some reason, that GC doesn't have ANY P-90 equipped guitars at all. Nor do they have ANY sets of guitar strings from ANY brand with a wound G string. :confused: *rant*

[markmann]

Originally posted by thriftyshirt
I've got half a mind to drag my cab and guitar back down to GC, just to check it out. *rant* I had to use some Hum-equipped LP standard, because for some reason, that GC doesn't have ANY P-90 equipped guitars at all. Nor do they have ANY sets of guitar strings from ANY brand with a wound G string. :confused: *rant*
I'm running my F-50 head through two 1x12 cab's with celestion 90's and sounds wonderful. No speaker distortion. I don't know what these would sound like with the F-30 seeing that it has different tubes but might be worth a try. I like the head and dual cab setup because it give me options. For some instances all I need is the head and one cab but for others I have the option of running the prefered two. Also this is very portable which is something you might really like, plus the head version of the F-30 is even smaller than the F-50 head.

[thriftyshirt]

Originally posted by markmann

I'm running my F-50 head through two 1x12 cab's with celestion 90's and sounds wonderful. No speaker distortion. I don't know what these would sound like with the F-30 seeing that it has different tubes but might be worth a try. I like the head and dual cab setup because it give me options. For some instances all I need is the head and one cab but for others I have the option of running the prefered two. Also this is very portable which is something you might really like, plus the head version of the F-30 is even smaller than the F-50 head.

I used to use a similar setup, and i ran an Egnater TOL50 into two Mesa Theile cabs with EV 200 watt speakers in them. It was nice and versatile, but I've found that closed back 1x12 cabs are way too directional for my taste, as i play smaller venues and rarely mic the guitar. Also, i prefer the closed back sound, so an open back 1x12 isn't really an option.

I didn't even know there was an F-30 head available. Do you know a street price on one of these? And possibly a reputable dealer? (I know i could google this myself, but it might be nice info to have in this thread.)

[JeffB]

F-30 head I believe was either $800 or $850 on the 2004 price sheet.

I don't think you can buy them online really. But my local store is www.eastcoastmusic.com Great store. Ask for Sandy. They may ship? I don't know.

[UconnJack]

I work right near East Coast Music. Let me know if you guys ever need me to go in there and check on something. Sandy is the Man!

[musicdog400]

I have only had my F-50 a couple of weeks but here is what I have learned so far:

-every knob on there affects the tone in ways I did not expect, for example the master volume. Mids become more pronounced as you pass 11 o clock

-I run mine thru an attenutator, a Weber Mass, so I can open it up a bit. Otherwise it is a bit loud for my apartment. It really doesn't sound great with the master volume at extremely low settings

-My guitar goes thru a Maxon compressor then into the amp. The compressor obviously gives me more sustain but also does something nice to the treble frequencies, makes them much smoother.

-Occasionally the reverb seems to not work on the lead channel

-I usually run an EQ in the loop boosting the bass a bit. It lessens the mid range honk and make the sound so full and warm. It is awesome for overdrive jazz leads. Amazingly the EQ seems to work fairly well in the parallel loop. But I did just receive the mod instructions to make it serial and I might do that.

-I love the clean. I was debating a Mark IV (and will probably get one in the future) but I didn't think the clean would be as good as the F-50.

-The biggest mental adjustment for me is having the tone stack pre-distortion stage. The tone controls lessen their effect as gain is increased. For me this means needing an EQ in the FX loop. But since I rarely use really hi gain this isn't an issue for me

-I get a better hi gain sound out of this amp by reducing the bass on my EQ pedal before the input, then boosting the bass in the EQ in the loop, post-distorion. That gives me a tighter low end, less flub.

[Tommi Inkila]

I'm really happy that this thread is becoming alive and kickin'! :)

There's a lot of good information exchange here... so keep it coming guys.

I don't have anything spectacular to add at the moment.

What comes to tone controls of the F: Surely there is some Mesaisms on those knobs, but I think F is their easiest amp to work with... actually, the amp sounds really good if everything is set to 12 o'clock... can any other amp do that? ;)

PS. Thanks hal for your offer... if I want to see some combinations that do not exist I'll contact you... keep up the good work... those pics are excellent.

[JeffB]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila

What comes to tone controls of the F: Surely there is some Mesaisms on those knobs, but I think F is their easiest amp to work with... actually, the amp sounds really good if everything is set to 12 o'clock... can any other amp do that? ;)

Oh yes I agree :D It IS easy to dial in a great sound on the amp (like you said, everythin at 12 is pretty damn good). I just meant that if you start to dial everything pretty high (especially gain/mids/bass), like you would/could on a non-MV Marshall, the F series will not sound very good.

[markmann]

Originally posted by JeffB
F-30 head I believe was either $800 or $850 on the 2004 price sheet.

I don't think you can buy them online really. But my local store is www.eastcoastmusic.com Great store. Ask for Sandy. They may ship? I don't know.
I paid $700 US for my F-50 head last week and was quoted a price of $650.00 for a F-30. Quite a value if you ask me, especially since I already had cabinets... I couldn't pass it up!!!

[Tommi Inkila]

I agree with you Jeff completely... I just wanted to make a general note about those knobs. With Mesaisms I ment that "treble affects to other knobs" -thing.

BTW, do you have more exact settings for those vintage Marshall sounds for the F? That would be cool to try out.

[markmann]

Originally posted by musicdog400
-I get a better hi gain sound out of this amp by reducing the bass on my EQ pedal before the input, then boosting the bass in the EQ in the loop, post-distorion. That gives me a tighter low end, less flub.
I've never heard of anyone using EQ pre and post... interesting, I'll have to give that a shot. One thing I don't want to do is mess with the treble or mids, my last rig was TOO smooth and creamy and I am now enjoying the more edgy upper range tone. I would like to clean up the bottom a little though.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann

I've never heard of anyone using EQ pre and post... interesting, I'll have to give that a shot. One thing I don't want to do is mess with the treble or mids, my last rig was TOO smooth and creamy and I am now enjoying the more edgy upper range tone. I would like to clean up the bottom a little though. I've run an EQ pre and post at the same time and you can get some massive sounds. Set the PreEQ for a treble/mid boost and lower the bass. Set the PostEQ to taste. Depending on how much mid you set you can get a real crunchy 80's metal sound, nu-metal scoop city, massive plexi midrange (if the gain is down), etc. The preEQ can be also be had by a boost pedal that removes some bass like an SD-1. IMO, pre/post EQ is the real secret weapon in generating your sound.

Tommi, you can get a Marshall-esque sound by starting with my setting called Vintage High Gain.

[Tommi Inkila]

Tommi, you can get a Marshall-esque sound by starting with my setting called Vintage High Gain.
Thanks for pointing me that out... I'll try that in todays rehearsals.

[UconnJack]

Keep the thread alive!

[Marshalldsl50]

I switched from a Marshall DSL setup (as per user name) to F-30 and I am still happy :)
I enjoy the sound of my favorite Kick Drum and Bass mic when recording Guitar…!!!!!!!!! The now discontinued EV N/D 868 :(
http://www.angelfire.com/music/skyfishermen/

Every guitar own sounds good to my ears through the amp and you can certainly hear their character….Which is a good thing.
-7String Telecaster/Jazzmaster (Maple body and neck single coil pickups)
-7String Mahogany Body, (Maple Neck, 7-String Screamin Demon Bridge pickup)
-Fury Baritone (http://furyguitar.com/) crazy guitar..!!!!!!!!

Recently I have been using the clean with a fuzz pedal and I swear it sounds bigger than the dirty channel (at least with single coil pickups).

The clean channel LOVE's PEDALS..... !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Big Willy]

Nice thread! I am totally torn between an F-50 and a Marshall TSL601. I played the Marshall last weekend, and it sounded killer, but I dont think the new Marshall's are anywhere near the quality of Mesa/Boogie these days. They cost about the same, actually the Marshall is more. I was ready to buy the F-50 completely based on Dann's & Tommy's clips, as well as my good experience with Mesa amps. I'm still not sure. That Marshall made this OD sound that was unreal. I've never heard anything like that before and I really liked it. I dont see Marshall getting the solid reviews that Mesa does. Any tips would be cool, I'm not trying to jack the thread, just wondering what you F-50 owners have to say. Maybe some of you have A/B'ed it with the TSL601.

[Marshalldsl50]

They are completely different amps :)

Both clean and dirty...

I had a TSL 60 Head for a while ..then DSL50 and now the F-30 (I know not exactly the same as F-50)

The Marshall has that fantastic "Mid" Honk that no other amp seems to have..... :(

For me I just started using Clean sounds more so the great Marshall Dirty sound was not a priority.

I really like the dirty on the F-30 but they are night and day different....F-30 is much darker and smoother.
I also found the F-30 clean to be much more "responsive" to playing in general.. The amp actual scared me at first. You touch your guitar and BANG sound explodes out the front…LOL

[Big Willy]

I may just end up with both. The Marshall sounded excellent though a little pricey for what it is I thought.

[hal9000]

I've been contemplating ditching my pedal board and amp footswitch in favor of using my PODxt Live in the FX Loop for effects, channel changing, solo boost, etc.

One of the major improvements I can make to the F-100 is equalizing the volume of the OD and Contour essentially making the amp 3 channels. Then, I have super control over the sound using the parametric EQ of the XTL. I can get solo boost/mid hump/”V” etc. by setting up the patches for each of my needs.

The only extra I need is an Axess Electronics CFX4 (http://www.axess-electronics.com/_cfx4.htm) (US$ 150) midi switcher to switch channels on my amp using the XTL’s midi program changes. As a plus, my backup rig is already on stage with me.

http://www.axess-electronics.com/images/p_cfx4.jpg

I’ve explored how the CFX4 would work to change the F-100’s channels, so I thought it may be useful for someone should they consider this approach:

The PODxt Live sends midi program changes with each patch and the CFX4 responds by latching relays on/off depending on what you need. Programming the CFX4 is as simple as selecting the patch from the midi controller, and pressing the EDIT button on the CFX4 until the desired operation is achieved. You can get a custom cable for the F-Series from Axess for $30, or build your own. The operation goes something like this:

CFX4 Sample Setup:
Relay 1 (R1): CH1 (OFF) / CH2 (ON)
Relay 2 (R2): Contour (ON)
Relay 3 (R3): Reverb (ON)
Relay 4 (R4): N/A – maybe a driver for a dual red/green super bright LED to pimp out your amp…

PODxt Live Setup for changing channels (XX = Don’t Care)
XTL Program 1:
Clean CH1: (R1=OFF) + Contour (R2=OFF) + Reverb (R3=ON) + R4 (XX)

XTL Program 2:
Crunch (CH2): (R1=ON) + Contour (R2=OFF) + Reverb (R3=ON) + R4 (XX)

XTL Program 3:
Heavy Rhythm (CH2 + Contour): (R1=ON) + Contour (R2=ON) + Reverb (R3=OFF) + R4 (XX)

XTL Program 4:
Smooth Solo (CH2): (R1=ON) + Contour (R2=OFF) + Reverb (R3=ON) + R4 (XX), EQ set for mid hump, patch volume increased.

Of course the volume of XTL program 3 would have to be reduced to make it equivalent with XTL program 2, but you get the idea. In addition, you can also reduce the FX Loop volume to drive the Preamp harder, thus getting the master volume over he magic 9:00 line. Basically, any FX unit that can send midi program changes will perform the same operation.

[boonhogganbeck]

I really think this will be my next amp. I've spent a lot of time with one at my local dealer. My question for the brotherhood is how does the F-50 like attenuators? I'm thinking that I'd probably use one just so I don't disturb the neighbors. Also, which is the best attenuator for the amp? I see a lot of post praising the Hotplate.

Thanks!

[hal9000]

Originally posted by boonhogganbeck
I really think this will be my next amp. I've spent a lot of time with one at my local dealer. My question for the brotherhood is how does the F-50 like attenuators? I'm thinking that I'd probably use one just so I don't disturb the neighbors. Also, which is the best attenuator for the amp? I see a lot of post praising the Hotplate.

Thanks! I use the Hot Plate on my F-100 set for -12 dB with the OD master around 10:30. In my live gigging application the Hot Plate excels. It is very transparent and allows me to open up the amp. However, if you're trying to get at or below TV volume, there are some caveats. What kind of volume are we talking here?

[JeffB]

I use an old Marshall Powerbrake for now..

Of course, it's not optimal, but it's better than crankin' it (as far as the neighbors are concerned that is :D)

I plan on buying a Hot Plate because it has the treble and bass boosts, which I think will help for bedroom volumes compared to the Marshall.

Honestly tho, I really feel the F-50 sounds much better un-attentuated at lower volumes than most other amps when you run the master low and the pre-amp gain high. It's more full and less buzzy sounding than say a 800/900/2000 Marshall, 5150, Peavey Classic, or similar. Again it's not optimal, but better than anything I've ever owned or tried.

And as for the vintage marshall-esque sounds, yes Hal's "vintage high gain" setting is very close to what I use. It'll vary a bit depending on the type of guitar/pickups.

IME, there are a TON of sounds to be found in the F-series amps if you just play with it. It's a tone tinker's dream. I think with a mod for adj. bias and some EL34s it would excel at british/modded marshall type sounds. I thot about having Voodoo perform such a mod on mine, but I'm not sure now. I really love the way the amp sounds right out of the box, and I can't remember any amp that I felt that way about in the past (especially an "open" back combo...I normally abhor open back combos).

All I know is Randall Smith has converted this ol' Marshall fanatic to a MESA-phile with the F-series :D

[UconnJack]

Originally posted by JeffB


Honestly tho, I really feel the F-50 sounds much better un-attentuated at lower volumes than most other amps when you run the master low and the pre-amp gain high. It's more full and less buzzy sounding than say a 800/900/2000 Marshall, 5150, Peavey Classic, or similar. Again it's not optimal, but better than anything I've ever owned or tried.

I agree completely. I've been giging my F-50 for a couple of months now and just recently stopped using the Hotplate. I'm always miked and I feel I get a fuller-fatter tone without the HP.

[Tommi Inkila]

Keeping the thread alive!

I just received some 12ax7's, the Billington Golds (tested Svetlanas) and Golden Dragon (tested chinese tubes)... unfortunately I haven't yet put them on my F-50.

Initial impressions are that Golden Dragons have cooler package and Billington Golds have very handy markings of mA / transconductance... picked up few that came close to "so called standard" 1.2mA / 1600 ... let's hear how they will sound.

[yourguitarhero]

http://gallery.aberdeen-music.com/data/500/IMG_0036.jpg

Here's my F-50, back in the house for repairs. The cabinet is a matamp with a single V30.

Getting some incredible solo tones with the green side (tubescreamer clone) of the jekkyl & hyde with Channel 2 normal mode.

Craig

[Tommi Inkila]

Looks cool Craig!

Jekyll and Hyde is really good overdrive/distortion pedal... if somebody doesn't need the distortion side (right side) of that thing then I'd suggest you checkout the Route 66 from same manufacturer. It has the same left side as in Jekyll and Hyde (tubescreamer-type overdrive) and on the right side there is very healthy sounding compressor.

[yourguitarhero]

very intersting. I can't really see me using the red channel, just the green for a boost.

But it'll be handy in case my amp goes down at a gig and I have to borrow someone else's - three channels and a solo boost (off, green, red, red+green) rig that I can use through a clean amp.

But yeah, it's a cool pedal.

In a couple of days I'll have a Nano Head sittign on top of the cab.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Following on from the custom cable explanation that I kicked this thread off with, and in connection with hal9000's recent posts about using a POD XT Live and a CFX4 to get a pseudo three channel set up, I thought I'd elaborate on how I achieve something similar. :cool:

I use a Behringer FCB1010 as my MIDI foot controller. This has two built in relays that can be used for amp channel switching. The two relays are enough to select the F-series Clean, Lead and Contour sounds. ...but not reverb.

For me it's not a problem to have the Reverb non-footswitchable. I can add reverb from my FX unit for a particular song, or more usually, I use the amp's reverb control to dial in the appropriate amount of reverb for the venue. This may be a useful tip for some as I've found having reverb in every patch is a pain when I arrive in a venue with lots of natural reverb, and I have to spend time tweaking all the patches and disabling reverb - so now I tend not to use reverb from the FX unit when playing live. :p

My FX unit is a battle worn Zoom 9030. I've used this for years and I've found that not only are the modulation and delays sweet, but that the EQ section is very powerful for "post" shaping the tone. Because the EQ is set at the patch level, you basically have a MIDI programmable EQ that can create wildly different tones whilst maintaining a fixed EQ on the amp. I must admit that I love the voicing of the F-series so much, that I don't tend to use the EQ functionality any more, but it's there whenever I need it.

Combining the Behringer, Zoom and custom cable makes for a very powerful live rig where pressing a single footswitch simultaneously selects both amplifier channel and FX. I have 2 rows of 5 sounds set up in my "main" bank. 1 row is just a louder version of the other row, for those solo moments.

Switch 1 selects the Clean Channel, with no FX. If I press the switch again, it toggles Chorus on/off. Expression pedal B varies Chorus mix.
Switch 2 selects the Lead Channel, with the volume boosted to be the same level as other patches. If I press the switch again, it toggles on/off a short single slapback delay.
Switch 3 selects the Contour Channel with delay and a hint of chorus. Expression pedal B varies the amount of feedback for trails when required.
Switch 4 selects the Clean Channel with Tremelo. Expression pedal B varies the Tremelo rate.
Switch 5 selects the Lead Channel with Flange. Expression pedal B varies the Flange depth.
These are my main patches with Expression pedal A varying overall volume. I have other banks set up along similar lines.

Feel free to ask if you have any questions. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[yourguitarhero]

I get a 5 channel setup with a pedal in front, I use the tubescreamer side of the Jekyll & Hyde.

So i have clean, dirty (clean + pedal), distortion (red channel), more distortion (contour) and solo (hitting the front end with the pedal when on the red channel)

When doing this, I keep the gain on the red channel down to around 11 o clock.

Craig

[jrc6]

Hey guys,

great thread. You guys have definitely tweaked the amp with tons of home mod recipe's! that is cool. I just plug the guitar into the thing, get good sounds, and add effets in the mix later on. Just easier for me to get a better tone.

I did install some yellow jackets. Played them over the weekend. I haven't cranked an F30, but it definitely gives it a unique tone. It still sounds F-series, but a tad thinner & less low mid. It is a little brighter, and it the el 84's break up very easy. It is a good alternative to a power attenuator.

I will post some clips later today to compare the yellow jackets and 6l6 groove tubes.

[UconnJack]

Just ordered the XT Live. Looking forward to experimenting with it thru my F-50. I'll post a follow-up in a few days.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Whilst we're lounging here are some of my F-series design fantasies.

http://www.mesaboogie.com/gallery/images/f50_w8at.jpg

http://www.mesaboogie.com/gallery/images/f50_bt.jpg

http://www.mesaboogie.com/gallery/images/f50_kt.jpg

http://www.mesaboogie.com/gallery/images/f50hd_w1w.jpg

http://www.mesaboogie.com/gallery/images/f50_7ab.jpg

http://www.mesaboogie.com/gallery/images/f100hd_9ab.jpg

Why not share yours? :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[the _serpent]

Hello all, first post, after reading your posts over the last few weeks i decided to join the brotherhood,got my F50 this week, its early days yet but im in love with this boogie, really pleased with it.
http://uk.geocities.com/steve_fitzgerald2003/f50.gif

[Tommi Inkila]

Welcome to our brotherhood! I'm glad you found us :)

BTW, that beauty has pewter grille?

[the _serpent]

Yes its Blue Bronco with Pewter Grille

[Dann'sTheMan]

Wow :cool: Welcome to the brotherhood, the _serpent!

