Mesa F-series Lounge. Come on in and share your secrets. [Archive] - Page 9 - Harmony Central Musician Community Forums

Dave M

06-29-2006, 03:51 AM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Hi Dave,

Do you know what the organiser is seeking to achieve in making such a restriction? Is it to control stage volume? or to avoid miking? Do you expect to have to use your F-series' speaker mute feature as well, and depend on a stage monitor?

In the gigs that I play, the sound guys know that I see it as my job to deliver the best guitar tones that I possibly can. I work with them to keep stage volume to a minimum and thus make their lives easier. I also bring my own SM57, and look after the cab miking (leveraging my own experience) - so all they need to do is run a XLR cable from the junction box to my amp.

I have considered getting something like a Groove Tubes SEII so that I have the option of skipping the mike, however I wouldn't contemplate ever running my amp silent. The amp's sound after all is very much part of the instrument that we play. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Hi Andy

I think it's a question of practicalities as our band is 1 of many taking part in a Gospel showcase. We're just performing 2 songs and set-up set-down speed will be important. The organiser is the keys player in our band so hopefully I can ask him to speak to the sound engineers and twist their arms :) I'm going to take my F50 and a mic anyway and see what I can do.

thanks
Dave

markmann

06-29-2006, 05:33 AM

Originally posted by Dave M

Thanks for that... I'm going to check out the GDI21 and possible use it with the Behringer DI box with cab simulator. The two together should render satisfactory results and luckily both pedals are relatively inexpensive. I put the GDI21 on my pedalboard so that all I have is my guitar and board. If you read the reviews you'll get some good information on this gadget.

Lt_Core

06-29-2006, 10:26 AM

Is this the most affordable external attenuator?

https://weberspeakerscom.secure.powweb.com/weber/minimass.htm

I'm guessing the 50 watt unit for my F-50. How does plug into the F-50? Not exactly sure, first time I would be using an attenuator. Thanks!

hal9000

06-29-2006, 11:33 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
Is this the most affordable external attenuator?

https://weberspeakerscom.secure.powweb.com/weber/minimass.htm

I'm guessing the 50 watt unit for my F-50. How does plug into the F-50? Not exactly sure, first time I would be using an attenuator. Thanks! Power Attenuators plug in between your amplifier output and speaker cab.

So, for the F-50 combo:
F-50 Output (8 Ohms) => Speaker Cable => Weber MiniMass => Combo Speaker lead.

Like I said, try the loop attenuation first to see if you think Power attenuation is necessary.

Lt_Core

06-29-2006, 12:13 PM

Originally posted by hal9000
Power Attenuators plug in between your amplifier output and speaker cab.

So, for the F-50 combo:
F-50 Output (8 Ohms) => Speaker Cable => Weber MiniMass => Combo Speaker lead.

Like I said, try the loop attenuation first to see if you think Power attenuation is necessary.

Where do I buy just the 1/4" TS plugs? Radio shack?

Surfcaster

06-29-2006, 06:46 PM

Originally posted by Dave M
Hi guys

I've got a gig coming up soon where the organiser insists on me using a direct to PA signal for guitar. Has anyone used the "recording out" from there F in a live setting before. I'm tempted to give it a go as I'm quite pleased with the sounds straight to my digital recorder at home.

I've got a V-amp2 and Korg modelling units but I can never seem get a decent sound to PA using these units. I also like to hear your experiences of playing direct through PA systems and the tools used.

thanks
Dave

I've already run the line-out from my amp through my V-AMP2 with the speaker sims and had decent results...never tried the Behringer DI with the speaker sim, but I've been curious about it. Anyway, with the DI you'll still need to have your speaker hooked up, so if volume is a problem the line out would be silent.

Surfcaster

06-29-2006, 07:07 PM

I was in Richmond yesterday for a concert and there are a couple music stores there my buddy and I always like to hit and one place is always well stocked with Boogies (unfortunately they did not have a Stiletto Ace in stock, which we both really wanted to try). Anyway, it's been a long time since I've plugged into an F30, and they had one sitting there so I gave it a whirl.

Overall, I still feel I made the right choice with the F50, but what surprised me was that the master volume controls responded very differently than those on my amp. On my amp I don't really get any useable volume with the knobs below about 8:00, and the frequencies don't really balance out until about 9:00, which is on the loud side for playing in the basement, but still bearable. On this F30 by the time I got to 8:00 it was already screaming loud...louder than my F50 at 9:00 and loud enough that I was in fear of getting dirty looks from other people in the store...I was afraid to turn it up to 9:00. And this was on both channels. So it made me wonder which is more typical? If the F30 is typical, then when you all talk about setting your master volume at 9:30 or so, that's way louder than my amp at 9:30. I'm assuming that it's just a different taper on the pots.