Absolutely gorgeous! Is the pewter grill similar to the cloth used on the Lonestar? Did you custom order it? or was it bought used? What kind of music do you play? :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

I'd love to have different coloring on the front grille. I'm not sure if I would like to change the black tolex... maybe to some cool wood :)

Anyway I asked about this from Finland's importer... The front panel where the logo is only a plate that is connected with for screws on my head... I asked if I could order that plate separately. The response was that it costs 300 euros which is the cost of whole custom order (for that money you get what wood and grille you want) ... well, it was too pricey to me. Have anyone else asked about this possibility... just ordering the front plate... I guess I would pay something like 50-70 euros :rolleyes:

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila
I'd love to have different coloring on the front grille. I'm not sure if I would like to change the black tolex... maybe to some cool wood :)

Anyway I asked about this from Finland's importer... The front panel where the logo is only a plate that is connected with for screws on my head... I asked if I could order that plate separately. The response was that it costs 300 euros which is the cost of whole custom order (for that money you get what wood and grille you want) ... well, it was too pricey to me. Have anyone else asked about this possibility... just ordering the front plate... I guess I would pay something like 50-70 euros :rolleyes:

Hi Tommi,

I've not asked... yet. I'd be interested in a new grill too (in tan) and keeping the black tolex. I don't think I would go through the European distributors though, because the cost gets crazy. I figured next time I was in LA, I'd see if I could swing by the Mesa outlet in Hollywood.

Ideally, we would be able to import one from a US supplier. Has any of the US brothers inquired about ordering a second grill? :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

I actually was quite surprised because the importer said that it isn't possible so easily. He said that if it would be possible, Mesa would drown into these small orders. Wouldn't that be nice extra business for Mesa?

If somebody has some first hand information about this please inform us...

BTW, I would probably go for the pewter grille :)

[the _serpent]

Im glad you like it :D
I got mine new as a custom order, well not my custom order, the store i use In the UK had 25 units imported for the sale in there stores across the UK. It cost the same as the 'Standard' version.:D

As for music I play.......well im eclectic, I play anything from classic rock, AC/DC,Led Zep and such, also im a fan of brit pop Stone Roses, and I like to play new stuff like Franz Ferdinand and The Killers.
Im working on my own songs, and after a few days with my new F50 im starting to get that elusive tone i have been looking for.

[JeffB]

Curious if anyone has run a MESA bottle Rocket into an F-series amp?

I don't use channel 2 by itself, instead preferring CH2+Contour with the gain backed off as my crunch sound, so I'm looking for a lead bost. I don't really care for the sound of my TS or SOD with it since it makes the amp take on a more british character, so I thought the Bottle Rocket may be a good idea to keep it sounding "mesa-ish"

Anyone?

[Tommi Inkila]

Hmm... I haven't tested the bottle rocket, but I know that V-Twin is very Mesaish... almost ended up with it + poweramp to be my setup.

Also, you could checkout the Visual Sound Jekyll&Hyde pedal, we changed few words about it few posts ago. I'm not sure if it will keep the tone Mesaish, though :rolleyes:

[LithiumZero]

I've been using a Bad Monkey in front of my F-50 head for a few months now. It's a very transparent pedal which makes the F-50 much more versatile for live use. I run the pedal as follows:

Bass = 3:00
High = cranked
gain = 12:00

Using these settings I can leave the Bad Monkey on util I want a clean sound. This setting gives the clean channel a really nice smooth overdrive which sounds very much like the clean channel does when you crank the gain and treble up. On the dirty side I keep the F-50 gain at around 10:30 with the highs and mids hanging right around 12:00 and the bass at around 9:30. On the dirt channel the Bad Monkey tightens up the amps distortion and pulls the "blanket" off my speaker cabinet. Keep in mind that cranking the highs on the Bad Monkey really doesn't add a ton of high end but rather pushes the output signal which hits the front end of the amp harder.

The bad monkey also works well as a clean boost in front of the Dirt channel. Just crank the level control and set everything else at 12:00. The only problem is that you can't use it in conjunction with your clean channel because the volume with the pedal on is so much louder than with it off. I actually prefer this setting for making the dirt channel scream but opt for the above settings which effectively gives me 4 really good channels.

The best part is that the Bad Monkey is only $39 and smokes a lot of the other OD pedals that I've tried. Damn, I better quit loafing on the job. :D

[UconnJack]

The Monkey strikes again! I'm diggin mine too...

[Dann'sTheMan]

I have a Mesa V-Twin pedal that I usually use with my Fender Princeton Chorus. I haven't really spent any serious time trying it in front of my F-50. The one time that I did, I remember thinking that I preferred the voicing of the amp without the additional pedal. I remember it sounding too compressed to my ears, but this could well be that I spent next to no time trying to find new settings for the Mesa + Mesa combination. The V-Twin is a great device, but it needs to be partnered carefully with the right amp. I should experiment more... :)

I do sometimes run a vintage MXR Dynacomp ('78 pots) as a boost in front of the F-50, thus turning the 3 channel MIDI setup that I described above into a pseudo 6 channel set-up. I also occasionally use the MXR as a compressor for clean sounds, but the older Dynacomps work particularly well as boosters as they have a high output for slamming an amp's front end (I learnt that my hero Dann Huff uses one a great deal in this way :cool: ).

I'm also potentially interested in the Bad Monkey that everyone seems to be raving about (love the clips of your band LithiumZero! :cool: ), even though I'm not really a stomp box kind a guy (at most the Dynacomp and a Vox Wah). Just need to investigate if they are as cheap in Rip Off Britain. :p

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

Yep, Bad Monkey is spreading... I didn't bought one yet, but I did order them local store so that I can give it a try... although I'm not sure do I really need it :rolleyes:

I bought a book that seems to be very interesting based on the first 20 pages I have read... The Mixing Engineer's Handbook by Bobby Owsinski. It has been written from nice perspective... it has some tips and "magic" tricks, but it also has interviews with about 20 famous mixers who tell their secrects... there you can find lots of good ideas and blend them into your way of thinking. Checkout if you are interested :)

[Glimpse]

Quick question and bump: How much are the F-50's going for in the US (new)?

[UconnJack]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan
I have a Mesa V-Twin pedal that I usually use with my Fender Princeton Chorus.
Andy.

Hey Andy, I used to run a v-twin in front of a PC also. What a great tone (I thought). Sometimes I miss that simple rig.

Glimpse, I think the F-50's are right around $1000 new.

[Glimpse]

Thanks UConn.

[UconnJack]

Originally posted by hal9000
I've used the XTL in front with all amp models running and it sounds ok, I much prefer to run the XTL (sans cab models) into the FX return if I'm only using the F-100 as a power amp.

Hal9000,

Hey, I'm experimenting with my XT live and the F-50. How do you set the output mode on the XT when running into your FX return, as mentioned above?

There's alot to learn on this POD.

Thanks
UJ

[markmann]

F-50 Brothers,

Well, I've had my F-50 for a few weeks now and I've come to the conclusion that I prefer to have my FX up front rather than in the loop. Actually, after many hours of crittical listening I think pedals sound better through this amp than with my Roctron processor. Of course this is just my opinion but it was the other way around with my last rig, so bye-bye processor and back to pedals. I don't use many, wah>chorus>delay>delay and ocasionally a drive for a third channel, so it's not a big deal.

One thing I miss though is not having the processor in the loop to attunuate volume before the power amp (thanks to Andy for that tip). I'm thinking now of making a simple attenuator. I can get a small project box from the local electronics store and mount a pot and a couple input jacks and I should be set. The box will be small enough to velcro to the back of the amp so that I can leave it there. Should work, right? If a volume pedal works I would think this would too. Does anyone know what the impedence is in the loop? I noticed that an Ernie Ball pedal has a 250k ohm pot but not sure if this is best for this application.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by UconnJack


Hal9000,

Hey, I'm experimenting with my XT live and the F-50. How do you set the output mode on the XT when running into your FX return, as mentioned above?

There's alot to learn on this POD.

Thanks
UJ I've used both stack/combo power amp and no cab/mic/air models and I prefer no cab, especially for FX only. To me, without the cab models the XTL is much more open.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
...One thing I miss though is not having the processor in the loop to attunuate volume before the power amp (thanks to Andy for that tip). I'm thinking now of making a simple attenuator. I can get a small project box from the local electronics store and mount a pot and a couple input jacks and I should be set. The box will be small enough to velcro to the back of the amp so that I can leave it there. Should work, right? If a volume pedal works I would think this would too. Does anyone know what the impedence is in the loop? I noticed that an Ernie Ball pedal has a 250k ohm pot but not sure if this is best for this application. Markmann, I made a similar device for solo boost that works very well in the F-series loop. IMO, you couldn’t tell the difference between attenuated and true bypass other than volume. I used a 25 kOhm surface mount pot connected in a voltage divider configuration. Since the FX loop is line level it is lower impedance compared to a guitar level input like a volume pedal, so 25 kOhm is appropriate. More than likely the output impedance of the loop is low (500-1k), and the return is high (~100k). My solo boost is a remote control (relay activated) true bypass, where normal mode is attenuation. If all you want to build is an adjustable attenuator you just need (2) ¼” TS jacks, (1) 25 kOhm leaded bulkhead pot, maybe a minimum volume resistor (500-1 kOhm) in the shunt leg (grounded side) of the pot, some wire, and a small enclosure (I recommend Hammond die-cast painted aluminum). Let me know if you need any help.

[yourguitarhero]

with my F-50 I find that while the rythyms are cool my leads seem to get lost int he mix slightly.

I'm thinking of getting an EQ to put in the loop - mid and volume boost style.

Any other tips and tricks?

[hal9000]

Originally posted by yourguitarhero
with my F-50 I find that while the rythyms are cool my leads seem to get lost int he mix slightly.

I'm thinking of getting an EQ to put in the loop - mid and volume boost style.

Any other tips and tricks? I’ve used solo boost in front, in the loop and as part of a wet/dry setup, but depending on what you need there are lots of options.

1) EQ up front, Mid to High-mid frown on the EQ in front of the amp. You won’t get any more volume, but you may notice that you don’t need it since the mids are more pronounced.
2) EQ in FX loop. Personally, I prefer not to use a non-line level device in the loop, but EQ can sound good. I would probably setup the EQ for a mid and volume drop smiley. If you adjust the amp to sound good with the mid dropped, when you bypass the EQ, you’ll get more volume and mids at the same time. Or, you could go the other way around, where the boost is during the solo, but be careful how much you boost since you can induce feedback and noise problems.
3) OD in front, Running the amp with slightly less gain for rhythm and using an OD will give you extra push and sustain.
4) When I don’t hook up my DIY solo boost I just use contour for solos. The level difference is great IMO to jump ahead of the band for a standout solo.

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
If all you want to build is an adjustable attenuator you just need (2) ¼” TS jacks, (1) 25 kOhm leaded bulkhead pot, maybe a minimum volume resistor (500-1 kOhm) in the shunt leg (grounded side) of the pot, some wire, and a small enclosure (I recommend Hammond die-cast painted aluminum). Let me know if you need any help. Thanks, that's exactly what I'm after but what's the purpose of the minimum vol resistor? I'm planning to attach the ground lug of the pot to the ground leads on the jacks so if I use a resistor where would I place it? Does it matter?

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
Thanks, that's exactly what I'm after but what's the purpose of the minimum vol resistor? I'm planning to attach the ground lug of the pot to the ground leads on the jacks so if I use a resistor where would I place it? Does it matter? You don't really need the resistor but it adds a level of fine control over the attenuation. I used another small 1k pot connected like a variable resistor in the ground leg of the pot so I could fine tune the attenuation without throwing off the main setting. It's just an added feature. In fact, since it is a pot, all the way off means that it isn't there anyway. This is more or less what it's going to look like.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/FXLoopAttenuator.jpg

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
You don't really need the resistor but it adds a level of fine control over the attenuation. I used another small 1k pot connected like a variable resistor in the ground leg of the pot so I could fine tune the attenuation without throwing off the main setting. It's just an added feature. In fact, since it is a pot, all the way off means that it isn't there anyway. This is more or less what it's going to look like.Interesting, I'll experiment with it. One more thing, I checked out some pots online but didn't see any leaded bulkhead pots.... what is a leaded bulkhead pot?

Thanks

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
Interesting, I'll experiment with it. One more thing, I checked out some pots online but didn't see any leaded bulkhead pots.... what is a leaded bulkhead pot?

Thanks They're also called panel mount, but that is only if you want to mount the pot external to the box. Grommets are the easiest to solder to, but you can also use leaded which are like the leads on a resistor or tabs for surface mount. Your design direction will determine the type of pot you need. This is a panel mount with solder lugs:

http://www.circuitspecialists.com/products/full/1378.jpg

I used a couple of trimmers like this:
http://www.circuitspecialists.com/products/full/1448.jpg

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
They're also called panel mount, but that is only if you want to mount the pot external to the box. Grommets are the easiest to solder to, but you can also use leaded which are like the leads on a resistor or tabs for surface mount. Your design direction will determine the type of pot you need. This is a panel mount with solder lugs: Hal, you are the man of many visuals... awesome! That clears it up, I just didn't know the terminology.

Thanks again.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by UconnJack


Hey Andy, I used to run a v-twin in front of a PC also. What a great tone (I thought). Sometimes I miss that simple rig.


I agree it's a gorgeously sweet tone, and the V-twin pairs particularly well with the Princeton Chorus. I still remember the feeling when I first heard this combination - I was on tour with a choir in Florida, and we were at the hire place sourcing gear. Wow! :p I've actually used this set up in front of 5000 people for a BBC TV recording at the Royal Albert Hall. It took me a long time to find a rig I liked more on both the clean and the dirty side - but hey, this thread might be a clue. :D

I still have this rig, and I sometimes use it for stripped down rehearsals and gigs. It has the added bonus that I've found some usable acoustic tones on the drive channel of the PC, so I can use one amplifier for my acoustic/electric Variax setup. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by markmann
F-50 Brothers,

Well, I've had my F-50 for a few weeks now and I've come to the conclusion that I prefer to have my FX up front rather than in the loop. Actually, after many hours of crittical listening I think pedals sound better through this amp than with my Roctron processor. Of course this is just my opinion but it was the other way around with my last rig, so bye-bye processor and back to pedals. I don't use many, wah>chorus>delay>delay and ocasionally a drive for a third channel, so it's not a big deal.

One thing I miss though is not having the processor in the loop to attunuate volume before the power amp (thanks to Andy for that tip). I'm thinking now of making a simple attenuator. I can get a small project box from the local electronics store and mount a pot and a couple input jacks and I should be set. The box will be small enough to velcro to the back of the amp so that I can leave it there. Should work, right? If a volume pedal works I would think this would too. Does anyone know what the impedence is in the loop? I noticed that an Ernie Ball pedal has a 250k ohm pot but not sure if this is best for this application.

Hi markmann,

You have the Intellifex, don't you? I'm intrigued to know why it doesn't seem to be working as well. I'm thinking about retiring my Zoom 9030, which works great, and replacing it with a G-Major. Have any of you tried the G-Major with the F-series?

Regarding the box, it seems like a good move. Have you considered making it footswitchable in a similar fashion to hal9000. That way, you can have your project box alonside your other pedals. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by yourguitarhero
with my F-50 I find that while the rythyms are cool my leads seem to get lost int he mix slightly.

I'm thinking of getting an EQ to put in the loop - mid and volume boost style.

Any other tips and tricks?

Hi yourguitarhero,

Are you using the Contour channel for your leads?

I tend to think of the Contour switch as a voicing switch. As you know, it switches in Boogies famous Graphic EQ circuitry in a pre-set 'V' configuration. As you would expect this scoops the tone, which may not be what you want for those lead moments, especially at higher volumes.

At higher volumes, I tend to use the Lead channel for leads, and the Contour channel for modern rhythm. I'd suggest experimenting along these lines. As you may already have worked out, in my MIDI switching setup, I can set the volumes of the Lead and Contour channels completely independently. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. Also be aware that there are some sweet mid-heavy Vox like tones from some strange EQ settings e.g. Bass:9 Mid:3 Treble:9 (o'clock). :cool:

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan
Have any of you tried the G-Major with the F-series?[/B]
Hello Andy!

I'm using the G-Major with my F-50 ... only downsides I've found are that the input/output levels on the G-Major are very sensitive so you have to be careful when setting those... well, at the moment I have both at 12 o'clock, so there's not much to remember... just have to check them before I start to play... G-Major can easily drive the effect loop too hard.

The mix of the effects loop have to be somewhere near full to get best results, but I guess that's a feature of F-50.

G-Major have very usable effects (compressor isn't that great). I think the best part in G-Major are great great great delays (dynamic delay) and spillover, if somebody hasn't come across with that term yet, it means that when you change preset you can still hear ie. the delays from the last preset playing... you can turn that off if you like, but I think it brings fluidity to live playing... there's no big caps between sounds.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Hi markmann,

You have the Intellifex, don't you? I'm intrigued to know why it doesn't seem to be working as well. I'm thinking about retiring my Zoom 9030, which works great, and replacing it with a G-Major. Have any of you tried the G-Major with the F-series?

Regarding the box, it seems like a good move. Have you considered making it footswitchable in a similar fashion to hal9000. That way, you can have your project box alonside your other pedals. :)

Big smiles,

Andy. Yes, it surpised me that I like the pedals more with the F-50, of course it's all very subjective. To my ears the pedals have more of an "in your face" sound as compared to the processor sound. It's a subtle difference when listening to myself playing but in a group setting the processor effects seem to get lost in the mix easier. On the upside I picked the pedals individually as opposed to buying a processor which always seems to be a compromise. I currently have three processors and like something different about each one. I like all of my pedals.

As for the volume box... I think once I set it I won't touch it again for that session so I'd really rather not have something else to trip over. Mounting it to the amp means one less thing to hook up and 30 feet less cable for the signal to travel. I don't need a lead boost because I've learned to use pick attack and guitar volume to control dynamics and the F-50 is VERY sensitive for that. I love the way this amp responds when I dig in and cleans up when I back off. Sweet.

Mark

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila

Hello Andy!

I'm using the G-Major with my F-50 ... only downsides I've found are that the input/output levels on the G-Major are very sensitive so you have to be careful when setting those... well, at the moment I have both at 12 o'clock, so there's not much to remember... just have to check them before I start to play... G-Major can easily drive the effect loop too hard.

The mix of the effects loop have to be somewhere near full to get best results, but I guess that's a feature of F-50.

G-Major have very usable effects (compressor isn't that great). I think the best part in G-Major are great great great delays (dynamic delay) and spillover, if somebody hasn't come across with that term yet, it means that when you change preset you can still hear ie. the delays from the last preset playing... you can turn that off if you like, but I think it brings fluidity to live playing... there's no big caps between sounds.

Hi Tommi,

Thanks for sharing your insight. I've just pulled the trigger on the G-Major, so it should be with me sometime next week. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Hi Tommi,

Thanks for sharing your insight. I've just pulled the trigger on the G-Major, so it should be with me sometime next week. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.
Cool 8)

Let me and rest of the brotherhood know how it sounds to your ears.

Welcome to G-Major league!

:D

BTW... I just made a realisation that you have FCB1010 so few thoughts on that... You can make those footpedals work, but when I tried FCB with G-Major there wasn't smoothness on those pedals... even using them as a volume pedal was somewhat hard because of that at least to me. Using them as whammy worked if you didn't try to get slow increase in pitch.

So if you're testing those pedals and don't find the end-results smooth, I believe that is just "a feature" on FCB, not a problem in the equipment.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by markmann
Yes, it surpised me that I like the pedals more with the F-50, of course it's all very subjective. To my ears the pedals have more of an "in your face" sound as compared to the processor sound. It's a subtle difference when listening to myself playing but in a group setting the processor effects seem to get lost in the mix easier. On the upside I picked the pedals individually as opposed to buying a processor which always seems to be a compromise. I currently have three processors and like something different about each one. I like all of my pedals.

As for the volume box... I think once I set it I won't touch it again for that session so I'd really rather not have something else to trip over. Mounting it to the amp means one less thing to hook up and 30 feet less cable for the signal to travel. I don't need a lead boost because I've learned to use pick attack and guitar volume to control dynamics and the F-50 is VERY sensitive for that. I love the way this amp responds when I dig in and cleans up when I back off. Sweet.

Mark

Hi Mark,

What are your other two processors? As you may have seen, I've just pulled the trigger on the G-Major, so I hope it will be a tonal improvement on my tired old Zoom 9030 (which indeed sounds very good) - even if it doesn't have all the features.

Your idea for the volume box seems well thought through, and I also wouldn't want to run such a long signal cable length just for the boost feature. I might be tempted to design in a remote footswitch jack, so that if I ever felt the need, I could run an external footswitch (which obviously would not change the signal path). Having said that, even as an EE major, I believe in the K.I.S.S. principle. :p

The fact that the F-50 is so responsive to the touch does give a fantastic amount of control from the guitar. The F-series brotherhood is spoilt for choice. :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila

Cool 8)

Let me and rest of the brotherhood know how it sounds to your ears.

Welcome to G-Major league!

:D

BTW... I just made a realisation that you have FCB1010 so few thoughts on that... You can make those footpedals work, but when I tried FCB with G-Major there wasn't smoothness on those pedals... even using them as a volume pedal was somewhat hard because of that at least to me. Using them as whammy worked if you didn't try to get slow increase in pitch.

So if you're testing those pedals and don't find the end-results smooth, I believe that is just "a feature" on FCB, not a problem in the equipment.

Hi Tommi,

Thanks for the heads up on the G-Major and FCB combination. I must admit, I hadn't come across any reported problems about the smoothness of the FCB's expression pedals. In fact I use them in my current setup for volume swells all the time.

I do know of reported problems with effect block toggling, but the more recent versions of the FCB firmware implement that feature. Indeed, I also toggle effect blocks in my Zoom 9030 all the time.

Thanks for the warning though, and I will check the expression pedal "smoothness" area carefully for "zipper" problems when the G-Major arrives. I consider myself officially welcomed to the G-Major League! :p

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Hi Tommi,

Thanks for the heads up on the G-Major and FCB combination. I must admit, I hadn't come across any reported problems about the smoothness of the FCB's expression pedals. In fact I use them in my current setup for volume swells all the time.

I do know of reported problems with effect block toggling, but the more recent versions of the FCB firmware implement that feature. Indeed, I also toggle effect blocks in my Zoom 9030 all the time.

Thanks for the warning though, and I will check the expression pedal "smoothness" area carefully for "zipper" problems when the G-Major arrives. I consider myself officially welcomed to the G-Major League! :p

Big smiles,

Andy.
No prob, bro and league-mate!

I really hope that there's no problems with those pedals anymore... I must add that my experiences with those problems are from 2002 or so, so those problems might be vanished by now... a fellow guitarist had the same problem with FCB/G-Major combination back then, though... so I guess I didn't have bad FCB-unit on testdrive.

Let me know how they work so I can update my perception of that combination.

Hear ya
:)

[Tommi Inkila]

Here's a nice link-site I found recently about mixing, production and stuff... I haven't checked everything, but this site is probably a good place to start when you're in need of information on this specific area.

http://theprojectstudiohandbook.com/directory.htm

[mentoneman]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7313319676&indexURL=0&photoDisplayType=2#ebayphotohosting

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by mentoneman
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7313319676&indexURL=0&photoDisplayType=2#ebayphotohosting

Very Cool :cool: - "denim leather" would have been an interesting combination with the wicker grill. You're a star, mentoneman! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Hi Mark,

What are your other two processors? As you may have seen, I've just pulled the trigger on the G-Major, so I hope it will be a tonal improvement on my tired old Zoom 9030 (which indeed sounds very good) - even if it doesn't have all the features.

Your idea for the volume box seems well thought through, and I also wouldn't want to run such a long signal cable length just for the boost feature. I might be tempted to design in a remote footswitch jack, so that if I ever felt the need, I could run an external footswitch (which obviously would not change the signal path). Having said that, even as an EE major, I believe in the K.I.S.S. principle. :p

The fact that the F-50 is so responsive to the touch does give a fantastic amount of control from the guitar. The F-series brotherhood is spoilt for choice. :D

Big smiles,

Andy. My other processors are Rocktron Replifex and Alesis Quadraverb. The Intellifex is the only one I used for live playing controlled by a Midi Mate FC. I liked that unit in particular because you can opt to keep the signal path all analog. I used a tube preamp and M/B 50-50 Power amp and that was my complete rig. Very simple and effective. If and when I needed something else I added a box out front. So why did I ditch that setup? In short I had plenty of programability but lacked on-the-spot tweakability. Also, I never quite got my signiture tone where I wanted it.

I finished my volume box and it works perfectly. It didn't occur to me until after my last post that you may have been thinking about a remote switch. Great idea but the KISS concept worked well for me. FYI, I used one 100k ohm audio taper pot and two short cables and it's totally tranparent. I'm still considering a hot plate but for now this will help tame the beast.

[hal9000]

Markmann, I'm glad the volume box worked out for you.

If you ever want to build one that is footswitchable, my design already incorporates this feature. By Using a 9V DPDT relay I either switch in the attenuation (no power default for the relay) or ground the gate of a FET using an external switch from Boss (FS-5L). The FET just allows current to flow through the Relay coil. So, I run 6" cables from FX send and return and my footswitch can be as far away as I want since it is not in the audio path. This is the reason I was considering mod’ing my F-100 footswitch to perform my solo boost and keep reverb always enabled.

Anyway, if you ever feel like tinkering let me know.

[mentoneman]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Very Cool :cool: - "denim leather" would have been an interesting combination with the wicker grill. You're a star, mentoneman! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

that's just something i spotted on the bay that i thought you folks would appreciate.

i recently told a friend that the F50 was the amp he should get, of all the amps on sale at GC.

i played it and it was really fun and the tones were solid. i liked it better than the lonestar and stilletto.

aloha:)

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
Markmann, I'm glad the volume box worked out for you.

If you ever want to build one that is footswitchable, my design already incorporates this feature. By Using a 9V DPDT relay I either switch in the attenuation (no power default for the relay) or ground the gate of a FET using an external switch from Boss (FS-5L). The FET just allows current to flow through the Relay coil. So, I run 6" cables from FX send and return and my footswitch can be as far away as I want since it is not in the audio path. This is the reason I was considering mod’ing my F-100 footswitch to perform my solo boost and keep reverb always enabled.

Anyway, if you ever feel like tinkering let me know. Thanks, I definitely appreciate that. As I'm sure you can tell I am no electrician but I do enjoy experimenting when the need arises. I guess I'm not doing too bad so far... I haven't electrocuted myself or burned the house down yet! The images you provided helped me and I was pleased when the box worked exactly how I intended it to. Once I get my setup ironed out I'll have a better idea of whether the box will be a permanent fixture and at that time I might consider a footswitch.

Also, here's one thing I discovered while experimenting: I used a volume pedal in front of the amp as well as in the loop before I actually made the box. When I did volume swells there is a completely different effect between the two methods (this should have been obvious but it wasn't).

Mark

[ode2no1]

is anyone using an f50 or f100 with single coil guitars? i use a strat and a tele and just sold my TSL. im seriously considering buying an f50...like tomorrow maybe. does it have a good amount of gain with single coils? can i get a nice fat rhythm tone? my marshall was a little bit too bright for me with my guitars....i mean i loved it for a long time, but ive recently grown tired of the marshall flavor.

[markmann]

Originally posted by ode2no1
is anyone using an f50 or f100 with single coil guitars? i use a strat and a tele and just sold my TSL. im seriously considering buying an f50...like tomorrow maybe. does it have a good amount of gain with single coils? can i get a nice fat rhythm tone? my marshall was a little bit too bright for me with my guitars....i mean i loved it for a long time, but ive recently grown tired of the marshall flavor. It just so happens that I was doing A/B comparison between my Gibby's and Strat last night through my F-50. To my ears the LP with standard 490 pups sounded best at higher gain settings. The ES446 hollow body with 57's wasn't too far behind although suffers from excessive feedback. The Strat with lace sensors was a distant third at higher gain but sounded best on the clean channel. Also, I have switches for coil options on the LP and when I played in single coil mode the tone was very bright. Single coil at bridge was harsh but single coil at neck was very good. That being said I think the F-50 has enough low end to crank in a fat sound with single coils but have yet to do that. If you wait I'll try it this weekend. Make sure you take your guitar with you and try it before you buy.

What guitars are you other guys using? I'm curious to know what else sounds good through the F-50. This amp seems to really like my Les Paul.

Mark

[hal9000]

Originally posted by ode2no1
is anyone using an f50 or f100 with single coil guitars? i use a strat and a tele and just sold my TSL. im seriously considering buying an f50...like tomorrow maybe. does it have a good amount of gain with single coils? can i get a nice fat rhythm tone? my marshall was a little bit too bright for me with my guitars....i mean i loved it for a long time, but ive recently grown tired of the marshall flavor. My American deluxe fat strat is my #1 and sounds great with my f-100. I usually run single coils in the clean channel and ‘buckers in the OD, but there are a few songs where I switch from clean to OD still using my middle sc. I really like single coils in the OD channel when going for tweed clean and bassman style crunch (low gain of course). As far as high gain, it's really just a preference that I use the 'bucker, because there are some unique tones to be had with single coils. For instance, when I play around with Brian May stuff, I automatically switch to the neck single coil to wail away and it sounds sweet.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000sAmericanDeluxeFatStrat.jpg

Check my sig or the start of this thread for audition settings.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by ode2no1
is anyone using an f50 or f100 with single coil guitars? i use a strat and a tele and just sold my TSL. im seriously considering buying an f50...like tomorrow maybe. does it have a good amount of gain with single coils? can i get a nice fat rhythm tone? my marshall was a little bit too bright for me with my guitars....i mean i loved it for a long time, but ive recently grown tired of the marshall flavor.

Hi ode2no1,

Thanks for the PM, and for posting your question. In my experience Mesas tend to favour HBs, but I was pleasantly surprised to find the F-series was an exception. It really is happy with both types of pick-up, and seeing as my No.1 guitar is a Charvel Strat, this worked in its favour when I chose my F-50 over the mighty Mark IV.

The amp does sound very different with single coils and HBs (unlike lesser amps), but there is plenty of gain on tap to get beautiful saturated yet articulate lead tones from lower output guitars. Now admittedly I have a JB Jnr pick up in the bridge of my strat, but its a very different sound to my PRS Custom. I also tend to use slightly different EQ settings with my Charvel, and I balance the Gain and Master Volume differently - I have no problems turning the Gain round to 4 o'clock or more with the Strat. :p

I would certainly recommend auditioning the amp and seeing if it can get the types of Radiohead and Muse tones that you are after with your guitars. Do take hal9000's audition settings with you, as the EQ behaves very differently to a Marshall. The voicing of the amp is also darker than Marshall so I think that will appeal too. :)

You may be interested to know which guitars were used in the clips in my sig:

Gain sound - Charvel Strat
Clean sound (Miked) - Charvel Strat
Clean sound (Direct) - Charvel Strat
Gain sound with HBs - PRS Custom 22
Crunch sound with HBs - PRS Custom 22
Gain sound (touch of delay at mixdown) - Charvel Strat
HB Gain sounds (delay & chorus at mixdown) - PRS Custom 22
Bluesy sound (delay at mixdown) - Charvel Strat
Triple Texture Guitars Revelation (5.4Mb) - Charvel Strat & Taylor 814BCE
"LA" Sounds (Clean & Lead) - PRS Custom 22
TV Video Clips - PRS Custom 22 & Taylor 814BCE
Orchestral Video Clips - Line6 Variax on Jazz clip; Charvel Strat on other
Modern Heavy Riffin' sound - PRS Custom 22

Big smiles,

Andy.

[ode2no1]

whoa...i wasnt expecting such detailed responses. thanks a lot guys. i actually went down to the mesa store to in hollywood 2 weeks ago because i was dying to try out a mark iv. i thought that was going to be my solution, but it just didnt have enough gain using an anderson telecaster. next i tried out the F-50 in combo form...and even the though volume was pretty low i could tell there was something about the amp. it sounded a little scooped, but im sure with the master up the mids would have been a lot more present. i could tell it had a decent amount of gain, but without turning it up i wasnt sure just how saturated it could be using single coils. anyway i think im gonna go for it. if i end up not liking it i can sell it and try something else. it just sucks...my TSL had every feature i'd want in an amp, but it just wasnt doing it for me anymore. the marv iv matches the TSL feature wise, but isnt saturated enough. anyway thanks again guys.

["sasquatch"]

i would also like to add that of all the guitars that i have played through my F50, a telecaster sounded best to me. the bridge pickup on ch2 is incredible! :eek: i have a G&L Tribute legacy with Dimarzio Virtual 2 set, which i am really digging. the pickups sound great. i like to get a real shimmery breakup on ch1 using my neck + middle pickup on my Legacy and crank everything....gain, treble, mids, bass. it sounds great. i, like dann's the man, like to crank the gain up for my single coils. i can also pretty much mail the tone for the lead work for Pearl Jam's "Nothing as it Seems" using my bridge pup on ch 2 contour. Crank the bass all the way and play with your treb and mids from 10:00 - 2:00. Right now, that is my favorite lead tone. it has this fat, warm bottom with harmonics galore on top. Pearl Jam has some of my favorite tones. If you guys have never heard 'nothing as it seems', you need to and pay attention to the lead. It is incredibly beautiful.

[jrc6]

Ode2no1,

The marshall's are much too bright & thin. I think you need to crank the DSL & TSL's to get a fuller sound. The F50 is similar. sounds buzzy at very low volumes, but once you reach 9 o clock on the master, it starts to fill out. I agree it is much darker than the Marshall's. I tend to crank the mids. If you still think it is too dark, you try an eq boost or try a brighter speaker.

In my original post, I mentioned that I installed an eminence screaming eagle in to the F50. Man, did it brighten things up. If made my humbuckers "twang," like a strat. Definitely got more of that "poppy," bell like tone. The american speakers also sound a lot fuller rounder tone, and lack that buzzy, nasal thing of the celestions.

I think single coils will work fine. The resale values of the mesa's are pretty decent. consider the f50

["sasquatch"]

Originally posted by jrc6
Ode2no1,

The marshall's are much too bright & thin. I think you need to crank the DSL & TSL's to get a fuller sound. The F50 is similar. sounds buzzy at very low volumes, but once you reach 9 o clock on the master, it starts to fill out. I agree it is much darker than the Marshall's. I tend to crank the mids. If you still think it is too dark, you try an eq boost or try a brighter speaker.

In my original post, I mentioned that I installed an eminence screaming eagle in to the F50. Man, did it brighten things up. If made my humbuckers "twang," like a strat. Definitely got more of that "poppy," bell like tone. The american speakers also sound a lot fuller rounder tone, and lack that buzzy, nasal thing of the celestions.

I think single coils will work fine. The resale values of the mesa's are pretty decent. consider the f50

could you post clips of the new speaker? i would love to hear some.

[Dann'sTheMan]

So my G-Major arrived yesterday, and I spent part of yesterday evening going through the pre-sets (typically overdone of course), and getting my Behringer FCB1010 working with it. It was straight forward, and the volume swells work smoothly. :p

Tonight, I hope to try creating some of my own patches and making sure that I can recreate my favourite sounds/patches from my old rig on this new beast. Oh, and I'll have to learn some material for a gig I have in Spain this weekend. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

Hi Andy!

Great news that the pedal works... hmm... maybe I should get one so that I could abuse the whammy pedal on the G-Major :D

I have a little bit different worries around here :) ... five exams and some paperwork for university and most of all, we are still 1,5 songs short for our upcoming album, we have imaginary deadline for ourselves, 1st of May... and another goal is to play our theme album from beginning to end on our next gig... that will be a spectacle :cool: :D

... and I have to also start compose some computer music for Assembly etc. So there's much to do here also :rolleyes: ... well, I work better under stress.

Anyway, already at this point, have a really nice trip to Spain and show them how the F sings!

[Tommi Inkila]

Hi Andy!

How your gig went? ... and what about the F and G-Major? Working like a charm?

:cool:

[the_chigga]

Hey guy's I am very interested in the F50, I have yet to try it out in the store. I've been looking for an amp for quite some time now and I've just stumbled upon this thread. I was wondering if you guys could help give me the 'thumbs up' on checking this amp out a bit more.
I play a PRS Mccarty and I've played it through Triple Recto, I found the distortion can get too "modern" and annoying. But I know that Mesa + PRS are just as good if not better than the Gibson + Marshall combo.
I play music from Iron Maiden, AC/DC, Santana to Metallica or even just some slightly distorted blues.
I was told by a friend of mine to check out the F50 as recommendation, I was wondering if the F50 would be the amp for me. Most of the sound clips I've heard here are not the time of tone I look for, can the F50 get the tones I look for? If it's not too much trouble could someone perhaps make a sound clip sampling those tones for me. (I know it's a lot to ask for.. but I really want to see what this amp can do).

I will be playing inside garages, sheds, churches, and my room. I was wondering if the amp can accomedate those places.

How is the clean tone? I've heard very good things about the clean tone of this amp, does it sound good when you strum chords?

Is the F50 a loud amp? I've heard it's very loud and I know tube amps are louder than SS amps?

Any replies would be great! Please help me answer these questions. Thank you!

Is it better to get the combo or get the F50 head and buy Avatar cab to go with it? (My bud has one so I know they are great cabs)

Thanks once again to everyone.

[No Soul]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Hey guy's I am very interested in the F50, I have yet to try it out in the store. I've been looking for an amp for quite some time now and I've just stumbled upon this thread. I was wondering if you guys could help give me the 'thumbs up' on checking this amp out a bit more.
I play a PRS Mccarty and I've played it through Triple Recto, I found the distortion can get too "modern" and annoying. But I know that Mesa + PRS are just as good if not better than the Gibson + Marshall combo.
I play music from Iron Maiden, AC/DC, Santana to Metallica or even just some slightly distorted blues.
I was told by a friend of mine to check out the F50 as recommendation, I was wondering if the F50 would be the amp for me. Most of the sound clips I've heard here are not the time of tone I look for, can the F50 get the tones I look for? If it's not too much trouble could someone perhaps make a sound clip sampling those tones for me. (I know it's a lot to ask for.. but I really want to see what this amp can do).

I will be playing inside garages, sheds, churches, and my room. I was wondering if the amp can accomedate those places.

How is the clean tone? I've heard very good things about the clean tone of this amp, does it sound good when you strum chords?

Is the F50 a loud amp? I've heard it's very loud and I know tube amps are louder than SS amps?

Any replies would be great! Please help me answer these questions. Thank you!

Is it better to get the combo or get the F50 head and buy Avatar cab to go with it? (My bud has one so I know they are great cabs)

Thanks once again to everyone.

Contrary to popular believe, the F-series CAN do modern tones (using its contour mode) but thats just one of its many hats.
Considering your guitar and the type of voicings you said you are looking for, you will DEFINITELY be able to find them in an F-series.

An F-50 should definitely be able to cover everything you listed. Clearly if you need more power, then the F-100 is where its at, but the F-50 is still capable of getting STUPID loud. Matter of fact you might even find it too loud for home use, considering its a tube amp and wont make the greatest of tones at low volumes (the F-100 is especially horrible in this respect, even when you cut down the power on it).

Are tube amps louder than solidstate amps?
Yes and no. The proper explanations for this are a bit technical (and I dont exactly remember them :D ) so I'll try to wing it.
Under the assumption both amps have the same wattage, NO one is not louder than the other. However, the reason why a 50w tube amp will seem louder is that as you turn up the volume and it begins to clip (distort) the wattage actually increases, sometimes easily doubling (or more) what the stock rating is listed as.