Anyway, I'd be interested in knowing how the master volumes work on your amps??

Dave M

06-30-2006, 02:00 AM

Agree about the master volume on my F50. Anything below 9 o'clock and the frequencies aren't balanced. Even using a volume pedal set to min in the FX loop I found for rehearsing in smallish room with my band that the master was only at about 10 oclock.

Dann'sTheMan

06-30-2006, 03:04 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core

Where do I buy just the 1/4" TS plugs? Radio shack?

Yes. :)

No Soul

06-30-2006, 03:11 AM

HAL9000,

would it be possible to set up a loop attenuator connected to a pedal (like a footswitchable bypass of sorts) ?

Ive been toying with this idea to use as a solo boost.
Sadly, Im not very technical though.

Dann'sTheMan

06-30-2006, 03:55 AM

Originally posted by Surfcaster
I was in Richmond yesterday for a concert and there are a couple music stores there my buddy and I always like to hit and one place is always well stocked with Boogies (unfortunately they did not have a Stiletto Ace in stock, which we both really wanted to try). Anyway, it's been a long time since I've plugged into an F30, and they had one sitting there so I gave it a whirl.

Overall, I still feel I made the right choice with the F50, but what surprised me was that the master volume controls responded very differently than those on my amp. On my amp I don't really get any useable volume with the knobs below about 8:00, and the frequencies don't really balance out until about 9:00, which is on the loud side for playing in the basement, but still bearable. On this F30 by the time I got to 8:00 it was already screaming loud...louder than my F50 at 9:00 and loud enough that I was in fear of getting dirty looks from other people in the store...I was afraid to turn it up to 9:00. And this was on both channels. So it made me wonder which is more typical? If the F30 is typical, then when you all talk about setting your master volume at 9:30 or so, that's way louder than my amp at 9:30. I'm assuming that it's just a different taper on the pots.

Anyway, I'd be interested in knowing how the master volumes work on your amps??

Funnily enough, I was in a guitar store yesterday (Wembley) and I decided to plug into an F-30 combo because it had been a while. I too noticed that the volume taper on the F-30 was different, and the voicing was fully developed at around 8 o'clock. I was A/Bing alongside an F-50 combo, and so the differences (and similarities) were stark.

The F-30 combo was hooked up to a Thiele 1x12 cab, and sounded absolutely huge. To all my F-30 owning brothers, you really need to try this combination - it's probably the best small rig I've ever plugged into. The Thiele balances the open tone of the combo beautifully.

I was so impressed with the Thiele, that I plugged it into the F-50, and probably preferred the tone with the Thiele compared to the 2x12 horiz. Recto cab that I'd been auditioning with the F-50. I've now started daydreaming about running a couple of these Thieles with my F-50 in a wet/dry/wet set-up (I should say that I tried the Thiele in place of the combo speaker, and preferred the open back sound, so I'd likely always being looking to run them in combination). :cool:

The other thing that I was able to try yesterday, was to spend some time comparing the attenuated sounds of a Hot Plate, and an Ernie Ball Volume pedal in the loop of the F-50. For those Power Amp fueled break-up tones with the Master Volume cranked (1~2 o'clock), the Hot Plate did produce a richer tone. For clean sounds, I preferred the dynamics left by the EB approach. For saturated lead sounds, with the Master Volume around 10~11 o'clock, the Hot Plate was slightly warmer, but there wasn't much in it. The deep and bright switches on the Hot Plate were interesting (the deep switch in particular yielded some rockin' scooped tones), however the Hotplate approach was far more susceptible to feedback issues (as you would expect).

Although I liked the Hotplate, I couldn't justify purchasing one (at full price), as to my ears, it wasn't a significant enough a tonal improvement to justify hauling one around. Nice unit, but I'm still satisfied with my loop attenuation approach, :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

markmann

06-30-2006, 06:06 AM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Funnily enough, I was in a guitar store yesterday (Wembley) and I decided to plug into an F-30 combo because it had been a while. I too noticed that the volume taper on the F-30 was different, and the voicing was fully developed at around 8 o'clock. I was A/Bing alongside an F-50 combo, and so the differences (and similarities) were stark.

The F-30 combo was hooked up to a Thiele 1x12 cab, and sounded absolutely huge. To all my F-30 owning brothers, you really need to try this combination - it's probably the best small rig I've ever plugged into. The Thiele balances the open tone of the combo beautifully.