Is the clean channel good? If anybody doesent like these amps clean sounds its probably because they just dont like clean sounds to begin with. They are amazingly good.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila
Hi Andy!

How your gig went? ... and what about the F and G-Major? Working like a charm?

:cool:

Hi Tommi,

Thanks for asking, my friend! :) I got home at 1.30am this morning, so it's been a busy four days.

The gig went really well, in spite of the fact that I was sick for the first two days. I borrowed all of the equipment from a band that were also playing an item. The guitarist lent me his Godin LGT guitar and his rig was a SS Fender amp, and a pedalboard containing compressor, chorus and a couple of Carl Martin boost pedals. It sounded OK and so I used it (I had my flying rig with me just in case - POD and Behringer footcontroller), but I did really miss my F-50. :p

In fact, I was thinking of the F-50 + G-Major setup all the time. Last Wednesday, whilst I was meant to be learning material for Spain, I tried running my vintage Dynacomp in front of F-50/G-Major combo, and I spent the rest of the evening in tone heaven! All of the factory patches came alive, and all I could do was play. Couldn't stop thinking about it all weekend. :cool:

I've got another flying gig during the first weekend in May, this time in Berlin; before immediately flying on to Japan to visit the wife's folks for a few weeks. So I need to spend some quality time with the main rig before then, because these times away are pulling on my heart strings. :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[UconnJack]

Damn Dan, I'm just getting settled with my POD XTL and now you've got me gassing for the g-major! Thanks ;)

[the_chigga]

Thank you No Soul for the quick reply.
I've been reading here and it seems like a lot of the people here use "patchs" what are those? Do you guys run any EQ or anything effects into the F50 to make it sound better or would it sound good Raw?
I have a Digitech Hot Rod Distortion pedal that I don't want to have to use if I get the F50 unless for specific sound and the DigiTech MultiChorus pedal.

Would you guys recommend getting the F50 Combo or the head and get a 212 cab to make it louder? Thank you guys.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by UconnJack
Damn Dan, I'm just getting settled with my POD XTL and now you've got me gassing for the g-major! Thanks ;)

Hey brother UconnJack,

I've only spent two evenings so far with the G-Major. The first left me a little unmoved - I thought some of the effects like delay and reverb were better than my old Zoom box, but not others such as chorus and flange. The second night however, when I added the MXR Dynacomp to the mix, sent me reeling, and I honestly couldn't stop thinking about the tone all weekend. :p

I don't know how long it will take for me to learn how to consistently get the very best out of the G-Major - it may need careful partnering etc., but now that I've had a taste, my head is still spinning. Apologies for feeding the GAS my friend. :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Hey guy's I am very interested in the F50, I have yet to try it out in the store. I've been looking for an amp for quite some time now and I've just stumbled upon this thread. I was wondering if you guys could help give me the 'thumbs up' on checking this amp out a bit more.
I play a PRS Mccarty and I've played it through Triple Recto, I found the distortion can get too "modern" and annoying. But I know that Mesa + PRS are just as good if not better than the Gibson + Marshall combo.
I play music from Iron Maiden, AC/DC, Santana to Metallica or even just some slightly distorted blues.
I was told by a friend of mine to check out the F50 as recommendation, I was wondering if the F50 would be the amp for me. Most of the sound clips I've heard here are not the time of tone I look for, can the F50 get the tones I look for? If it's not too much trouble could someone perhaps make a sound clip sampling those tones for me. (I know it's a lot to ask for.. but I really want to see what this amp can do).

I will be playing inside garages, sheds, churches, and my room. I was wondering if the amp can accomedate those places.

How is the clean tone? I've heard very good things about the clean tone of this amp, does it sound good when you strum chords?

Is the F50 a loud amp? I've heard it's very loud and I know tube amps are louder than SS amps?

Any replies would be great! Please help me answer these questions. Thank you!

Is it better to get the combo or get the F50 head and buy Avatar cab to go with it? (My bud has one so I know they are great cabs)

Thanks once again to everyone.

Hi the_chigga,

Welcome to the F-series Lounge, and thanks for asking about the F-50. IMHO, the F-50 will do everything that you are looking for: it's great for both vintage and modern rock and metal sounds, has fantastic clean sounds, and although it ridiculously loud, it can also sound great at bedroom volumes. The "patches" that were being referred to earlier in the thread are from players that use their F-50 with a multi-FX unit, but rest assured the amp sounds great "raw".

There are F-series owners that are using their amps in all kinds of music. I've recorded a range of clips from clean to mean to give an idea of the versatility of the amp - if you haven't already done so, please check them out in my sig, bearing in mind I use a Charvel Strat and PRS Custom 22 - so I'm sure your McCarty would sound great. If you're looking for more heavier sounds, then I'd certainly recommend checking out the clips Tommi posted in his threads here (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=885151) and here (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=881058).

The F-50 is one of only a handful of amps to win the highest "Gold" accolade from UK Guitarist magazine. Check out the review here (http://www.mesaboogie.com/Reviews/guitarist-F-50/Guitarist_f-50.htm) :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. Combo or head is a choice that comes down to personal taste. I like the convenience of a combo - and Mesa's "widebody" cabinet format sounds really good. Heads give you the flexibility to use different speakers, and can create a fantastic wall of sound with a big 4x12 cab. :cool:

[the_chigga]

Hey Dann's TheMan,
Thank you for the insight and the quick reply.
I've been listening to the clips and I am seeing the tonal capabilities of this amp and I am pretty pleased with the variations of tones attainable through this amp, though I've yet to hear a very "Thrash" sounding tone, or perhaps just something close to Metallica where the highs cut through and theres a bit less mids.

If theres a clip out there showing these tones please let me know! I am eager to hear them.
I've heard most of the clips 3 times plus and it still amazes me.

I might get the combo just because it would be easier to carry and such.

Will I be able to achieve Strat+F50 tone with coil tapping on my Mccarty? It sounds amazing clean with the single coils in the strat.

THank you to everyone for the quick reply!

Charlie

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Hey Dann's TheMan,
Thank you for the insight and the quick reply.
I've been listening to the clips and I am seeing the tonal capabilities of this amp and I am pretty pleased with the variations of tones attainable through this amp, though I've yet to hear a very "Thrash" sounding tone, or perhaps just something close to Metallica where the highs cut through and theres a bit less mids.

If theres a clip out there showing these tones please let me know! I am eager to hear them.
I've heard most of the clips 3 times plus and it still amazes me.

I might get the combo just because it would be easier to carry and such.

Will I be able to achieve Strat+F50 tone with coil tapping on my Mccarty? It sounds amazing clean with the single coils in the strat.

THank you to everyone for the quick reply!

Charlie

Hey Charlie,

Regarding the Metallica clip request, I remember jrc6 posted a Metallica cover not too long ago. ...Ahh, here (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=880558) it is. :)

You can get some beautiful clean sounds imo, with a PRS. Whether they are "stratty" enough, comes down to personal tastes, but I've found you can increase the authenticity by rolling back the volume knob on the guitar a couple of notches. Did you check out the "Soon and Very Soon" clip in my TV Gig thread (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=800928)? This clean sound was recorded with my Custom 22 on a split coil setting (rotary position 9 I believe) - I likely had the volume maxed for increased PRS punch and presence. :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

Hi ya, Andy!

I'm glad everything turned out good in the end :) ... sickness and absence of F could have destroyed whole trip.

I haven't put much effort on tweaking the G-Major, because my schedule is very tight at the moment... well, I guess I now "have" to start tweak those settings, 'cause we got a special party gig on next Tuesday :) ... that will have more girls than boys, so maybe I should concentrate on tweaking my appearance, this time :cool:

PS. everybody have GAS, so why not share the feel :)

__

Hello the_chigga!

I'm pretty sure you can tweak those sounds you're after from the F... for example on my heavy clips I had the settings quite close to 12 o'clock, so there's much room to work with. Slightly less gain, add some treble and lose some middle and you're there. The cleans are really clean and pure, and if needed slightly overdriven. There shouldn't be any problems on finding the tone on that channel.

Andy made some good points considering the F. What comes to combo/head-question, I think you should consider it from the point of your needs and usage... for example I went for head, because it gives me easy way to play with different cabinets or on a gig where's a cab ready and I don't find necessary to bring my own. One reason is of course: the head is more METAL!
:D :cool: On the other hand if I would be gigging constantly and I would have to carry my equipment all the time, I would go for combo... so this question comes to what you prefer. :rolleyes:

Rok!

[the_chigga]

Thanks for the links Dann'sTheMan!
I've checked out a lot of them and I am very impressed.
I guess I am convinced. The rest is up to me going to the store and really actually playing one. I have very high expectations for this amp if I don't like it I won't know what to settle for!
I am going on the 26th of April to check one out I hope they have it at the store I am going to! I've seen other Mesas there just not sure if they still have the F50 there I saw last year...

Charlie

Keep me updated if theres new clips please!

[hal9000]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Thanks for the links Dann'sTheMan!
I've checked out a lot of them and I am very impressed.
I guess I am convinced. The rest is up to me going to the store and really actually playing one. I have very high expectations for this amp if I don't like it I won't know what to settle for!
I am going on the 26th of April to check one out I hope they have it at the store I am going to! I've seen other Mesas there just not sure if they still have the F50 there I saw last year...

Charlie

Keep me updated if theres new clips please! Charlie, give my audition settings a try and let me know if they helped you. Check my sig...

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
Charlie, give my audition settings a try and let me know if they helped you. Check my sig... I finally got around to checking your suggested settings. I purposely did not look at any settings when I first bought my amp because I didn't want to be infuenced and wanted to find my own way... low and behold my favorite settings are very close to your "audition settings." I also found those Marshall settings that someone posted.

Chigga,
I have the head version of the F-50 and love it. I use it with either one or two wide body cabinets. With two cabs at higher volume I can twist the cabs so that they aim in slightly different directions so that the sound has better dispersion. This is also a very handsome setup and obviously lends itself to many options (I'm gassing for those tan grill covers).

Also, I have coil tapping switches on my Les Paul and I've been using the neck PU in single mode a LOT. I get a very nice "Stratty" tone that sounds good clean and dirty. If I adjust the neck and bridge pickups just right I can bounce between the two and get an amazing array of tones... from one guitar!!!

[boonhogganbeck]

Also, I have coil tapping switches on my Les Paul and I've been using the neck PU in single mode a LOT. I get a very nice "Stratty" tone that sounds good clean and dirty. If I adjust the neck and bridge pickups just right I can bounce between the two and get an amazing array of tones... from one guitar!!!

Well, I finally broke down and bought a new F-50 combo. I really am enjoying it. My main guitar is a Tom Anderson Cobra, so I know what you mean about the spilt coil sound from a Les Paul, I get that sound from my Cobra. The amp is so dynamic and versatile, I'm real happy with it. I have to credit Dannstheman with influencing this purchase :) .

[markmann]

Originally posted by boonhogganbeck


Well, I finally broke down and bought a new F-50 combo. I really am enjoying it. My main guitar is a Tom Anderson Cobra, so I know what you mean about the spilt coil sound from a Les Paul, I get that sound from my Cobra. The amp is so dynamic and versatile, I'm real happy with it. I have to credit Dannstheman with influencing this purchase :) . Excellent.

I wonder how many sales Mesa/Boogie can credit to Andy? I think they should sponsor him or give him finders fees or something... that could go for Tommi as well, I thhink his clips have sold a few amp's.

[UconnJack]

I nominate Andy, (Dann's the Man) as president of the Mesa F-50/100 Fan Club - Brotherhood!

Tommi as VP and Hal9000 as Treasurer and Technical adviser. These guys are great, very knowledgable and helpful.

Andy should get an endorsement deal or commision from Mesa!

[Tommi Inkila]

My purchase of Mesa F50 should be credited to Andy! :) ... I second Andy as president of F-brotherhood!

Also, thanks Uconnjack for nominating me as VP :) ... great that my tips have been helpful.

I'm really glad if my clips have sold few amps :cool:

[Dann'sTheMan]

Hey Brothers,

Sincerest thanks for the namechecks and all those kind words. :o I'm lucky to be part of such a great brotherhood, and it really is one of equals, because I learn so much from everyone else. For example, tonight, I was playing around with one of JeffB's "Marshall" settings and had fun rolling off the treble entirely, mids at 3 o'clock, bass at 10.30 - with my Dynacomp as a boost up front, I was having lots of vintage "British" fun on the contour channel for hours. :p

boonhogganbeck, welcome to the brotherhood, and I'm thrilled that I had even a small part to play in bringing Mesa's stealth amp to your attention. The amp speaks for itself, and the number of diverse musicians who recognise this future classic from Randall Smith continues to grow. I hope you have as much fun with your F-50 as I do mine. :)

I would also like to take this opportunity to express appreciation for both hal9000 and Tommi Inkila, who have been rightly namechecked for doing such a fantastic job in championing the F-series and sharing their deep knowledge so freely. They are a credit to the forum and a blessing to brotherhood. Just as importantly however, just reading through this thread highlights just how much quality insight all of the brotherhood generously share! :cool:

Keep on rockin' in the free world, all my brothers! :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[the_chigga]

Just out of curiosity,
I've been hearing a lot of clips and I've been told that Mesa Boogie amps are fairly 'loose' sounding amps. I was wondering if there was anything, stomp boxes in particular out there that could tighten a sound.
How does the F50 do when it comes to pinch harmonics?
And the noise level when it's turned down? On another forum I was told the F50 puts out a lot of 'Hiss' and i was jus twondering if any of you guys have the same problem.

I would love to join this brotherhood.. but I don't have the amp yet :( YET hehehe

Charlie

[No Soul]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Just out of curiosity,
I've been hearing a lot of clips and I've been told that Mesa Boogie amps are fairly 'loose' sounding amps. I was wondering if there was anything, stomp boxes in particular out there that could tighten a sound.
How does the F50 do when it comes to pinch harmonics?
And the noise level when it's turned down? On another forum I was told the F50 puts out a lot of 'Hiss' and i was jus twondering if any of you guys have the same problem.

I would love to join this brotherhood.. but I don't have the amp yet :( YET hehehe

Charlie

Yes, the low end on Mesas tends to be a bit on the looser side, but I find the majority of people who make this complaint are people who demo'd amps at stores and dont know how to dial them in. So first things first, turn the bass down!

You could also try different tubes, JJ 6l6s have a much more static low end response than other 6l6 tubes, so that might be your answer. If you want a MUCH tighter low end, you could toss some El-34s in there, but that would also require some very slight modification of the amp as its biased is fixed.

Running a good graphic EQ is a good way to control the dynamics of your sound. Compression can help too, but this effect has a fairly high learning curve. Another easy way is to toss an overdrive pedal in front of your amp. This can be a pain though if you need to switch quickly from dirty to clean sounds.

I should say before you go looking into adding or changing things to your amp, get to learn it very well before you try to change things. Mesas in general are a bit harder to dial in that most other amps. The nice thing is once you understand the logic and dynamics behind one Mesa design you can easily apply the knowledge to other Mesa designs. I had a Recto for a few years before I had my F-100. I spent well over a year continually messing with my Recto set up, but when I got my F-series I knew exactly where to go.

Good luck!

[UconnJack]

My band just booked a couple of outdoor gigs and I'm thinking about picking up a speaker cabinet.

Any recommendations on speakers that would go well with my F-50? I plan on getting an 8ohm Avatar.

Thanks for any ideas.
UJ

[hal9000]

Originally posted by UconnJack
My band just booked a couple of outdoor gigs and I'm thinking about picking up a speaker cabinet.

Any recommendations on speakers that would go well with my F-50? I plan on getting an 8ohm Avatar.

Thanks for any ideas.
UJ I've been using my Avatar 2x12 closed back with vintage 30s for a while now and I think it sounds great. With the addition of a closed-back cab the F-100 has tons of bottom end, but still retains the airy clean from the 3/4 tuned-back of the combo. Personally, I think the 3/4 tuned back + closed-back is better then a single 4x12 as well as more portable.

[jrc6]

"I've been hearing a lot of clips and I've been told that Mesa Boogie amps are fairly 'loose' sounding amps."

Yeah, they aren't as sterile & tight sounding as other amps (i.e. peavy 5150, etc). I think randall smith was trying to get a "sax," sound out of his amps. I am primarily a lead player, and I love that thick, smooth, smokey tone of his amps. The F50 is no exception. It is exceptionally smooth, very organic.

"How does the F50 do when it comes to pinch harmonics?"

If you have the chops, anything is possible with any gear. If you tend to rely on compressors and junk like that, then pinch harmonic's will be more difficult. I plug into my F50 straight, no effects, nothing. I prefer the tone of the preamp & power tubes.

"And the noise level when it's turned down? "

I have 3 guitars, and they are all fairly quiet. In fact, my guitar with rio grand crunch box are incredibly quiet!!! There is a very soft hiss in the background, even when the amp & guitar volume are cranked! It is a very, very quiet amp. Perhaps the guys complaining of the hiss have some bad tubes. It is a quiet amp!

jrc

[the_chigga]

jrc6,
Thanks for the reply, I am really looking forward to auditioning this amp, I've printed out Hal9000's settings and will go try it out on tuesday!
woah!
I am excited!

Thanks to everyone.

Charlie

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by the_chigga
jrc6,
Thanks for the reply, I am really looking forward to auditioning this amp, I've printed out Hal9000's settings and will go try it out on tuesday!
woah!
I am excited!

Thanks to everyone.

Charlie

Good luck Charlie!

I hope things go well for you on Tuesday - you've made a wise move by taking along hal9000's audition settings. The amp can have rather unorthodox settings, especially when compared to say a Fender or a Marshall. Here are a couple of extra settings that I've been using a lot lately. I was introduced to both of these settings by my genuinely helpful F-series brothers. In o'clock settings:

doggage5050 on Lead channel:
G-9; T-9 M-3 B-9 MV-1 Hitting this setting with a boost into the front end gives an awesome thick Vox type crunch

JeffB on Contour channel:
G-1; T-9 M-3 B-10.30 MV-1 A sweet and versatile hot rodded Marshall tone (maybe a touch darker), especially with a boost.

One final tip, make sure you get the Master Volume above 9 o'clock when auditioning the Lead and Contour channels. The amp only starts to reveal its true voice with the Master Volume opened up a little. If it's too loud, ask if you can put a volume pedal in the FX loop (turn the parallel mix control to maximum - 90%) :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[the_chigga]

Hey guys,
I went into the store to check out the F50...
My buddy bought a Jackson RR5 it's so nice I played it so much today it was a lot of fun playing it and such.
When I played the F50.. I'm sorry to say but I forgot to bring Hal9000's settings! Ugh I am so mad my self. i tried getting the guy to dial it in for me and it sounded very muffled and muddy. He used the same setting on the Triple Recto and it sounded amazing. I was playing around with the F50 for a while trying to geth the tone I want but it wouldn't come out! It would come close but it'll still sound very muffled... I turned the treble to max to try to get it to open up but it didn't. I am not disappointed, just very angry at my self for not brinigng the settings along. I am going to give it another whirl and hopefully it comes out alright. I don't think they will let me turn the master pass 9. I was in the sound proof room and I had it up around 8 and it was tooooooooooooo loud.

i'm going to have to give it another try!

Thanks Dann's the Man for the tips i WILL remember to bring it this time...

[jrc6]

Recorded this a couple of weeks ago. I can't remember the settings. It is the clean channel. I believe the gain was around 9 o clock, pulled treble, treble noon, mid's about 10 o clock, bass 9 o clock. I used an eminence screaming eagle in the F50 open back. It is a brighter speaker. I think it gives the F50 more of a fender vibe. Anyway, a sample of speaker swap.

I will post my trials of the yellow jackets once I get my closed back cab up and running.

later,
j

[jrc6]

oops,

forgot to post the link. here it is:

http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000166004_000027492.mp3

["sasquatch"]

sounds great. where did you have the master volume? i would love to hear an OD clip with that speaker.

[Tommi Inkila]

Hello!

Few days gone and so many posts to read :) ... great clip jrc!

anyway, here's my first gig experience with F-50.

First all, overall the night was quite bad, lots of hassle, the car didn't accept the key and lots of pointless driving. F sounded great, but then 5 minutes before the gig I turned the power on and ... the fuse blew out. Luckily we found a replace although it was 2A instead of the original 1A. -> buy spare fuses -> buy surge protector

We felt that we didn't play our best yesterday and overall had quite lousy mood for the whole thing... small crowd who weren't very interactive... well, I'm not expecting that with our prog-music, but still :)

The F sounded good although I had problems hearing myself sometimes, on the other hand afterwards I was told that guitar was coming LOUD to the audience.

Last night was a little bit on the downside, but still it was a rewarding experience because it gave to me and us some good lessons on the road.

Rok on
:cool:

[jrc6]

hey doggage,

thanks. I will post an OD clip with that speaker. It is pretty bright, and thins out in the mid range. The low end womps pretty hard, however. It has a really scooped tone, lots of higs & lows, and not as much midrange. If you like scooping the mids for a metal sound, this would be a good speaker. I, on the other hand, prefer more mid range. I just installed a peavy sheffield, which is analagous to a vintage 30. I will post a clip with that speaker & some yellow jackets. Perhaps the F30 guys can comment on how close I can get my F50 to sound F30'ish.

Tommi, sorry to hear about your gig problems. You sound pretty optimistic despite the amp (fuse) problems, geting lost, and a non-reactive crowd. Glad to hear that F50 pulled through. It sounds like the sound man may have not mixed you well. Too loud on the pa, and not enough in the monitors. Better luck next time!

jrc

[phyrexia]

First off, best thread evar ;)

I've had my F50 for longer than I think there's been a buzz on this forum. I love it.

I have a Gibson LP Special with the 490R and the 498T. I go into a Boss V-Wah, an Aramat Effects Green Machine (TS808 clone), into a Big Muff (when the russian piece of shit works), into a Boss DD-20, into a BF-2 flanger.

I use channel two with the gain at 9:00 or less, treble at about 12:00, mids at 3:00 or 4:00, bass at 11:00 or 12:00. I use the tube screamer for some extra gain, for solos or just when it calls for it. I don't use the contour channel much but after reading some of this, i'm going to try it out next practice.

I love this amp like I said, but does anybody else hate the reverb? It sounds metallic and almost like it adds some trebley gain to me.

I think all my effects sound better in line with the guitar except for the flanger. It sounds unique in-line. It kinda funks with the harmonics and feedback in a way that I dig, but I think it gives a better flange sound in the loop. I haven't tried the delay pedal in the loop.

I have some songs that my band has recorded, but it's a PG48 mic straight into my computer so the recording quality's not very good. I think it's going to sound awesome when we go to the studio, though.

Has anyone actually done the mods and put some EL34s in this guy?

Victor

[No Soul]

Originally posted by phyrexia

Has anyone actually done the mods and put some EL34s in this guy?



Its not really much of a mod, just a bias trim. I thought about doing it, but the more I think about altering this amp to El34 tone the more I think it would ruin it. I could be wrong though.

Id rather mess arround with the preamp though.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by phyrexia
First off, best thread evar ;)

I've had my F50 for longer than I think there's been a buzz on this forum. I love it.

I have a Gibson LP Special with the 490R and the 498T. I go into a Boss V-Wah, an Aramat Effects Green Machine (TS808 clone), into a Big Muff (when the russian piece of shit works), into a Boss DD-20, into a BF-2 flanger.

I use channel two with the gain at 9:00 or less, treble at about 12:00, mids at 3:00 or 4:00, bass at 11:00 or 12:00. I use the tube screamer for some extra gain, for solos or just when it calls for it. I don't use the contour channel much but after reading some of this, i'm going to try it out next practice.

I love this amp like I said, but does anybody else hate the reverb? It sounds metallic and almost like it adds some trebley gain to me.

I think all my effects sound better in line with the guitar except for the flanger. It sounds unique in-line. It kinda funks with the harmonics and feedback in a way that I dig, but I think it gives a better flange sound in the loop. I haven't tried the delay pedal in the loop.

I have some songs that my band has recorded, but it's a PG48 mic straight into my computer so the recording quality's not very good. I think it's going to sound awesome when we go to the studio, though.

Has anyone actually done the mods and put some EL34s in this guy?

Victor

Hi Victor,

Welcome to the forum, and welcome to the brotherhood. It's a brotherhood that continues to grow, and it's great to see the appreciation for Mesa's stealth amps widen. It's cool that your recognised this gem before the amp became a hot topic. :p

I've had my F-50 for a couple of years now, and there are a few owners here that have owned theirs for longer. In that time, I've seen the F-series' respect grow on the forum, and many have been impressed by its clean, break-up, blues, lead, and lately the metal sounds have been creating a buzz - thanks to the talents of some of my F-series brothers. :cool:

Please do feel free to share your recordings. What kind of music do you play with your band Victor? :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. I know what you mean about the reverb. It's not as lush as a Fender circuit, but I've generally found it to be not only useable, but actually good at ensuring that my tone doesn't disappear in the mix. My Fender amp's reverb, whilst sounding great in isolation, has a much greater tendency to swamp out the tone - just my observation. :)

[phyrexia]

Well sometimes I'll use the reverb very lightly with distortion. I stopped recently for whatever reason.

One thing I forgot to mention is that i thought on channel two the F50 isn't really responsive to how hard you're playing, unless the gain was way down.

My band is..."Hard Rock", ok, how's that for general? It's darker, definitely. It's not really metal but there's some metal in there, too.

Victor

[No Soul]

Originally posted by phyrexia
One thing I forgot to mention is that i thought on channel two the F50 isn't really responsive to how hard you're playing, unless the gain was way down.




Thats going to depend on howmuch gain you have dialed in. The heavier the gain the less dynamic your sound becomes, thats true of all tube amps.

Also, the kind of pickups you use can really effect that as well.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan
The amp does sound very different with single coils and HBs (unlike lesser amps), but there is plenty of gain on tap to get beautiful saturated yet articulate lead tones from lower output guitars. Now admittedly I have a JB Jnr pick up in the bridge of my strat, but its a very different sound to my PRS Custom.Andy, can you elaborate a little more on the difference between the tone of your PRS and the JB jnr? Actually, I'd welcome responses from the entire brotherhood on pickups that sound good with the F-50.

In previous posts I've mentioned that I have been experimenting heavily with the F-50 since I bought it in March. I've pretty much zero'd in on amp tones I like but I'm not satisfied with regard to single coil tone yet and I'm thinking that I just don't have the right pickups.

I have several guitars, all but one have HB's. My main guitar is a LP with 490R & 490T wired for coil tapping. The 490T in bridge position sounds awesome in HB mode but sounds harsh in single coil mode. The 490R sounds very good in neck position with both HB and single coil mode and I actually prefer the single coil sound of the neck P/U.

Here's how I've been using the LP: Neck p/u in single coil mode for clean and bridge p/u in HB mode for dirt.

Here's my dilema:
My #2 guitar is a Deluxe Strat Plus with lace sensor pup's. IMO none of these sound good with the F-50 but I love the guitar so I'd like to swap out the entire set to something that will work. I'd like to get a more traditional "Strat" sound from the neck and middle position with nice spanky tone but can also handle some breakup if needed. The current blue lace sensor is way too dark and muddy for me.

Next, the current red lace sensor at bridge is to harsh in general and IMO does a poor job with distortion at any level and also poor with clean. My main objective is to achieve a nice thick tight single coil distortion at the bridge that's not too dark to be used mostly for rock and blues... not metal. would be nice if it also had a good clean tone but this is a secondary requirement.

FYI, my bridge p/u cavity is not routed for a side-by-side HB.

Can you guys give me some suggestions for replacement pup's for my Strat based on my explanation above? I know I'm asking a lot here so just answer what you can... the more detail the better.

Thanks a lot,

Mark

[UconnJack]

Check out the Fralin's, IMO they're the best Strat tone pick-ups available. http://www.fralinpickups.com/stratstyle.asp

However, I'm not sure you want to go thru that expense if your happy with your strat in other amps. I know Hal9000 uses a strat with his F100, but I don't really like my strat and F-50 combination. It's pretty good on the clean channel, but not so good on the drive channel (IMO), and I have decent SD's in my strat.

My F-50 sounds best with my Les Paul.

My strat sounds best with my Carr Rambler.

My Les Paul sounds great with everthing.

Hope this helps.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
…Here's my dilema:
My #2 guitar is a Deluxe Strat Plus with lace sensor pup's. IMO none of these sound good with the F-50 but I love the guitar so I'd like to swap out the entire set to something that will work. I'd like to get a more traditional "Strat" sound from the neck and middle position with nice spanky tone but can also handle some breakup if needed. The current blue lace sensor is way too dark and muddy for me.
…
Thanks a lot,

Mark Let me just explain what I use and see if you have any questions. My Fender American Deluxe fat strat has vintage noiseless single coils and a Fender DH-1 humbucker. The vintage noiseless pups sound similar to the ’57 pups in my singer’s ’57 reissue, with no noise. My other guitar has a 59’ neck and JB at the bridge and both sound great, but they are in a mahogany guitar. For a humbucker in the bridge, there are lots of single coil sized HBs, but I would think you’d want a darker one that a JB junior since your guitar is bright already.

[jrc6]

If you want a vintage sound, +1 for the Fralin's.

However, if you want an aggressive, though somewhat vintage smooth sound, you have to check out the Rio Grande Muy Grande single coil pick up. Perhaps you can install a Muy grande in the bridge, and a fralin in the middle & neck. I think this will offer the best of both worlds. The Muy grande will sound excellent for the distorted tones, and the fralins great for the clean tones.

j

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
Let me just explain what I use and see if you have any questions. My Fender American Deluxe fat strat has vintage noiseless single coils and a Fender DH-1 humbucker. The vintage noiseless pups sound similar to the ’57 pups in my singer’s ’57 reissue, with no noise. My other guitar has a 59’ neck and JB at the bridge and both sound great, but they are in a mahogany guitar. For a humbucker in the bridge, there are lots of single coil sized HBs, but I would think you’d want a darker one that a JB junior since your guitar is bright already. Sounds like you're recommending the vintage noisless for neck and middle, correct? My Strat has an alder body and rosewood fretboard so you're probably right about the JB being too bright for me.

Thanks

[markmann]

Originally posted by jrc6
If you want a vintage sound, +1 for the Fralin's.

However, if you want an aggressive, though somewhat vintage smooth sound, you have to check out the Rio Grande Muy Grande single coil pick up. Perhaps you can install a Muy grande in the bridge, and a fralin in the middle & neck. I think this will offer the best of both worlds. The Muy grande will sound excellent for the distorted tones, and the fralins great for the clean tones.

j jrc6, which Fralin model are you refering to? Do you have these in a guitar and if so how do they react with the F-50? I've heard good things about Rio Grand but I know nothing about the Fralin's.

Does anyone have experience with Bill Lawrence pup's? There are some really good reviews on the 280's and 290's which are supposedly noisless and have a good traditional Strat tone. Not a bad price either...

thanks,

Mark

[Locky]

So I've added a Boss GT3 to the front of my amp for effects and tone colouring, while still using my amp for clean tones and distortion tones. I must say that the signal buffering of the GT3 actually made my amp sparkle a little more.

I also installed an EMG 85 in the bridge postion of my EC 300 and it really gives me the distortion tone I've been searching for. I think Mesa's and EMG's compliment each other quite well.

I recently bought a Peavey White Torex Classic 50, to use as a 212 cab (because it was way cheaper then buying a 212 cab) I'll let you know how it turns after next rehearsal.

[Dann'sTheMan]

I've always been a fan of stacked humbucker noiseless single-coil-sized pick ups. My Charvel Strat came stock with four such pickups, and when I decided to upgrade them, I had a great template to work from.

As many of you know, I'm a huge fan of session maestro, Dann Huff - hence my moniker. He's long been associated with strats (although there was a period in the early nineties where he was playing a maple fingerboard PRS Custom), and for many years, he's been using a signature Tyler Strat (see here (http://www.tylerguitars.com/huff_classic.htm)):

http://www.tylerguitars.com/images/Classic-Huff-Body-web-6.jpg

Dann's signature model is a rosewood fingerboard strat with two Seymour Duncan Classic Stacks and a Jeff Beck HB. Guess what I ended up with in my rosewood fingerboard Charvel strat? Two Seymour Duncan Classic Stacks and a JB Jnr in the bridge (plus a Duckbucker in the fourth pick up slot).

Classic Stacks have been all over recordings out of Nashville for well over a decade - probably closer to two, and they sound great. They have the woody quality that I like in stacked humbucker designs, and yet they also have alot of that characteristic single coil snap.

The JB Jnr pick up sounds fantastic in my strat. It's doesn't have as much output as the Dragon IIs in my PRS, and the mids whilst thick, are not as congested as full-sized HBs. The resultant tone is particularly articulate when recorded, and it also sounds good with a clean sound dialled. The JB Jnr. doesn't saturate the amp as easily as the Dragon IIs, but because it stays articulate, you can pump up the gain on the F-series, and it doesn't get muddy. There's a piccie of "Baby", my trusty Charvel Strat here: http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/andrew_kydd/detail?.dir=8f46&.dnm=42be.jpg&.src=ph

I highly recommend both the Seymour Duncan Classic Stacks and the JB Jnr pickups in a Strat. My Strat is ash-bodied, and I believe the Tyler model is alder-bodied so I'd say they work with both tonewoods. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. Another pickup that I've heard great things about are Kinmans.

[markmann]

Originally posted by UconnJack
Check out the Fralin's, IMO they're the best Strat tone pick-ups available. http://www.fralinpickups.com/stratstyle.asp

However, I'm not sure you want to go thru that expense if your happy with your strat in other amps. I know Hal9000 uses a strat with his F100, but I don't really like my strat and F-50 combination. It's pretty good on the clean channel, but not so good on the drive channel (IMO), and I have decent SD's in my strat.

My F-50 sounds best with my Les Paul.

My strat sounds best with my Carr Rambler.

My Les Paul sounds great with everthing.

Hope this helps. UconnJack, I don't know how I did it but i totally missed your post earlier... sorry man, hope you didn't think I was ignoring you. Anyway, I've been unhappy with the Lace Sensors for a while now so the fact that they sound like crap with the F-50 is another excuse to give them the heave-ho. Like I said though I like everything else about the guitar so replacing the pup's is no biggie. Obviously you have come to a similar conclusion as me and is why I've come to the brotherhood for assistance. I'm sure there is a set of noisless single coils out there with the F-50's name on them and my quest is to find them.

Thanks,

Mark

[markmann]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan
I've always been a fan of stacked humbucker noiseless single-coil-sized pick ups. My Charvel Strat came stock with four such pickups, and when I decided to upgrade them, I had a great template to work from.

As many of you know, I'm a huge fan of session maestro, Dann Huff - hence my moniker. He's long been associated with strats (although there was a period in the early nineties where he was playing a maple fingerboard PRS Custom), and for many years, he's been using a signature Tyler Strat (see here (http://www.tylerguitars.com/huff_classic.htm)):

http://www.tylerguitars.com/images/Classic-Huff-Body-web-6.jpg

Dann's signature model is a rosewood fingerboard strat with two Seymour Duncan Classic Stacks and a Jeff Beck HB. Guess what I ended up with in my rosewood fingerboard Charvel strat? Two Seymour Duncan Classic Stacks and a JB Jnr in the bridge (plus a Duckbucker in the fourth pick up slot).

Classic Stacks have been all over recordings out of Nashville for well over a decade - probably closer to two, and they sound great. They have the woody quality that I like in stacked humbucker designs, and yet they also have alot of that characteristic single coil snap.

The JB Jnr pick up sounds fantastic in my strat. It's doesn't have as much output as the Dragon IIs in my PRS, and the mids whilst thick, are not as congested as full-sized HBs. The resultant tone is particularly articulate when recorded, and it also sounds good with a clean sound dialled. The JB Jnr. doesn't saturate the amp as easily as the Dragon IIs, but because it stays articulate, you can pump up the gain on the F-series, and it doesn't get muddy. There's a piccie of "Baby", my trusty Charvel Strat here: http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/andrew_kydd/detail?.dir=8f46&.dnm=42be.jpg&.src=ph

I highly recommend both the Seymour Duncan Classic Stacks and the JB Jnr pickups in a Strat. My Strat is ash-bodied, and I believe the Tyler model is alder-bodied so I'd say they work with both tonewoods. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. Another pickup that I've heard great things about are Kinmans. Andy, the fact that you endorse the Duncan's will mean that they will go to the top of my consideration list. I'm not trying to be a bum kisser, I say this because IMO every piece of advise that you've given in many posts seems to be spot-on.

Your "baby" is very nice, the combo of the sunburst and pearloid looks sweet. Can you send it to me so that I can check it out? (I wish). The fact that the single coil setting on my LP sounds so good is what has given me the inspiration to seek out new pup's for my Strat. Obviously Hal9000 is happy with his Strat tones but I get the impression without hearing his music that he's into a heavier tone than I am? I don't mind bright as much as I do bright and harsh like what I'm getting now from my red lace sensor. And like I mentioned before, the blue at the neck is too bassy and muddy for me but the silver in the middle is almost passable.

Thanks,

Mark

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
... Obviously Hal9000 is happy with his Strat tones but I get the impression without hearing his music that he's into a heavier tone than I am? I don't mind bright as much as I do bright and harsh like what I'm getting now from my red lace sensor. And like I mentioned before, the blue at the neck is too bassy and muddy for me but the silver in the middle is almost passable.

Thanks,

Mark I'm really across the board as far as what I like and play. Everything I play in my band in standard tuning is with the strat, but the heavier stuff is with my ESP H-1000 (JB in bridge). I play everything from shimmering clean including clean solos to modern stuff, which is why the F is the ticket for me! The HB in my strat is actually medium output and compliments the bright guitar well, although my recommendation is really for the vintage noiseless set of singles that I use. I don't have any experience with single-coil-sized HBs so I will of course defer to Andy on that one. :)

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
I'm really across the board as far as what I like and play. Everything I play in my band in standard tuning is with the strat, but the heavier stuff is with my ESP H-1000 (JB in bridge). I play everything from shimmering clean including clean solos to modern stuff, which is why the F is the ticket for me! The HB in my strat is actually medium output and compliments the bright guitar well, although my recommendation is really for the vintage noiseless set of singles that I use. I don't have any experience with single-coil-sized HBs so I will of course defer to Andy on that one. :) That's sort of what I figured.

I wish I could hear some of your tunes. I went to your website but when I try to access the mp3 links I get a "page not found" error.

Thanks,

Mark

[No Soul]

my Recto is on thin ice.

I was dialing in some recording guitar tones for my metal band today. We had planned to use single rectos for the all the high gain stuff, and my F-100 combo for cleans. We also had 3 other cabs to choose from, a horizontal Recto 2x12 cab, a verticle Recto 2x12 cab, and a Marshall 1960a 4x12.

After trying a plethora of different mic set ups and speaker combinations with the recto, I decided to let the F-100 toss its hat in the ring for our distortion sounds. Without much dialing, changing cabs, or doing fancy mic tricks it automaticaly sounded better. Just as heavy and agressive but much smoother and more articulate.

Over all the F-100 using its own 3/4 back cab won out against all others.

If you want more details, I wrote a longer version on the Mesa Boogie board

click here to read (http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?p=3946#3946)

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
That's sort of what I figured.

I wish I could hear some of your tunes. I went to your website but when I try to access the mp3 links I get a "page not found" error.

Thanks,

Mark We're working on a new demo now, so hopefully I'll be able to get some tracks up here eventually.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
That's sort of what I figured.