I was so impressed with the Thiele, that I plugged it into the F-50, and probably preferred the tone with the Thiele compared to the 2x12 horiz. Recto cab that I'd been auditioning with the F-50. I've now started daydreaming about running a couple of these Thieles with my F-50 in a wet/dry/wet set-up (I should say that I tried the Thiele in place of the combo speaker, and preferred the open back sound, so I'd likely always being looking to run them in combination). :cool:

The other thing that I was able to try yesterday, was to spend some time comparing the attenuated sounds of a Hot Plate, and an Ernie Ball Volume pedal in the loop of the F-50. For those Power Amp fueled break-up tones with the Master Volume cranked (1~2 o'clock), the Hot Plate did produce a richer tone. For clean sounds, I preferred the dynamics left by the EB approach. For saturated lead sounds, with the Master Volume around 10~11 o'clock, the Hot Plate was slightly warmer, but there wasn't much in it. The deep and bright switches on the Hot Plate were interesting (the deep switch in particular yielded some rockin' scooped tones), however the Hotplate approach was far more susceptible to feedback issues (as you would expect).

Although I liked the Hotplate, I couldn't justify purchasing one (at full price), as to my ears, it wasn't a significant enough a tonal improvement to justify hauling one around. Nice unit, but I'm still satisfied with my loop attenuation approach, :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy. Andy, what was your impression of the EB vs HP at bedroom (TV volume) levels? I've had good results at low, low volume using the deep and brite switches.

FYI, one big reason I opted for the HP was the fact that I can use it in the load mode and tap the signal between my head and the HP via my Redbox. This allows me to play/record with no external sound and achieve excellent tone. When at home I need to be quiet so not to irritate the fam. :)

hal9000

06-30-2006, 06:26 AM

Originally posted by No Soul
HAL9000,

would it be possible to set up a loop attenuator connected to a pedal (like a footswitchable bypass of sorts) ?

Ive been toying with this idea to use as a solo boost.
Sadly, Im not very technical though. Yes, in fact, I designed and built one that I used for a while. As you may have guessed, the circuit is simply a line level attenuator (25 kOhm pot) connected through a DPDT relay for true-bypass operation. Normal operation is with the pot active, solo boost is true-bypass. The switching circuit also has a dual-LED, and a 1/4" switching jack where any latching footswitch activates an PNP transistor to pull the relay's coil to ground. I designed the box to sit on my amp such that there would be a very short run for the FX loop cables, and I could use any latching footswitch.

You could also build a fully mechanical version using a DPDT footswitch with the same 25 kOhm pot which wouldn't require a battery/DC supply. In this case, you'd have to run the FX loop cables out to your playing position.

barneyc4

06-30-2006, 07:45 AM

Hey guys whats up, im new to the forums.

I just picked up a Mesa Boogie F-50 from my local Mesa dealer today and I absolutely love the amp. It was amp I was looking for, my only concern is that it is a little too loud for my room, is there any way I can make it more apartment friendly (I can live it with of course)?
Any eq tips or stuff like would be gladly appreciated.

hal9000

06-30-2006, 07:58 AM

Originally posted by barneyc4
Hey guys whats up, im new to the forums.

I just picked up a Mesa Boogie F-50 from my local Mesa dealer today and I absolutely love the amp. It was amp I was looking for, my only concern is that it is a little too loud for my room, is there any way I can make it more apartment friendly (I can live it with of course)?
Any eq tips or stuff like would be gladly appreciated. Barneyc4, congrats on the F-50, welcome to the forum and the F-series Brotherhood! :)

For more apartment-friendly levels, you might like to consider some form of FX loop attenuation from a volume pedal, FX processor, or the FX Loop Mix Pot Master in my sig.

For settings, check my sig as well to have a good starting point.

Tell us more about the music you play, your other gear, and what led you to buying the F-50.

Lt_Core

06-30-2006, 07:59 AM

Originally posted by barneyc4
Hey guys whats up, im new to the forums.

I just picked up a Mesa Boogie F-50 from my local Mesa dealer today and I absolutely love the amp. It was amp I was looking for, my only concern is that it is a little too loud for my room, is there any way I can make it more apartment friendly (I can live it with of course)?
Any eq tips or stuff like would be gladly appreciated.

Welcome to the club! Go to the previous page (page 100 of this thread) and there a bunch of tips on attenuation.

My F-50 will be here next week so I'm looking into the 2 1/4" TS mod. Check it out!

Surfcaster

06-30-2006, 08:34 AM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Funnily enough, I was in a guitar store yesterday (Wembley) and I decided to plug into an F-30 combo because it had been a while. I too noticed that the volume taper on the F-30 was different, and the voicing was fully developed at around 8 o'clock. I was A/Bing alongside an F-50 combo, and so the differences (and similarities) were stark.

The F-30 combo was hooked up to a Thiele 1x12 cab, and sounded absolutely huge. To all my F-30 owning brothers, you really need to try this combination - it's probably the best small rig I've ever plugged into. The Thiele balances the open tone of the combo beautifully.