I wish I could hear some of your tunes. I went to your website but when I try to access the mp3 links I get a "page not found" error.

Thanks,

Mark I do have this one demo that I did for a new song so it would be easier to teach it to the band. Forget about the tone and sloppy playing, this was quick and dirty through my old POD 2.0 and ESP H-1000. The bass was my Washburn XB-400.

Afraid Dave Demo New (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000170627_000010983_proj.mp3)

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
I do have this one demo that I did for a new song so it would be easier to teach it to the band. Forget about the tone and sloppy playing, this was quick and dirty through my old POD 2.0 and ESP H-1000. The bass was my Washburn XB-400.

Afraid Dave Demo New (http://www.digitalsoundplanet.com/Members/000170627_000010983_proj.mp3) That tune is very, very cool and much different than I expected. You just can't imagine what someone's playing is like until you actually hear something. I love the way you whip the guitar part into a frenzy about 3/4 of the way through after the clean bit... very nicely done and good job of keeping the melody from getting repititious. Your demo ROCKS even without drums and with steril sounding gear... man, what that would sound like with the F-50...

Thanks, I enjoyed that very much.

Mark

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
That tune is very, very cool and much different than I expected. You just can't imagine what someone's playing is like until you actually hear something. I love the way you whip the guitar part into a frenzy about 3/4 of the way through after the clean bit... very nicely done and good job of keeping the melody from getting repititious. Your demo ROCKS even without drums and with steril sounding gear... man, what that would sound like with the F-50...

Thanks, I enjoyed that very much.

Mark Thanks a lot! :) I 'm humbled that you liked it so much.

You're actually the only person so far to comment outside of the band on this one. The demo itself isn't so much a departure from our normal sound, since I write about half of the songs independently, but the "swing feel" is certainly different.

[jrc6]

"jrc6, which Fralin model are you refering to? Do you have these in a guitar and if so how do they react with the F-50? "

Mark,

Hey! Yeah, my local guitar dealer has a strat with Lindy Fralin Real 54 single coil pick ups. They are real vintage sounding. They are very clear. If you want a vintage sound, these will get em for you. I played them through a fender pro reverb. I didn't get a chance to play through my F50. I imagine they will sound very similar. It is very clean. Great for Jazz, country, blues. I think you will dig em. Good luck on your search for tone!

jrc

[markmann]

Originally posted by jrc6
"jrc6, which Fralin model are you refering to? Do you have these in a guitar and if so how do they react with the F-50? "

Mark,

Hey! Yeah, my local guitar dealer has a strat with Lindy Fralin Real 54 single coil pick ups. They are real vintage sounding. They are very clear. If you want a vintage sound, these will get em for you. I played them through a fender pro reverb. I didn't get a chance to play through my F50. I imagine they will sound very similar. It is very clean. Great for Jazz, country, blues. I think you will dig em. Good luck on your search for tone!

jrc I wish I had a way to hear how they sound... tone is such a subjective thing. I've been hearing lots of good things about the Fralin's since I've been asking around. It seems like Fralin and Kinman are the names that I keep hearing pop up when the subject of traditional Strat tone is asked about. I'm not sure if I've got this strait but I read that Fralin doesn't make a noisless model?

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
Thanks a lot! :) I 'm humbled that you liked it so much.

You're actually the only person so far to comment outside of the band on this one. The demo itself isn't so much a departure from our normal sound, since I write about half of the songs independently, but the "swing feel" is certainly different. I listened to it twice and couldn't get it out of my head for a while.

FYI, I stopped at a music store today and was able to plug an American Fat Strat into a F-50 and man I had some fun. No wonder you dig that axe... it sounded great. I dialed up my typical settings on the F-50 and it took me only a few seconds to tweak the Strat and I was in tone heaven. Every position sounds good; 1-4 I used the clean channel and the bridge I used for channel 2. The bridge pickup was nice and tight and the 1-4 had a nice variety of well voiced Strat tones. Not exactly like traditional Strat singles but actually just as usable for what I do. I liked it so much that I'm tempted to snag one. If my pickup search doesn't yeild something as good I will.

Thanks,

Mark

[LithiumZero]

Thought you might want to spend too much on one of Dann Huff's amps that is for sale over on The Gear Page. Here's the link:

http://thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?threadid=81635

Wow, that's a lot of cash for a modded 5150!

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by markmann
Andy, the fact that you endorse the Duncan's will mean that they will go to the top of my consideration list. I'm not trying to be a bum kisser, I say this because IMO every piece of advise that you've given in many posts seems to be spot-on.

Your "baby" is very nice, the combo of the sunburst and pearloid looks sweet. Can you send it to me so that I can check it out? (I wish). The fact that the single coil setting on my LP sounds so good is what has given me the inspiration to seek out new pup's for my Strat. Obviously Hal9000 is happy with his Strat tones but I get the impression without hearing his music that he's into a heavier tone than I am? I don't mind bright as much as I do bright and harsh like what I'm getting now from my red lace sensor. And like I mentioned before, the blue at the neck is too bassy and muddy for me but the silver in the middle is almost passable.

Thanks,

Mark

Hey Mark,

I'm honoured that you would lend such weight to my subjective opinion :o but I'm even more thrilled that our brotherhood is one of honest, respectful and informed information exchange - if only the rest of the internet were like this. :p

"Baby" is gorgeous - there's my subjective opinion again. :D You're more than welcome to check her out, but I suspect it'll have to wait until you or I are in the other's neck of the woods. If you're ever in the UK, then we should certainly try to meet up! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. hal9000, sweet clip - lots of fresh musical ideas. Very cool - thumbs up! :cool:

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by No Soul
my Recto is on thin ice.

I was dialing in some recording guitar tones for my metal band today. We had planned to use single rectos for the all the high gain stuff, and my F-100 combo for cleans. We also had 3 other cabs to choose from, a horizontal Recto 2x12 cab, a verticle Recto 2x12 cab, and a Marshall 1960a 4x12.

After trying a plethora of different mic set ups and speaker combinations with the recto, I decided to let the F-100 toss its hat in the ring for our distortion sounds. Without much dialing, changing cabs, or doing fancy mic tricks it automaticaly sounded better. Just as heavy and agressive but much smoother and more articulate.

Over all the F-100 using its own 3/4 back cab won out against all others.

If you want more details, I wrote a longer version on the Mesa Boogie board

click here to read (http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?p=3946#3946)

What a cool experience - thanks for sharing! You should copy and paste the full length version into this thread - I've no idea which of the two threads will survive the longest, but this will always be interesting reading! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by LithiumZero
Thought you might want to spend too much on one of Dann Huff's amps that is for sale over on The Gear Page. Here's the link:

http://thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?threadid=81635

Wow, that's a lot of cash for a modded 5150!

What a fantastic find! Thanks for alerting me :cool: Over here in rip-off Britain, that price doesn't seem too scary to me. I must admit that I am tempted, but I'm wary of the hassle of importing a US amp.

I also need to watch the cash flow at the moment - one of the reasons for the delay in my replies lately, is that I've been flying the family (of four) all over the place. I've been doing some gospel gigs in Germany all weekend - amazing time and response from the audiences. I left Germany Monday morning and I've literally just arrived in Japan, where I'm visiting my wife's folks, and taking a vacation over the next couple of weeks. Here are a few pics of me from the outdoor gig on Saturday afternoon at Charlottenberg Castle in Berlin:

http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/andrew_kydd/detail?.dir=8f46&.dnm=8f13.jpg&.src=ph
http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/andrew_kydd/detail?.dir=8f46&.dnm=d683.jpg&.src=ph
http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/andrew_kydd/detail?.dir=8f46&.dnm=a750.jpg&.src=ph

FYI, I used my flying rig (Behringer FCB1010 -> POD 2.0 -> PA) because it fits in a suitcase. :p

Big smiles,

Andy,

[Locky]

Anyone experiemented with beam blockers on there F-series amps. I find the C90 has a rather harsh center beam that i'd like to attenuate a bit.

[the_chigga]

Hey guys!
I've been away for the past few weeks and I had another chance to go check out the F50.

I got the guy at the store to dial it in and I also brough Hal9000's settings with me. I trying to made it less muddy than it was but I couldn't do it! I was very dissappointed with the way the distortion sounded but I will tell you one thing, this amp has one of the nicest clean tones you will ever hear in an amp like this.

I did play the Triple Recto again and again, it has the sound I am looking for, perhaps it needs a bit of coutour but it sounded amazing. too bad it can't do cleans like the F50.. :(

my search continues for another amp.

Charlie

[Locky]

Low volumes are not this amps bread and butter. Not to say that they suck, but there are other amps that do lower volume with more clarity. Thing amp is a gigging amp to me. Once you crank it the distortion is so smooth and clear. If you are into metal you will probably want to exclusively use the contour setting on the distortion channel. Anyways goodluck with the search.

["sasquatch"]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Hey guys!
I've been away for the past few weeks and I had another chance to go check out the F50.

I got the guy at the store to dial it in and I also brough Hal9000's settings with me. I trying to made it less muddy than it was but I couldn't do it! I was very dissappointed with the way the distortion sounded but I will tell you one thing, this amp has one of the nicest clean tones you will ever hear in an amp like this.

I did play the Triple Recto again and again, it has the sound I am looking for, perhaps it needs a bit of coutour but it sounded amazing. too bad it can't do cleans like the F50.. :(

my search continues for another amp.

Charlie

chigga,
i have also noticed muddiness in the od channel of the f50, but only with darker sounding guitars. I played a schecter c1 with duncan designed in it and it was too dark and muddy. that is no problem as all of my guitars are brighter. i own the f50 and love it although i am having to get the relay switches fixed in mine. do yourself a favor, pick up a telecaster and play it through the f50 and try nbot to crap yourself :D

["sasquatch"]

f50 problems!

my f50 has been in the shop for almost 2 weeks now. the tech only comes 1 day per week and yadda yadda parts, yadda yadda time, yadda yadda ya. let me tell you guys what was going on. on ch1, it kep flickering out like it wanted to change to ch2, even with the footswitch out. turns out the relay switches are bad and have to be replaced. thank goodness for the warranty. in the meantime, i picked up a peavey classic 30 as a backup amp. i played it through a greenback loaded marshall cab and luuvvved it! gonna put an eminence private jack in it.....anyway, had to tell you guys about my f50's current problems. i still love it though!

[Locky]

so no one has ever used a beam blocker on their F-series?

[boonhogganbeck]

my f50 has been in the shop for almost 2 weeks now. the tech only comes 1 day per week and yadda yadda parts, yadda yadda time, yadda yadda ya.

That's because you're in Auburn. :)

Seriously, I hope you get it fixed soon.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan
I also need to watch the cash flow at the moment - one of the reasons for the delay in my replies lately, is that I've been flying the family (of four) all over the place. I've been doing some gospel gigs in Germany all weekend - amazing time and response from the audiences. I left Germany Monday morning and I've literally just arrived in Japan, where I'm visiting my wife's folks, and taking a vacation over the next couple of weeks. Here are a few pics of me from the outdoor gig on Saturday afternoon at Charlottenberg Castle in BerlinFYI, I used my flying rig (Behringer FCB1010 -> POD 2.0 -> PA) because it fits in a suitcase. :p

Big smiles,

Andy, That castle in the background of your photo's looks awesome. My next thought was, man they must have a big console to mix all those mic's plus all the other instruments!
I like your guitar, is that your PRS?

[markmann]

Originally posted by Locky
so no one has ever used a beam blocker on their F-series? Locky, I noticed that you have a Wizard Wah in your gear list... how does it sound with the F-50? I've been checking out new wah's and haven't found one that I like with distortion.

Sorry I can't help you with the beam blocker since I don't know what it is.

[Locky]

Its the best wah I've ever played with distortion hands down.

FYI A beam blocker is a little impedance you place at the center of the speaker cone to reduce the harsh treble beam.

[jadedlikeme]

Hey guys. Awesome thread. Don't know if this question/request has been asked before but how does the F-50 or F-30 handle classic rock and hard rock -- say from the likes of ACDC and Aerosmith?

I have downloaded all the clips I can find of the f-50 and f-30 from this forum, sweet stuff, great playing, but I noticed it's mostly metal flavored songs. Any chance somebody could whip-up a clip of some classic rock stuff??

I'm really leaning towards the F-50 at the moment. I've never had a tube amp before... are the volumes usable at low levels, bedroom noodling volumes? (edit: never mind this was answered in a post above. F-50 might be too much for me).

Thanks for entertaining my silly questions!

[phyrexia]

I play with the gain on channel two way down. Any further down and it's essentially zero and the amp won't make any sound.

It can get classic rocky. It's got a nice crunch to it at that gain setting and if you wallop the guitar strings it has some nice oomph.

I played at low volumes in my house, before I moved to the apartment. Now, I do have the F50 head and a 2x12, but it sounds good IMO at bedroom volumes.

Of course, I think it really sings at practice levels. I think you could make it work. (It also has a headphone jack. Do the combos have this as well?)

Vic

[jrc6]

"I'm really leaning towards the F-50 at the moment. I've never had a tube amp before... are the volumes usable at low levels, bedroom noodling volumes? "

Hey Jadedlikeme,

the F50 sounds best at gigging levels. In fact, IMHO, all boogies & tubes amps sound best at gigging levels. If you are use to solid state distortion tones, then I think you wouldn't mind the F50 @ bedroom levels. It is buzzy at lower volumes, but it still has a great feel and sound. Once you crank it, push the power tubes & speakers, you get an incredible tone.

The F50 excels at Classic rock. With the gain @ 9 o clock, master 11:30, you get some sweet, sweet tones. As you know, most guys on this forum dig metal. Therefore, a lot of F50 owners have been convincing the rest of the guys on the forum that the F50 can easily hang with the mark IV's and Dual Rectifier's.

I am currently trying to break in a couple of speakers. Once broken in, I will post some classic rock stuff.

[No Soul]

Originally posted by jrc6


The F50 excels at Classic rock.

...a lot of F50 owners have been convincing the rest of the guys on the forum that the F50 can easily hang with the mark IV's and Dual Rectifier's.



classic rock is most definitely in the cards for this amp.

As far as hanging with a MkIV, sure, but its pretty different.

As for Rectos, Im sorry the F destroys them (current generation anyway). In contour mode it easily gets just as agressive and heavy but with a lot more clarity.

[jadedlikeme]

Originally posted by jrc6
"I'm really leaning towards the F-50 at the moment. I've never had a tube amp before... are the volumes usable at low levels, bedroom noodling volumes? "

Hey Jadedlikeme,

the F50 sounds best at gigging levels. In fact, IMHO, all boogies & tubes amps sound best at gigging levels. If you are use to solid state distortion tones, then I think you wouldn't mind the F50 @ bedroom levels. It is buzzy at lower volumes, but it still has a great feel and sound. Once you crank it, push the power tubes & speakers, you get an incredible tone.

The F50 excels at Classic rock. With the gain @ 9 o clock, master 11:30, you get some sweet, sweet tones. As you know, most guys on this forum dig metal. Therefore, a lot of F50 owners have been convincing the rest of the guys on the forum that the F50 can easily hang with the mark IV's and Dual Rectifier's.

I am currently trying to break in a couple of speakers. Once broken in, I will post some classic rock stuff.


Awesome. Thanks to all you guys for the replies. This helps a lot. Looks like the F-50 is back in the running.

The strange thing is I live in a big city with like 7 or 8 guitar stores nearby, but there are no Boogie dealers around. The closest one is 6 hours away in another state! lol :\

And thanks jrc6! I would really love to hear the f-50 doing some classic rock stuff. I'll keep checking back for those clips. What speakers are you breaking in?

[jadedlikeme]

Originally posted by phyrexia
I play with the gain on channel two way down. Any further down and it's essentially zero and the amp won't make any sound.

It can get classic rocky. It's got a nice crunch to it at that gain setting and if you wallop the guitar strings it has some nice oomph.

I played at low volumes in my house, before I moved to the apartment. Now, I do have the F50 head and a 2x12, but it sounds good IMO at bedroom volumes.

Of course, I think it really sings at practice levels. I think you could make it work. (It also has a headphone jack. Do the combos have this as well?)

Vic

Ah good. I'm not in a band and don't plan to be in one. All I do is noodle around in my bedroom and do some recordings, so I wouldn't be turning it up too often.

F-30 would probably be more up my alley, but from the one clip I heard there's something about it that I just don't like. Can't put my finger on it, but the F-50 just sounded rounder, fuller... maybe it was the recording.

[tlchase68]

I love my F-30 and find it plenty loud for me...I'm sure I'd also enjoy the F-50 or F-100, but they have way too much power for my needs! IMHO, the F-30 is an incredible package with a great deal of potential...My only concerns with the amp are the "all-or-nothing" gain levels (which seem to get rather harsh/flabby in a hurry) and the volume level (which goes from fairly quiet to extremely loud with minimal turning of the knob)... Is it possible to make the gain smoother and the volume control more usable with some type of modding (e.g., new tubes)? I'd love some tips on tweaking the F-30, so I can make this already incredible amp even better!

Thanks!

[Locky]

I am wondering what type of MODs are offered by VooDoo. Anyone had any experience with them are your F-series?

[the_chigga]

Someone mentioned that the F50 can hang with the Mark IV and Dual Rectos... Is this true guys? I've only had the chance to play the F50 at low volumes below 9 o clock in stores, i'd like to hit the Dual Recto Modern OD sound.. I've played this amp 3 times and tried to get that sound all 3 times is it because I am not turning on the contour? I'd like to go again.. does anyone have a clip of the F50 doing something like the Dual Recto sound? Thank you!

oh and If this doesn't work I am going to try and look into Krank Revolutions.

[Cold_Fever]

Above someone asked about controlling the volume of an F series amp. The master volume knob can go from no sound to way too loud with nothing in between if you have the preamp gain turned up high.

One way to control this is with a volume pedal in the effects loop. In this location it acts as a smooth master volume and doesn't effect the preamp gain. You can use your guitars volume pot to control preamp gain and the pedal to control overall volume.

I use an Ernie Ball volume pedal and it works great.

[No Soul]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Someone mentioned that the F50 can hang with the Mark IV and Dual Rectos... Is this true guys? I've only had the chance to play the F50 at low volumes below 9 o clock in stores, i'd like to hit the Dual Recto Modern OD sound.. I've played this amp 3 times and tried to get that sound all 3 times is it because I am not turning on the contour? I'd like to go again.. does anyone have a clip of the F50 doing something like the Dual Recto sound? Thank you!

oh and If this doesn't work I am going to try and look into Krank Revolutions.

Yes it can definitely hang with either. Obviously you wont get as many fine tuning options as a MkIV with the F-series, but its definitely in the same league as far as its basic tone goes.

IMO the F series destroys rectos, Ive said it before on this thread. Im not biased, I own both. Im a long time Recto fan. I got an F-100 in perfect condition for only 200 dollars. I bought it just as a backup amp to my recto, if not something I could easily turn arround and make a nice profit on.
But after having the F for a few months and really starting to see what it can really do, its not leaving my stable anytime soon. If anything the Recto might go up for sale.

The F smoother, more articulate, and a hell of a lot easier to dial in. Not to mention the cleans top any recto clean EVER. Also a lot more versatile.

And yes, to get into the Modern recto territory you need to use the contour mode. A lot of people are apprehensive of this because they think its going to give them a fully scooped sound, which is not the case. The easily soulution for the contour mode is DIAL IN MORE MIDS! Its not to different between switching the gain stages on a recto from vintage to modern.

I will admit the recto has a bit more snarl in the the modern mode as opposed to the F's contour, however it is not even close to a big difference. Matter of fact unless you are really really in tune with what a rectos modern channel sounds like, you could be easily be fooled. However, there is a trade off, which I find to be in favor of the F. Where it slightly falls behind in its abillity to produce agressive sounds, it more than makes up with its abillity to produce leads that just SING!