I was so impressed with the Thiele, that I plugged it into the F-50, and probably preferred the tone with the Thiele compared to the 2x12 horiz. Recto cab that I'd been auditioning with the F-50. I've now started daydreaming about running a couple of these Thieles with my F-50 in a wet/dry/wet set-up (I should say that I tried the Thiele in place of the combo speaker, and preferred the open back sound, so I'd likely always being looking to run them in combination). :cool:

The other thing that I was able to try yesterday, was to spend some time comparing the attenuated sounds of a Hot Plate, and an Ernie Ball Volume pedal in the loop of the F-50. For those Power Amp fueled break-up tones with the Master Volume cranked (1~2 o'clock), the Hot Plate did produce a richer tone. For clean sounds, I preferred the dynamics left by the EB approach. For saturated lead sounds, with the Master Volume around 10~11 o'clock, the Hot Plate was slightly warmer, but there wasn't much in it. The deep and bright switches on the Hot Plate were interesting (the deep switch in particular yielded some rockin' scooped tones), however the Hotplate approach was far more susceptible to feedback issues (as you would expect).

Although I liked the Hotplate, I couldn't justify purchasing one (at full price), as to my ears, it wasn't a significant enough a tonal improvement to justify hauling one around. Nice unit, but I'm still satisfied with my loop attenuation approach, :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Very interesting that we should make the same discovery on the same day!! :thu:

I also played around with a Hot Plate for the first time that day...albeit with a 1993 Marshall 100W Plexi RI. Tell you what, that's one sweet sounding amp! But an attenuator is a MUST with that puppy! Anyway, I was impressed with the HP...the Deep and Bright switches were a definite plus. Comparing it to the Weber Mini Mass I used to own, I think the HP is a better unit in more ways than one (another being that at LOAD the amp goes dead silent, with the Mini Mass there was still some bleed through at maximum attenuation)...whether or not it's worth the extra it probably depends on the situation. Like you, Andy, I don't see a significant advantage to using this type of attenuator with the F50 (thus why I got rid of the Mini Mass). But for a non-master volume amp, I think I would shell out for the HP.

plumptone

06-30-2006, 12:39 PM

I'm an infrequent poster in here, but I browse almost daily. Hoping someone can give advice on this.

I ordered an F-50 in bubinga and wicker on 3/31/06. When I placed my order I was told the wait would be 10 to 12 weeks. I contacted the GC where I ordered the amp last week (the 12th week), and was told the expected ship date was June 20th, and that they expected to receive it on June 28th. The salesman I was working with told me on the phone last week that he would call to find out whether or not the amp had shipped out of the Mesa factory. He never called me back to give me an update, and after several calls back without ever being able to talk to my salesman and no help from anyone else, finally as of 15 minutes ago, I was advised by the folks at the GC that to the amp (as far as they know) has not been shipped yet. THey have no clue whether or not it's even finished.

Is anyone aware of any delays currently with respect to amp build and ship times? I know it's only a week or so late at this point, but I would love to know what the heck is going on. I just wish there was a way to get this info directly from Mesa. The wait is killing me here!!! I'm incredibly frustrated - big gig coming up next weekend, and was REALLY hoping to have the amp by then.

garylawhon

06-30-2006, 03:08 PM

Originally posted by plumptone
I'm an infrequent poster in here, but I browse almost daily. Hoping someone can give advice on this.

I ordered an F-50 in bubinga and wicker on 3/31/06. When I placed my order I was told the wait would be 10 to 12 weeks. I contacted the GC where I ordered the amp last week (the 12th week), and was told the expected ship date was June 20th, and that they expected to receive it on June 28th. The salesman I was working with told me on the phone last week that he would call to find out whether or not the amp had shipped out of the Mesa factory. He never called me back to give me an update, and after several calls back without ever being able to talk to my salesman and no help from anyone else, finally as of 15 minutes ago, I was advised by the folks at the GC that to the amp (as far as they know) has not been shipped yet. THey have no clue whether or not it's even finished.

Is anyone aware of any delays currently with respect to amp build and ship times? I know it's only a week or so late at this point, but I would love to know what the heck is going on. I just wish there was a way to get this info directly from Mesa. The wait is killing me here!!! I'm incredibly frustrated - big gig coming up next weekend, and was REALLY hoping to have the amp by then.

Call Boogie, and if you don't get the answer you're looking for keep calling until you get someone that will help you. You can also call GC Corporate if you feel you're getting the run around through the store. It could be that things are just backed up at Boogie, but it never hurts to get a verified answer about your order. I used to run a GC, and can tell you that things slip through the cracks, in any retail environment for that matter. Stay on top of it, even if you have to call every other hour or two to get an answer ;-)

ashjn

06-30-2006, 05:54 PM

This may seem like a crazy question but here is something I was thinking. I play dry most of the time, and run a line from the recording out to a boss tu-2 on the floor by the amp. When I want to tune silently, I usually run back to the amp and flip the speaker mute switch. I never use the reverb on the amp. I was wondering if it would be possible to mod the F-100 so that the reverb switch on the footswitch triggers the speaker mute switch instead of the reverb? Think it would be doable in any way, shape, or form?

digi

06-30-2006, 11:57 PM

What do you guys think???

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture4.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture3.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture2.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture6.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture1.jpg

ashjn

07-01-2006, 12:15 AM

Looks nice. When did you get it? It looks older...

digi

07-01-2006, 11:43 AM

Originally posted by ashjn
Looks nice. When did you get it? It looks older...

The head is about 2 years old.....

The cab is brand new...

Goldwing

07-01-2006, 12:25 PM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Thanks Neil. Goldwing, check out my post (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=12184999#post12184999) earlier in the Lounge regarding limitations with the FCB1010 relays.

If you have any further questions, then please don't hesitate to ask. This thread is all about getting the most out of your Boogie, and how to integrate your FX in the rig is very much a part of that! :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Hi Andy and thanks Hal9000 for the info, I really appreciate it.

So, if I understand correctly it seems that you can't change patch of effects but leave the same channel with the FCB1010.

I guess that with the G-Major you can. Do you find another kind of solution for this issue? I couldn't find one in the forum.

It's getting hard for me to find a FCB1010 here in my country, does anybody knows where its made? I mean in wich country? maybe I would have to import myself the product.

thanks!

cheers.

Dann'sTheMan

07-01-2006, 03:52 PM

Originally posted by markmann
Andy, what was your impression of the EB vs HP at bedroom (TV volume) levels? I've had good results at low, low volume using the deep and brite switches.

FYI, one big reason I opted for the HP was the fact that I can use it in the load mode and tap the signal between my head and the HP via my Redbox. This allows me to play/record with no external sound and achieve excellent tone. When at home I need to be quiet so not to irritate the fam. :)

Hi Mark,

My impression was mixed. I found the lower I tried to get the volume, the more I ran into feedback problems with the HP. Admittedly I was using a standard Fender strat with 3 single coils, but it was enough of an issue for me to know that I would have to be careful not to turn up the Master Volume too far if I was on a crowded stage and physically close to the amp. I don't have to worry about this with my usual loop attenuation approach, and I prefer this.

I should also add that I was primarily making the comparisons at the -12dB setting, as the tonal advantages of the HP over loop attenuation weren't so clear cut at -16dB.

On the plus side, I particularly liked the effect of the deep and bright switches. It was cool having this extra EQ flexibility, and I really liked the difference it made for heavy sounds.

I think my experiences with the Hot Plate have piqued my interest even more in trying the Groove Tubes SEII. A speaker level device with lots of EQ control, plus cab emulation seems like a really interesting unit for my little rack. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-01-2006, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by plumptone
I'm an infrequent poster in here, but I browse almost daily. Hoping someone can give advice on this.

I ordered an F-50 in bubinga and wicker on 3/31/06. When I placed my order I was told the wait would be 10 to 12 weeks. I contacted the GC where I ordered the amp last week (the 12th week), and was told the expected ship date was June 20th, and that they expected to receive it on June 28th. The salesman I was working with told me on the phone last week that he would call to find out whether or not the amp had shipped out of the Mesa factory. He never called me back to give me an update, and after several calls back without ever being able to talk to my salesman and no help from anyone else, finally as of 15 minutes ago, I was advised by the folks at the GC that to the amp (as far as they know) has not been shipped yet. THey have no clue whether or not it's even finished.

Is anyone aware of any delays currently with respect to amp build and ship times? I know it's only a week or so late at this point, but I would love to know what the heck is going on. I just wish there was a way to get this info directly from Mesa. The wait is killing me here!!! I'm incredibly frustrated - big gig coming up next weekend, and was REALLY hoping to have the amp by then.

Hi plumptone,

I agree with garylawhon. Call Boogie - everything I've heard suggests that they take the customer support side of their business seriously. I would be surprised if they didn't have a robust order tracking and supply chain system in place, so someone there should be able to track your order - you may need to get an order number from GC with which to give to Boogie. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-01-2006, 04:34 PM

Originally posted by ashjn
This may seem like a crazy question but here is something I was thinking. I play dry most of the time, and run a line from the recording out to a boss tu-2 on the floor by the amp. When I want to tune silently, I usually run back to the amp and flip the speaker mute switch. I never use the reverb on the amp. I was wondering if it would be possible to mod the F-100 so that the reverb switch on the footswitch triggers the speaker mute switch instead of the reverb? Think it would be doable in any way, shape, or form?

Hi ashjn,

Should be a simple mod. Have a look at the footswitch Pin out diagram in the second post of this thread.