[RonniePentatonic]

Originally posted by jadedlikeme


Ah good. I'm not in a band and don't plan to be in one. All I do is noodle around in my bedroom and do some recordings, so I wouldn't be turning it up too often.

F-30 would probably be more up my alley, but from the one clip I heard there's something about it that I just don't like. Can't put my finger on it, but the F-50 just sounded rounder, fuller... maybe it was the recording.

Hey man, if youre talking about my F-30 clip keep in mind that mine was boosted with a Barber Direct Drive pedal which gives it more "hair" than the stock sound by itself. Unboosted, the amp is very smooth and round like some of the other clips. Someone was asking how "modern" metal the F-series could get so I did that clip for that purpose alone.

I personally like the way the amp sounds boosted, at least for playing heavier stuff. But please do not think that the stock amp has that sound, it is much smoother and I had to tweak to get it to sound that way. I know youre not a "metal" guy but beleive me the F-30 will do everything from country to blues to classic rock to metal and with a clean boost it will almost get into stock recto territory.

Just to clarify.


:)

[musicdog400]

A couple of thoughts about my F-50:

-it has become my hands down favorite amp because of the warm cleans, smooth low overdrive, and the contour mode. I play it every day.

-running it at really low volumes doesn't sound good unless you use an attenuator (I use a Weber Mass)

-sometimes I think it has a tad too much high end, but the attenuator actually helps here.

-I run a compressor and EQ in front of the input, and an EQ in the loop to give it a little more bass and a little less high end.

-it really annoys me that the parallel loop only goes to 90%, I have the mod details to make it serial, but haven't done it yet.

-this is an easy amp to get a bad sound out of, I am glad I bought it and took the time to learn it.

Overall I am very happy with this amp. Now I am not sure what to GAS for. After a point, it only gets incrementally better, even spending thousands more. But I am GASSIN for a Mark IV or Kock Multitone.

[LithiumZero]

I am using a Les Paul Classic with the 500T pickup which is super hot through my F-50 Head and 4x12. I don't have any problems with unwanted feedback. Did you try lowering your bridge pickup?

Wow! 11:00 on the OD channel? Damn, that IS loud!

[markmann]

Originally posted by UconnJack
It happens with both pick-ups, but maybe it is a height issue. However, it doesn't happen in the center position (both pick-ups), or with other amps. And let me clarify about my volume, I run the gain down around 9-9:30 and the master around 11:00ish, on the gain channel. I also do not get unwanted feedback when using my LP. I have 490R & 490T and I've played it through several F-50's at many different tone settings. My pickups are somewhere around 1/8" from the strings. My LP will sustain forever and if I get close to the amp at higher volumes on ch 2 I'll get "Useful" feedback like added singing type harmonics.

My 446 hollow body is a differrnt story. I bassically cannot use it wit the F-50 unless at low volume and clean channel or it gets crazy real fast.

[No Soul]

I have EMGs, whats unwanted feedback?:D

[the_chigga]

Hi guys I was wondering what an attenuator was and how it will help the F50 sound great at low volumes.
I am going into the store this week to try the F50 again but this time with the contour setting and going to find a sweet spot on the amp or I am not leaving. I like the way the rectos sound all dialed to 12 o clock bass and all. can you get that kind of sound from F50? Someone on here has a F50 and a recto can you make a comparison please? or reassure me that the sound is possible.

Thanks,
Charlie

[hal9000]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Hi guys I was wondering what an attenuator was and how it will help the F50 sound great at low volumes.
I am going into the store this week to try the F50 again but this time with the contour setting and going to find a sweet spot on the amp or I am not leaving. I like the way the rectos sound all dialed to 12 o clock bass and all. can you get that kind of sound from F50? Someone on here has a F50 and a recto can you make a comparison please? or reassure me that the sound is possible.

Thanks,
Charlie Low volume is pretty subjective, so you'll have to define what you mean. I use a Hot Plate (set @ -12 dB) with my F-50 and it sounds really good, especially for being able to open up the amp's masters and backing down the level for practice and gigs.

BTW, if you didn't use contour or get the master volumes up to where they are in my settings, then I can’t say that you've given the amp a fair run.

So, in regards to my settings, if you set the master where it says, set the channel as stated, and use the right type of guitar (Single coil and humbucker as stated) you should get a good feeling for what the amp has to offer. There are in fact two settings that are made for contour, “Humbucker Metal Rhythm” and “Vintage High Gain.” Yeah, I know it is loud, but if you don't turn up an amp to try it out, you're basically test driving a sports car at idle speed and saying that it isn’t fast enough :).

Also, if you really like the recto, and the F-series after a fair test isn’t heavy enough, they can be had on eBay for <$1000, especially for the Rectoverb or Single Rectifier. The F-series isn’t for everyone, but a lot of us have preferred the F over the Rectifiers for reasons already stated.

[hal9000]

Guys, I saw this on the Boogie Board and I thought you would be interested:

These two clips are from a guy in Greece named Takis, aka mr. blues (http://www.ic-musicmedia.com/artist_pages/artistpage.php?id=101874)

F-30 Singing lead by Takis (http://mp3.openmusicsource.net/artists/101874/melody.mp3)

Classic Slow Blues (F-30 Clean Channel + Tube screamer boost) (http://mp3.openmusicsource.net/artists/101874/classic_blues.mp3)

Here's the original thread: F-30 F-50 Clips Please... (http://forum.grailtone.com/viewtopic.php?t=603&sid=f42e01e38eef7ff660166a95c5ed3777)

[the_chigga]

Hey Hal9000, I mean quiet as in like bedroom levels I know the F50 isn't very good at doing that, there a volume jump from quiet to loud.. I guess I was just wondering if I can get the good tone like the amp cranked at full at a 8o clock volume using some kind of pedal?

am listneing to the clips you posted and... Wow, I listended to the 3rd clip called throbbing or something like that and THAT'S the kindda tone I want... OMG... Can that be reached with the f50?
Also I do a lot of PM Alternate picking stuff does the amp play it very clearly or does it gett muddy cuz I know the F50 I played needed a lot more control than other amps.

Thanks..
WOW I am amazed by the tone.. :O

[Dann'sTheMan]

Dear Friends and Brothers,

Just checking in from the land of the rising sun. I'm having a fantastic time here, and although I'm missing my F-50 and the rest of my rig, at least Japan has plenty of quality guitar shops with cool gear to tide me over (I go home this weekend).

One of the highlights has been playing a F-50 combo through a Mesa traditional 4x12 cab. I kept the combo speaker going for some open back airiness - wow, what a chunky drive sound. hal9000, I can see why you like running that closed back 2x12 with your F-100 - huge tone! :D

I've also had fun with the new Vox AC-30 Custom Classic, the reissue CAE pre-amp and the H&K Triamp II that responded really well with a high end Japanese strat type guitar.

It's great to see this thread thriving. :cool: and I thought I would briefly share my thoughts on some of the questions that have been asked since my last post, before heading back to my vacation. :)

Big smiles to everyone,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Locky
Anyone experiemented with beam blockers on there F-series amps. I find the C90 has a rather harsh center beam that i'd like to attenuate a bit.

Hi Locky,

Unfortunately I don't have any experience with beam blockers, but I will keep an eye open for them in the future.

One idea that comes to mind would be to try your F-50 with some external cabs, and thus narrow things down to a speaker you like. I had a lot of fun recently with a 4x12 closed back.

Another tip to bear in mind is that open back combos have an interactive relationship with the walls that they are near. You can change the tone by varying the distance with the rear wall, moving it in and out of corners, tilting it, taking it off the floor etc. I've found that if I put my combo on top of its road case, then place my full length 6U rack case on top of the combo, so that it touches the rear wall, then an interesting baffle is formed behind the combo and under the rack case that really enhances the low end - it sounds much more like a closed back cab. :)

Big smiles,

A.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Hey guys!
I've been away for the past few weeks and I had another chance to go check out the F50.

I got the guy at the store to dial it in and I also brough Hal9000's settings with me. I trying to made it less muddy than it was but I couldn't do it! I was very dissappointed with the way the distortion sounded but I will tell you one thing, this amp has one of the nicest clean tones you will ever hear in an amp like this.

I did play the Triple Recto again and again, it has the sound I am looking for, perhaps it needs a bit of coutour but it sounded amazing. too bad it can't do cleans like the F50.. :(

my search continues for another amp.

Charlie

Hey Charlie,

I'd suggest trying to contact TechMetalMan (perhaps you could PM him). He brought home an F-50 rig, and then decided to exchange it for a Recto, because he found it easier to dial in the drive sound he was after (obviously he missed the clean sounds). Interestingly, having gained experience with his Mesa, he tried a F-series amp in a store recently and was able to dial in the drive sound he was after with no effort. :p

There's no substitute for experience, and I continue to find new sounds years after purchase. For example, I dialled a fantastic crunch sound this week that has yet another "unorthodox" setting (FWIW on Contour channel: G:1 T:8 M:2 B:11 V:9 - in o'clock settings), :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by doggage5050
f50 problems!

my f50 has been in the shop for almost 2 weeks now. the tech only comes 1 day per week and yadda yadda parts, yadda yadda time, yadda yadda ya. let me tell you guys what was going on. on ch1, it kep flickering out like it wanted to change to ch2, even with the footswitch out. turns out the relay switches are bad and have to be replaced. thank goodness for the warranty. in the meantime, i picked up a peavey classic 30 as a backup amp. i played it through a greenback loaded marshall cab and luuvvved it! gonna put an eminence private jack in it.....anyway, had to tell you guys about my f50's current problems. i still love it though!

Hey my brother,

Sorry to hear about your relay problems. I hope your amp is back to full health soon.

Regarding the Peavey Classic, I hear that my guitar hero, Dann Huff plays a Classic 50 on a significant proportion of his sessions, and he's a man who knows tone! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by markmann
That castle in the background of your photo's looks awesome. My next thought was, man they must have a big console to mix all those mic's plus all the other instruments!
I like your guitar, is that your PRS?

Hi markmann,

The guitar is actually my Line6 Variax. It too has been suffering some problems recently, so I decided to take it with my to Berlin where I could return it to the store I bought it from for a proper diagnosis. The Variax has a large computer brain, so problem diagnosis is not as straight forward as a regular guitar.

As for my PRS, you can see some pictures of my Paula at the end of myNational TV Gig thread (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=800928) as well as in the video clips (of course),

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by jadedlikeme
Hey guys. Awesome thread. Don't know if this question/request has been asked before but how does the F-50 or F-30 handle classic rock and hard rock -- say from the likes of ACDC and Aerosmith?

I have downloaded all the clips I can find of the f-50 and f-30 from this forum, sweet stuff, great playing, but I noticed it's mostly metal flavored songs. Any chance somebody could whip-up a clip of some classic rock stuff??


Hi jadedlikeme,

Check out this Designing the F-50 (http://www.mesaboogie.com/Reviews/guitarist-F-50/Designing_f-50.htm) Interview with Randall Smith. You'll see that classic and hard rock are very much amongst the strengths of the F-series - it does them with class.

Regarding clips, from your comments I suppose you've already checked out all of mine (see my sig). I've tried to create a wide range, but interestingly, many of the comments I've received have been that they don't go metal enough. Can't win! :p :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by jadedlikeme
I'm really leaning towards the F-50 at the moment. I've never had a tube amp before... are the volumes usable at low levels, bedroom noodling volumes? (edit: never mind this was answered in a post above. F-50 might be too much for me).

Originally posted by the_chigga
I mean quiet as in like bedroom levels I know the F50 isn't very good at doing that, there a volume jump from quiet to loud.. I guess I was just wondering if I can get the good tone like the amp cranked at full at a 8o clock volume using some kind of pedal?

I, too, highly recommend the Volume Pedal in the FX Loop trick that Cold_Fever highlighted. It doesn't have to be a Volume Pedal - I use a rack unit, and I suspect the output level on a stomp box would work too. Just turn the parallel mix control to maximum (90%).

The key thing is not just that it works to get around the sensitive Master Volume knob issue, but that it actually SOUNDS BETTER this way i.e. to have the Master Volume above 9 o'clock (where it sounds best), and the amp's loudness reduced to more sane levels using the loop. I can guess as to why this is the case (I have a Masters in EE), but it sounds great at bedroom levels (and from experience, at TV studio levels too). When I first bought the amp, I quickly came to the conclusion that I would have to buy an attenuator too for bedroom shenanigans. This "pedal in the loop" approach works so well with my F-50 that an attenuator is no longer a serious consideration. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by the_chigga
Someone mentioned that the F50 can hang with the Mark IV and Dual Rectos... Is this true guys? I've only had the chance to play the F50 at low volumes below 9 o clock in stores, i'd like to hit the Dual Recto Modern OD sound.. I've played this amp 3 times and tried to get that sound all 3 times is it because I am not turning on the contour? I'd like to go again.. does anyone have a clip of the F50 doing something like the Dual Recto sound? Thank you!

oh and If this doesn't work I am going to try and look into Krank Revolutions.

Yes the F-50 can certainly hang with the Mark IV and the Dual Rectos. When I bought mine, I had a budget for any of them, and I found myself preferring the tone of the F-50. So I decided to follow my ears, and put my money where my mouth was. Don't get me wrong, I have a great deal of respect for both the Mark series and the Recto lines, and they may be a better fit for other individual tastes. It's just that the F-series was the fit for my particular taste and I have not regretted my decision. In fact Mesa actually invite such comparisons between the F-series and other more expensive amps in their line up.

Regarding Recto type tones - do check out the Designing the F-50 (http://www.mesaboogie.com/Reviews/guitarist-F-50/Designing_f-50.htm) article. You'll see that the Contour mode is very much where the F-50's more modern sounds live. I can now understand why you had muddiness issues, if you tried to dial in modern tones on the more vintage sounding regular Lead channel, especially with the Master Volume below 9 o'clock.

Regarding Recto sounding clips from the F-50, I recommend checking out Tommi Inkila's excellent threads here (http://quartet.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=885151) and here (http://quartet.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=881058). In addition, my Heavy Riffin' (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=871107) thread contains a clip I very quickly did to create a specific Recto tone from the band Creed. :)

Big smiles,

Andy

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by musicdog400
A couple of thoughts about my F-50:

-it has become my hands down favorite amp because of the warm cleans, smooth low overdrive, and the contour mode. I play it every day.

-running it at really low volumes doesn't sound good unless you use an attenuator (I use a Weber Mass)

-sometimes I think it has a tad too much high end, but the attenuator actually helps here.

-I run a compressor and EQ in front of the input, and an EQ in the loop to give it a little more bass and a little less high end.

-it really annoys me that the parallel loop only goes to 90%, I have the mod details to make it serial, but haven't done it yet.

-this is an easy amp to get a bad sound out of, I am glad I bought it and took the time to learn it.

Overall I am very happy with this amp. Now I am not sure what to GAS for. After a point, it only gets incrementally better, even spending thousands more. But I am GASSIN for a Mark IV or Kock Multitone.

Hi musicdog400,

Thanks for posting these great tips and insights. Regarding the parallel loop mod, are you able to post the details on this thread, or PM them to me. I think this is really useful information. :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. Both the Mark IV and the Koch Multitone are fine amps. :)

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by UconnJack
Guys,

I've been gigging alot with my F-50 lately. I am really diggin it's flexibility. I'm not at all into Metal, but we play a few Modern Rock tunes as well as alot of Classic Rock, Blues, etc.

I do have one issue with the amp though and am hoping somebody knows how to deal with it. I get a fair amount of feedback with my Les Paul. Especially when using various overdrive pedals. I'm constantly moving away from my amp during pauses. It seems like the amp would really start screaming (in a bad way), if I let it. Anyone experience this? I'm forced to play loud because we have a really loud Bass player. But loud mind you, is only like 12:00 on the clean channel and 11:00 on the gain channel. Thanks for any suggestions.

UJ

Hi UJ,

Sorry to hear about your feedback problems. You may be aware that the F-50 uses a rather unconventional pre-amp front end, which is very much a factor in the amp's amazing touch responsiveness. However, I suspect that it may also contribute to the amp being more susceptible to noise and other problems early in the signal chain, and may exhibit problems that other amps do not.

I'd suggest checking to see if your Les Paul is well grounded (is there a change in background noise levels if you touch the strings?); that your guitar and patch leads aren't noisy; spraying contact cleaner into the sockets of your stomp boxes; removing all of your stomp boxes from the signal chain, and then adding them back in one by one, and checking for anomolies; perhaps even swap your pre-amp valves around, in case one is going microphonic. Phew, just a few suggestions to be going on with, :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

Wow :)

I've missed few pages here... took a while to read. Now I'm up to date again.

I just bought Samson Powerbrite PB11 after I had those problems with fuses on our last gig... also bought 10 fuses so I'm all packed up. My only complaint is that the powercables included with the PB11 was very loose so I had to put some tape on them to tighten things up. Also, you can't really say if it's working correctly until everything blows up :D

Okay, big day next week... were going to perform our theme album from beginning to end... the recordings should start at 3rd of June. Expect some clips :)

[Locky]

I tried my buddies Ernie Ball in the FX loop and cranked up the Master Volume. I do notice quite a difference in tone with it there attenuating the parallel signal. Its not quite the same as a real cranked tone but I still really like it. Makes so upset because I just got rid of my old Ernie Ball pedal:(

Hey Dann'sTheMan, was it you who it running an F50 through a cab with V30's. I'm very curious as to how as F50 would sound through a 2x12 V30 loaded cab. I'm really looking for something that is closed backed with tight low end, soaring mids and an UNharsh top end.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila
Wow :)

I've missed few pages here... took a while to read. Now I'm up to date again.

I just bought Samson Powerbrite PB11 after I had those problems with fuses on our last gig... also bought 10 fuses so I'm all packed up. My only complaint is that the powercables included with the PB11 was very loose so I had to put some tape on them to tighten things up. Also, you can't really say if it's working correctly until everything blows up :D

Okay, big day next week... were going to perform our theme album from beginning to end... the recordings should start at 3rd of June. Expect some clips :)

Hey Tommi,

Great to have you back! I've just arrived back from Japan, and am getting reacquainted with my rig. :p I'm also on the look out for a Power conditioner. Any recommendations?

Can't wait to hear the results of your imminent work! Best wishes for the gigs - I'm sure you'll wow everyone. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Locky
I tried my buddies Ernie Ball in the FX loop and cranked up the Master Volume. I do notice quite a difference in tone with it there attenuating the parallel signal. Its not quite the same as a real cranked tone but I still really like it. Makes so upset because I just got rid of my old Ernie Ball pedal:(

Hey Dann'sTheMan, was it you who it running an F50 through a cab with V30's. I'm very curious as to how as F50 would sound through a 2x12 V30 loaded cab. I'm really looking for something that is closed backed with tight low end, soaring mids and an UNharsh top end.

Hey Locky,

I'm sorry you didn't get to try this volume-pedal-in-the-loop trick before getting rid of your old EB pedal. I like the results too, and it certainly makes the F-50 a cool and viable bedroom amp.

I actually run a stock widebody combo, so I have the C90 Black Shadow speaker like you. hal9000 has two v30s in his F100 combo, and he also has a separate 2x12 cab - I'm not sure what speakers he has in them though. Perhaps there are other brothers here that have experience of the setup you seek. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. After my recent 4x12 encounter, I'm also a little interested in considering a closed back 1x12 or 2x12 to run along with my combo. If I get an opportunity, I will take my combo into a guitar store and try it with potential candidate cabs.

[LithiumZero]

I did a complete retube of my F-50 Head last night and the resulting tone was AMAZING! Called Doug at Doug's Tubes and he hooked me up with a balanced JJ ECC803S for V1, a high gain JJ ECC83S for V2, a Shuguang 12AX7C for V3 and a balanced EH 12AX7A for V4. Also got a set of SED 6L6's. Of course I had to redial the entire amp but in the end I am extremely happy with the tones I am getting. The amp sounds less compressed and more alive and the high end is back but not harsh like it was with the stock preamp tubes. I has previously put JJ6L6's in to tame the highs but found that with the new combination of preamp tubes that the SED's sound more open than the JJ's. I also used to run an EQ in the loop but now find it unnecessary. Overall tone is better because I can turn the mix down to around 25% on the loop instead of cranking it to use the EQ. The loop sucks A LOT of tone with higher mix settings.