If I were you, I'd make up a short cross over cable that would basically swap the connections for pin 5 (Reverb) and pin 3 (Not usually used). This way, when you press the Reverb footswitch, pin 3 in the footswitch socket at the back of the amp will be connected to ground.

Finally, you will likely need a tech to replace the Mute switch on the back of the amp with a relay - a relay that is triggered by pin 3 from the footswitch socket. :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-01-2006, 04:37 PM

Originally posted by digi
What do you guys think???

<snip/>

Hey digi,

Love the stealth look of your Boogie, its footswitch and those blue LEDs. I particularly like those new control knobs! :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

ashjn

07-01-2006, 06:19 PM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Hi ashjn,

Should be a simple mod. Have a look at the footswitch Pin out diagram in the second post of this thread.

If I were you, I'd make up a short cross over cable that would basically swap the connections for pin 5 (Reverb) and pin 3 (Not usually used). This way, when you press the Reverb footswitch, pin 3 in the footswitch socket at the back of the amp will be connected to ground.

Finally, you will likely need a tech to replace the Mute switch on the back of the amp with a relay - a relay that is triggered by pin 3 from the footswitch socket. :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

That sounds doable, thanks!

ashjn

07-01-2006, 06:20 PM

How many people in here are using the F-30 head?

Is it rackmountable with Mesa's rackmount kit for short heads?

andershoeg

07-02-2006, 05:59 AM

Originally posted by ashjn
How many people in here are using the F-30 head?

Is it rackmountable with Mesa's rackmount kit for short heads?

AND, not to steal your question, but i think this q relates to yours :) : is it possible to boy some sort of head-cab for the f-30? got the combo, but sometimes it would be nice to have the head-version :)

NiCkMiLnE

07-02-2006, 06:11 AM

Originally posted by cacheek
Thanks, Hal! Yes, it's a combo like yours. I like it a lot. It doesn't quite have the tone of my nomad, but definitely sounds good. I'm going to test it in a band setting today. Should be interesting. I like those settings in your sig. I tried them last night
and will certainly use them some more. You have awesome tone.
Thanks!

tbh, i prefer f series!:thu:

NiCkMiLnE

07-02-2006, 06:12 AM

Originally posted by digi
What do you guys think???

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture4.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture3.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture2.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture6.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i258/pixelkatalyst/Picture1.jpg

whats around those preamp tubes?

digi

07-02-2006, 04:17 PM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Hey digi,

Love the stealth look of your Boogie, its footswitch and those blue LEDs. I particularly like those new control knobs! :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Thanks Andy!

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE

whats around those preamp tubes?

Those are dampers..... I think they make a bigger difference in my combo... oh and the preamp tubes are telefunkens...

Check out the website for the dampers...

Herbies Audio Lab (http://herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/)

Surfcaster

07-03-2006, 11:34 AM

Originally posted by digi

Thanks Andy!

Those are dampers..... I think they make a bigger difference in my combo... oh and the preamp tubes are telefunkens...

Check out the website for the dampers...

Herbies Audio Lab (http://herbiesaudiolab.home.att.net/)

What kind of difference, specifically. I read the website, but would be interested in hearing your observations. Also, do get any interference problems without the shields?

digi

07-03-2006, 01:28 PM

Originally posted by Surfcaster

What kind of difference, specifically. I read the website, but would be interested in hearing your observations. Also, do get any interference problems without the shields?

The main difference between the head and the combo is the speaker in the combo...... it helps with the vibration a lot. I replaced the MESA tubes with NOS telefunkens and put the dampers on the new tubes and have never tested the sound with them on and off with my new NOS tubes... I will get back to you on that. The bass is hella tighter and the sound is insanely clearer, but that might be the NOS tubes I'm hearin :D

I haven't noticed any interference.

Lt_Core

07-05-2006, 09:49 PM

Newbie F-50 owner here. My F-50 came today and I could barely test the overdrive channel without completely destroying my hearing. I had the gain past 12 o'clock and the master volume between 8 and 9 o'clock. Almost no hard rock crunch at all. What gives?

I only had 30 minutes to play with it. I tried some of the posted settings with little to no luck :(

I'm using an Ibanez SZ720. A good hard rock guitar. Am I missing something here? The samples on the first post of this thread sold me on this amp's flexibility. I can't really test this amp out given that it's so freakin' loud.

gdwill2u

07-05-2006, 10:49 PM

Are you sure you are on channel two. My F50 rattles the window with bone crushing distortion with gain at 12:00 and master 1t 9:00.

Maybe you have a blown tube, because something isn't right.

Lt_Core

07-06-2006, 05:59 AM

Originally posted by gdwill2u
Are you sure you are on channel two. My F50 rattles the window with bone crushing distortion with gain at 12:00 and master 1t 9:00.

Maybe you have a blown tube, because something isn't right.

How do I know if a tube is blown?

hal9000

07-06-2006, 06:08 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
Newbie F-50 owner here. My F-50 came today and I could barely test the overdrive channel without completely destroying my hearing. I had the gain past 12 o'clock and the master volume between 8 and 9 o'clock. Almost no hard rock crunch at all. What gives?

I only had 30 minutes to play with it. I tried some of the posted settings with little to no luck :(

I'm using an Ibanez SZ720. A good hard rock guitar. Am I missing something here? The samples on the first post of this thread sold me on this amp's flexibility. I can't really test this amp out given that it's so freakin' loud. Hmm... Do you mean that you're barely getting any distortion on the Overdrive channel, not to mention the Contour channel?

Regarding my settings, you'll have to get the master up to around the same place that it shows for the tone to really be there. Since my G-Major gives me loop attenuation, those settings can cover a broad range of output volumes. If you have something that will allow you to attenuate the loop, I think you'll find that there is much more usable volume. FWIW, even without loop attenuation, the F-series has a good master volume and I've not had a problem getting good tone around the 8:30 mark on the OD master.

Surfcaster

07-06-2006, 07:08 AM

Lt_Core

07-06-2006, 07:37 AM

Maybe I'm so used to PODxt amp modeling that I'm having a hard time adjusting me ears.

How sensitive is the F-50 to pickups? The pups in my Ibanez SZ are stock Ibanez/Duncan designed. I'm going to try my Highway 1 Telecaster tonight.

How do I use my PODxt for attenuation? PODxt left output to effects send and effects return to PODxt guitar input?

Arpie92

07-06-2006, 09:53 AM

im new here in the forums but im looking into buying a F-series amp, (mainly because of the price) I wanted to know if i should save up for the F-50 (which was the one that first caught my attention) or the F-100

the reason im asking this is because ive read alot of the posts in this forum and theres were a few stories of people cranking their f-50's in the same room to 8 or 9 and i want a amp that can be loud for small/medium sized gigs but can still jam at home.

hal9000

07-06-2006, 10:17 AM

Originally posted by Arpie92
im new here in the forums but im looking into buying a F-series amp, (mainly because of the price) I wanted to know if i should save up for the F-50 (which was the one that first caught my attention) or the F-100

the reason im asking this is because ive read alot of the posts in this forum and theres were a few stories of people cranking their f-50's in the same room to 8 or 9 and i want a amp that can be loud for small/medium sized gigs but can still jam at home. Welcome to the forum Arpie92! :)

Nobody needs an F-100. :D

Seriously, I can't imagine a situation where the F-50 wouldn't have enough power. Dann'sTheMan has run his F-50 1x12 combo pretty high up in outdoor venues with plenty of headroom to spare. When most people are talking 8 or 9 in regards to volume, they mean 8:00 or 9:00 since there are no markers on the dials. 8 or 9 out of 10 is so loud no one could stand it for even a few seconds without serious ear protection. You might need to stand behind a brick wall while you're at it as well. Also, even the F-30 can be bone-crunchingly loud with its 22 W RMS rating.

To me, the real choice between the F-30 and F-50 is in the feel, headroom, and tone differences incurred because of the different output sections (F-30 has 2xEL-84s, F-50 has 2x6L6s). Also, on the used market you can get a mint F-50 combo for around $700-900 USD.

Lt_Core

07-06-2006, 10:39 AM

Originally posted by hal9000
Also, on the used market you can get a mint F-50 combo for around $700-900 USD.

+1 on that, just got a mint F-50 off of eBay for $880. Not bad. Now if I can dial in some sounds I'll be happy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-06-2006, 11:26 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
Newbie F-50 owner here. My F-50 came today and I could barely test the overdrive channel without completely destroying my hearing. I had the gain past 12 o'clock and the master volume between 8 and 9 o'clock. Almost no hard rock crunch at all. What gives?

I only had 30 minutes to play with it. I tried some of the posted settings with little to no luck :(

I'm using an Ibanez SZ720. A good hard rock guitar. Am I missing something here? The samples on the first post of this thread sold me on this amp's flexibility. I can't really test this amp out given that it's so freakin' loud.

Welcome Lt_Core,

and welcome to the F-series brotherhood! I hope we can help you sort out your issues with your F-series, and that you end up having as much fun with it as we do. I feel it can deliver some great tones without destroying your hearing, and there's lots of information in this thread to help you achieve just that.

Can I suggest you try the loop attenuation approach that is described so well in hal9000's signatre? All you will need are a couple of guitar leads, with some foil (or other conductive material) wrapped around the end of one them. By using the Mix Pot to attenuate in the loop, you should be able to crank up the Channel Master volumes to the settings shown in hal9000's audition suggestions. The Mix control can then be turned towards 90%, and thus bring the loudness down to sane levels.