P.S. Don't listen to the boneheads that tell you not to put the ECC803S in V1 because it's a long plate tube and subject to microphonics. I wouldn't use in in V2 but it works flawlessly in V1

[markmann]

Originally posted by Locky
I tried my buddies Ernie Ball in the FX loop and cranked up the Master Volume. I do notice quite a difference in tone with it there attenuating the parallel signal. Its not quite the same as a real cranked tone but I still really like it. Makes so upset because I just got rid of my old Ernie Ball pedal:(

Hey Dann'sTheMan, was it you who it running an F50 through a cab with V30's. I'm very curious as to how as F50 would sound through a 2x12 V30 loaded cab. I'm really looking for something that is closed backed with tight low end, soaring mids and an UNharsh top end. Hey Locky, you can save a few bucks on a new Earnie Ball by constructing a small attenuator box as explained starting at the top of page 5 of this thread. Works like a charm and can be attached to the back of the amp. I think I spent less than 10 bucks at Radio Shack. I can take a picture if you're interested.

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

I'm also on the look out for a Power conditioner. Any recommendations?

It's good to be back :)

What comes to power conditioners, all I know that all the pros seem to use Furmans. I went for Samson for it's price and because there's not much bad comments about them. Though, afterwards I noticed that they seem to have that loose cables problem. I couldn't use it today on our practise "camp" because the power kept on going on/off from G-Major. It was the fault of loose socket, even after I used some plastic tape to tighten it up. Well, I have to call to the guy who sold it to me... the problem will be solved then. We have good relations.

As with every equipment, good and cheap seem to be two different things :rolleyes:

[nickt]

Uconn Jack

how are you getting on with your XTL?
I'm thinking of getting one to pair up with my F50. Not sure if I'd use it in the loop for FX or out front. I know there's some great models in there, but the other half of me tells me it's sacriledge to use a modeller in front of a tone machine like the F50!

Also thinking of offloading my Hotplate in favour of Andy and others "volume pedal in loop idea", by the looks of it this worls great, and would free up a bit of cash for the XTL!!

regards to all

Nick

[UconnJack]

Hey Nick,

Returned the XTL to MF for the refund after about a month of tweaking. Even bought a Tech 21 PE to give it a more neutral power supply (Sent that back also). I don't think it matched up well with the F-50. Too much coloration in front and/or in the loop IMO. I did get used to tweaking the XTL and actually liked it a bit after a while, I just could never get a great feel from it. Might try another one in the fall for some smaller gigs I've got lined up. Will go direct and/or use an Atomic amp (or other tube amp), as a monitor.

Also, I sold my Hotplate attenuator. I felt it changed the feel of the F-50 too much. I'm getting good tones at reasonable volumes without it.

My latest configuration is the F-50 into an Avatar 2x12 (Wizard and Governor) for the dirt and a Carr Rambler for my clean channel, plus OD pedals to taste! I'm lovin it, but it's alot to carry.

UJ

[nickt]

I haven't pulled the trigger yet..some more thinking needed methinks..I've got a Yamaha magicstomp and may just keep that for a while.

The other thing that was pulling me towards an XTL is that I've just got a Variax (amazing, esp with workbench) and thought they would pair up well..

the search continues...

cheers

[UconnJack]

I think the XTL and a Variax are a great combination. I also think the XTL would sound best configured as a preamp into a tube poweramp into a speaker cabinet. All IMO of course, based on my experience. Musicians Friend has a generous 45 day return policy which is how I experimented with mine. I just felt the XTL and the F-50 weren't a great match, good luck.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by nickt
Uconn Jack

how are you getting on with your XTL?
I'm thinking of getting one to pair up with my F50. Not sure if I'd use it in the loop for FX or out front. I know there's some great models in there, but the other half of me tells me it's sacriledge to use a modeller in front of a tone machine like the F50!

Also thinking of offloading my Hotplate in favour of Andy and others "volume pedal in loop idea", by the looks of it this worls great, and would free up a bit of cash for the XTL!!

regards to all

Nick

Hi Nick,

You should be able to try the "volume pedal in loop" trick with your Magic Stomp, and thus see if you like the results. Simply put the Magic Stomp in the loop; turn the mix knob to maximum (90%); turn up the amp's Master Volume; and turn down the overall volume using the Magic Stomp - probably some Global or Patch level parameter - be careful to keep any Input sensitivity control as high as possible without clipping so that the maximum dynamic range of the effects unit can be used. :)

Regarding compatibility, I've found that my Variax is particularly happy when paired with a Line6 device - the models sounded more authentic imo when I've plugged it into my POD and a Flextone III.

Another option you might wish to consider - I picked up a new TC Electronics G-Major recently at a great price (~£280 incl postage) from German suppliers Thomann. More details here (http://www.thomann.de/thoiw2_tc_electronic_gmajor_prodinfo.html), :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

[nickt]

thanks Andy I'll give that a whirl.
The MS has a global master volume, so I think you're saying have that as high as possible?
(I dimed it by accident once and got all sorts of Dr Who noises..overloaded the input I spose..)

Thay G-Major is indeed a great price, although I'd have to allow for a controller of some sort. How are you controlling yours?

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by nickt
thanks Andy I'll give that a whirl.
The MS has a global master volume, so I think you're saying have that as high as possible?
(I dimed it by accident once and got all sorts of Dr Who noises..overloaded the input I spose..)

Thay G-Major is indeed a great price, although I'd have to allow for a controller of some sort. How are you controlling yours?

Hi Nick,

The global master volume on the MS is probably on the output side - if this is the case, then you want to use this to govern the overal volume level of your amp (the amp's own master volume will be higher than usual), so the MS global master volume may well be LOW. :p

Some effects units (but not all) have an additional control to adjust the Input level/sensitivity - it's this control you want to have as high as possible without clipping.

Regarding foot controllers - I use the Behringer FCB1010. Inexpensive yet powerful. Highly recommended. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[nickt]

many thanks!
I see what you mean now, there's a switch called "input" that says high/low. Thanks for the advice.

:)

[jrc6]

Hey guys,

Just wanted to give an update with my speaker experimentation.

I have been swapping out speakers with my F50 combo. I have been working with the eminence speakers. I tried the black powder, screaming eagle, and governor.

If you think the F50 is too bright, you might have to check out the black powder. It is very, very warm. Especially in the mids. It is actually dark compared to the black shadow custom 90. In a close back, the black powder is even darker. It has a ton of bass. It actually will scoop the tone (aggressive lows & highs, and reserved mids). If you are a metal guy, you will love the black powder in a close back.

The screaming eagle is finally broken in. It was too bright, but now that it is broken it, it is not as bright as I thought it would be. In fact, it is just a tad less highs than the black shadow custom 90's. It is much warmer in the mid section than the custom 90's. If you like the highs of the custom 90, but want warmer mids, you should check out the screaming eagle. Oh, it has tons of low end, more than the custom 90. It is a tight low end, similar to the custom 90. The cleans are warm, but don't cut as well as the custom 90. If playing solo, the cleans work well.

I just broke in a governor. It is a sweet sounding speaker. I actually prefer much midrange to my tone. The governor delivers!!! It opens up the F50's midrange. There is nice some speaker break up. When cranked, this thing sounds like your typical "rectifier," tone on the albums you have heard, but so much warmer. The tone is incredibly clear. It has more low end thump when compared to a vintage 30. The highs are tamed, not as aggressive as the black shadow custom 90. The governor doesn't sound as open compared to the vintage 30. There is this nasal thing that lurks in the midrange. Maybe my speaker isn't broken in. I will have to work with it.

If you like midrange in your tone, stick with either the eminence british speakers, or celestion speakers. If you like or want warmer mids or darker tone, check out eminence american speakers.

Does anyone know where i can post clips of these speakers? My computer doesn't accept cookies, and therefore, I can't post on digital sound planet anymore. I have tried sound click, but they do not allow cover tunes. If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by LithiumZero
I did a complete retube of my F-50 Head last night and the resulting tone was AMAZING! Called Doug at Doug's Tubes and he hooked me up with a balanced JJ ECC803S for V1, a high gain JJ ECC83S for V2, a Shuguang 12AX7C for V3 and a balanced EH 12AX7A for V4. Also got a set of SED 6L6's. Of course I had to redial the entire amp but in the end I am extremely happy with the tones I am getting. The amp sounds less compressed and more alive and the high end is back but not harsh like it was with the stock preamp tubes. I has previously put JJ6L6's in to tame the highs but found that with the new combination of preamp tubes that the SED's sound more open than the JJ's. I also used to run an EQ in the loop but now find it unnecessary. Overall tone is better because I can turn the mix down to around 25% on the loop instead of cranking it to use the EQ. The loop sucks A LOT of tone with higher mix settings.

P.S. Don't listen to the boneheads that tell you not to put the ECC803S in V1 because it's a long plate tube and subject to microphonics. I wouldn't use in in V2 but it works flawlessly in V1

Excellent post! I'm still running the stock tubes after two years, so I definitely need to retube my amp sooner rather than later. LithiumZero, you have me itching to try out the exact combination that is working so well for you! I may well have to investigate and find out if I can source all of these tubes here in Europe - can anyone recommend where? :D

I'd love to hear more about everyone's experiences and recommendations with different tubes in the F-series. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by nickt
many thanks!
I see what you mean now, there's a switch called "input" that says high/low. Thanks for the advice.

:)

Hi Nick,

I suspect the high/low setting on your Magic Stomp is to switch its Input between instrument level and line level. This means that you will have to use one or the other setting dependent on whether you plug your MS in front of your amp (instrument level) or in your amp's loop (line level), :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by jrc6
Hey guys,

Just wanted to give an update with my speaker experimentation.

I have been swapping out speakers with my F50 combo. I have been working with the eminence speakers. I tried the black powder, screaming eagle, and governor.

If you think the F50 is too bright, you might have to check out the black powder. It is very, very warm. Especially in the mids. It is actually dark compared to the black shadow custom 90. In a close back, the black powder is even darker. It has a ton of bass. It actually will scoop the tone (aggressive lows & highs, and reserved mids). If you are a metal guy, you will love the black powder in a close back.

The screaming eagle is finally broken in. It was too bright, but now that it is broken it, it is not as bright as I thought it would be. In fact, it is just a tad less highs than the black shadow custom 90's. It is much warmer in the mid section than the custom 90's. If you like the highs of the custom 90, but want warmer mids, you should check out the screaming eagle. Oh, it has tons of low end, more than the custom 90. It is a tight low end, similar to the custom 90. The cleans are warm, but don't cut as well as the custom 90. If playing solo, the cleans work well.

I just broke in a governor. It is a sweet sounding speaker. I actually prefer much midrange to my tone. The governor delivers!!! It opens up the F50's midrange. There is nice some speaker break up. When cranked, this thing sounds like your typical "rectifier," tone on the albums you have heard, but so much warmer. The tone is incredibly clear. It has more low end thump when compared to a vintage 30. The highs are tamed, not as aggressive as the black shadow custom 90. The governor doesn't sound as open compared to the vintage 30. There is this nasal thing that lurks in the midrange. Maybe my speaker isn't broken in. I will have to work with it.

If you like midrange in your tone, stick with either the eminence british speakers, or celestion speakers. If you like or want warmer mids or darker tone, check out eminence american speakers.

Does anyone know where i can post clips of these speakers? My computer doesn't accept cookies, and therefore, I can't post on digital sound planet anymore. I have tried sound click, but they do not allow cover tunes. If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know.

Another Excellent post! Really useful information - I particularly liked your recommendations about what speaker might work in a closed/open-backed cab. Very cool stuff! :cool:

How long does it typically take to swap a speaker out? Any chance you made clips of your experiments? :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Locky
... I'm very curious as to how as F50 would sound through a 2x12 V30 loaded cab. I'm really looking for something that is closed backed with tight low end, soaring mids and an UNharsh top end. Yeah, I have the F-100 2x12 combo with V30's 3/4 tuned back and an Avatar 2x12 closed back with vintage 30s. The V30s sure have a tight bass sound with the usual mid spike and nice highs (after break-in). I can't say enough good things about the Avatar cab. It's everything I wanted it to be for a ridiculously low price. I actually run both the combo and 2x12 together which gives me the best of both worlds, i.e. 3D enveloping sound from the 3/4 tuned-back and tight bass from the closed back. Is there anything in particular you want to know?

[phyrexia]

Originally posted by Locky
I'm very curious as to how as F50 would sound through a 2x12 V30 loaded cab. I'm really looking for something that is closed backed with tight low end, soaring mids and an UNharsh top end.

I have a F50 head and a 2x12 Recto cab and I think it does what you are looking for. The mids are great and the high end cuts but it's not too harsh imho. I can't say much about the bass, I usually turn it down to 11:00 or 12:00 'cause it sounds kinda flubby to me any higher.

Has anybody played through an F series with a guitar tuned to, say, C? I did it a while ago, and it sounded...evil. Even with the gain turned down pretty low like I normally play.

Has anybody modded their amp or are they all still under warranty? ;) I wonder what they'd sound like with EL34s. (Or some yellowjackets.)

[UconnJack]

Originally posted by phyrexia

Has anybody modded their amp or are they all still under warranty? ;) I wonder what they'd sound like with EL34s. (Or some yellowjackets.)

+1, I've been wondering about how the YellowJackets and EL84 tubes would sound in the F-50 also. Anyone ever try that?

[jrc6]

I did not like how my F50 sounded through my recto 2 x 12 cab. The F50 already has a lot of bass, and the oversized cab enchanced these frequencies. It made the amp sound darker, and the low end wasn't as tight. It sounded kinda flabby. I sold my recto cab. Otherwise, I think the F50 would sound pretty good with a smaller 2 x 12 cab.

I run mine through an ear candy sovereign 1 x 12 closed back. It is huge sounding! The low end thumps really well, but all the frequencies project through nicely. I am interested in their 2 x 12 cabs now.

As far as yellow jackets....so so. They will brighten your F50. The yellow jackets run in class A. So, you get a bit more sag on the low end. They break up at about 9 o clock on the master. The 6l6 break up at about 11:00 on the master. So, if you want power tube distortion at bedroom volumes, the yellow jackets will work.

They are actually fairly loud when cranked (master 11:30). I was surprised. Although, it really lacked the fullness, probably due to lack of low mids. The EL 84 have more upper mid chime & less low end thump. I though the yellow jackets lacked the class A/B "punch" of the F50 running 6l6's. I didn't think the amp sounded like an F30.

I have been looking for a site to post some clips of the yellow jackets & different speakers I have been testing. Anyone have some suggestions?

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by jrc6
Does anyone know where i can post clips of these speakers? My computer doesn't accept cookies, and therefore, I can't post on digital sound planet anymore. I have tried sound click, but they do not allow cover tunes. If anyone has any suggestions, please let me know.

Apologies for forgetting to comment on this question. I usually use DSP, but I've occasionally used Sound Click and MP3 Lizard (http://www.mp3lizard.com) - perhaps try this, but I remember the sign up procedure being somewhat convoluted. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Locky]

After hearing Randy's clip with V30 and GreenBacks I am extremely interested in hearing an F50 through a greenback speakers. Anyone tried this?

[Tommi Inkila]

Hello!

The gig went great last night. Well, some hassle there and there but overall it was ok.

I've been reading these great posts with huge interest... unfortunately I don't have much to add, because I don't have enough experience on these topics.

Anyway, I just got my rig back to my studio... so clips are on the way quite soon. I'll first have to reinstall Windows and software + add some hard-drives for our upcoming album. Hopefully that goes smoothly. I also ordered Universal Audio UAD-1 for my DAW, so I'll be experimenting with quality plugins soon.

I'll try to make some clips, some for my own test purposes and then those preamp tube tests and some more "marshallish" tones as promised. Maybe I can combine these in a one clip, I'll see what I can do :rolleyes:

[UconnJack]

Mesa F-XX Brothers. After much consideration, I think I'm bowing out of the club for a while. I've got a couple of big outdoor gigs booked this summer and am thinking about going with a 100W head. I'm considering the Stiletto, Dual Rectifier or a Genx Benz ElDiablo.

I cranked the F-50 this weekend, it really sings, I'm gonna miss it.
(Feel free to talk me out of it cause I'm still on the fence!)

Peace!

[jrc6]

Hey uconnjack,

sorry to hear that you are leaving the club. Consider a 4 x 12. The f50 can easily handle this. As you know, it is very loud, and can easily handle a 4 x 12. The down side is that you lose clean headroom. This is the advantage of the 100 watt amplifier.

I was cranking my F50 cleans the other day, and the power tubes were breaking up. I had a difficult time keeping it clean. I will have to experience with some cooler tubes (8-10) to prevent the early break up. Right now, I am running some 4 groove tubes.

Perhaps, running some cold tubes through an F50 cranked through a 4 x 12 might work for out door gigs. I know that you will regret leaving. After spending time with other amps, you will probably miss the F50 sound, and wonder why you left. You may want to get a separate 100 watt head.

jrc

[phyrexia]

Originally posted by UconnJack
Mesa F-XX Brothers. After much consideration, I think I'm bowing out of the club for a while. I've got a couple of big outdoor gigs booked this summer and am thinking about going with a 100W head. I'm considering the Stiletto, Dual Rectifier or a Genx Benz ElDiablo.

I cranked the F-50 this weekend, it really sings, I'm gonna miss it.
(Feel free to talk me out of it cause I'm still on the fence!)

Peace!

The F50 sounds better than any of the heads you're considering. I've played all three. The Stiletto is the only one I'd consider, but I still don't think anybody needs any more than 50 watts. The first channel does tend to chunk up when it's loud, though. Have you tried single coils pickups?

Victor

[UconnJack]

I owned an GB ElDiablo and loved it. I may just pick that up and keep the F-50. (Forcing me to sell my prized Carr Rambler). I prefer the sound of my LesPaul through my F-50, it's a great thick tone. My strat sounds kinda brittle in the F-50, to me.

I was playing the F-50 last night and really digging the tone. Too many decisions, not enough money! Time will tell.....

Thanks for the input guys.
UJ

[No Soul]

Originally posted by UconnJack
Mesa F-XX Brothers. After much consideration, I think I'm bowing out of the club for a while. I've got a couple of big outdoor gigs booked this summer and am thinking about going with a 100W head. I'm considering the Stiletto, Dual Rectifier or a Genx Benz ElDiablo.

I cranked the F-50 this weekend, it really sings, I'm gonna miss it.
(Feel free to talk me out of it cause I'm still on the fence!)

Peace!

You do know 100w isnt even remotely close to being signifigantly louder than 50w?

Nothing against 100w amps here, I have a F100...

[hal9000]

Originally posted by UconnJack
Mesa F-XX Brothers. After much consideration, I think I'm bowing out of the club for a while. I've got a couple of big outdoor gigs booked this summer and am thinking about going with a 100W head. I'm considering the Stiletto, Dual Rectifier or a Genx Benz ElDiablo.

I cranked the F-50 this weekend, it really sings, I'm gonna miss it.
(Feel free to talk me out of it cause I'm still on the fence!)

Peace! Man, I just don't see the point where the F-50 isn't loud enough. In fact, I would say that the loud outdoor gig would be a great place to open up the F-50. Regardless, if you still need more clean headroom, you could grab an inexpensive SS PA and run that to a different cab for more volume, especially if you need a broader sound field sans FOH system. If you're concerned about hearing yourself while using the amp as a monitor, which is mic'ed through a FOH, you can always get a stand and point it at your head like I do with my Quick-Lok BS-317.