Hopefully, this is the root of your problem, and not an issue with the amp itself. I certainly use my F-50 for both bedroom playing, and of course gigging. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-06-2006, 11:31 AM

Originally posted by Arpie92
im new here in the forums but im looking into buying a F-series amp, (mainly because of the price) I wanted to know if i should save up for the F-50 (which was the one that first caught my attention) or the F-100

the reason im asking this is because ive read alot of the posts in this forum and theres were a few stories of people cranking their f-50's in the same room to 8 or 9 and i want a amp that can be loud for small/medium sized gigs but can still jam at home.

Hi Arpie92,

All of the F-series are bone crunchingly loud! The F-30 may run out of steam on the clean channel at club levels, but the bigger F-50 and F-100 can humble the rest of the band when you need them too! :eek:

As hal9000 hinted at, the loudest I've set my F-50 was at an outdoor gig, and I had the Channel Master at about 3 o'clock. In the bedroom, I need to bring down the volume with loop attenuation, if I have the Channel Masters above say 8 o'clock - otherwise, my ears get upset with me... :p

Big smiles,

Andy.

Lt_Core

07-06-2006, 12:24 PM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Welcome Lt_Core,

and welcome to the F-series brotherhood! I hope we can help you sort out your issues with your F-series, and that you end up having as much fun with it as we do. I feel it can deliver some great tones without destroying your hearing, and there's lots of information in this thread to help you achieve just that.

Can I suggest you try the loop attenuation approach that is described so well in hal9000's signatre? All you will need are a couple of guitar leads, with some foil (or other conductive material) wrapped around the end of one them. By using the Mix Pot to attenuate in the loop, you should be able to crank up the Channel Master volumes to the settings shown in hal9000's audition suggestions. The Mix control can then be turned towards 90%, and thus bring the loudness down to sane levels.

Hopefully, this is the root of your problem, and not an issue with the amp itself. I certainly use my F-50 for both bedroom playing, and of course gigging. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Thanks, Andy. Don't I have to solder some wire onto one of the 1/4" TS plugs? I do not have a soldering gun or any clue how to do that. You mentioned foil? Just household aluminum foil?

This is a quick fix but all other non-effects loop devices are cha-ching, like the hot plate or weber mini mass. Have to wait until the dust settles. F-50 plus 5 pedals puts a dent in the wallet. I want to put my delay pedal and tremelo pedal in the effects loop eventually.

hal9000

07-06-2006, 12:32 PM

Originally posted by Lt_Core

Thanks, Andy. Don't I have to solder some wire onto one of the 1/4" TS plugs? I do not have a soldering gun or any clue how to do that. You mentioned foil? Just household aluminum foil?

This is a quick fix but all other non-effects loop devices are cha-ching, like the hot plate or weber mini mass. Have to wait until the dust settles. F-50 plus 5 pedals puts a dent in the wallet. I want to put my delay pedal and tremelo pedal in the effects loop eventually. Soldering the two lugs is a quick piece of work, but only if you know how. Andy's aluminum trick will perform the same task because you're just providing a path to ground for the Mix pot. That way, you can see if it will work for you. Plug one instrument cable in the FX send jack and leave the other end alone. Plug another instrument cable in the FX return jack. On the unused end of the FX return cable, wrap a piece of aluminum foil around both the tip and sleeve and secure it with a rubber band or whatever you have handy. Then, you can turn down the output volume by rotating the Mix pot.

Lt_Core

07-06-2006, 06:09 PM

Well, I have my XT in the effects loop as an attenuator which helps a little but the F-50 just farts in the wind on the 2nd channel and contour channel. Using the examples in the manual for Liquid Solo and Huge Crunch. Sounds like Huge Farting Noise. Two of the tubes were loose in shipping but I seeded them back in.

This is not good. The Classic 30 has better overdrive gain than the 2nd channel of this amp. Bought off eBay and no local Mesa dealers. Not a good situation.

Unhappy F-50 guy :(

Dann'sTheMan

07-07-2006, 06:03 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
Well, I have my XT in the effects loop as an attenuator which helps a little but the F-50 just farts in the wind on the 2nd channel and contour channel. Using the examples in the manual for Liquid Solo and Huge Crunch. Sounds like Huge Farting Noise. Two of the tubes were loose in shipping but I seeded them back in.

This is not good. The Classic 30 has better overdrive gain than the 2nd channel of this amp. Bought off eBay and no local Mesa dealers. Not a good situation.

Unhappy F-50 guy :(

Hi Lt_Core,

Sorry to hear about your woes - it certainly does not seem normal. Do you think your amp is unwell? Have you considered trying a new set of tubes in the amp, and seeing if that might be a quick fix?

Big smiles,

Andy.

Alligator

07-07-2006, 07:00 AM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Hi Alligator,

I like the eclectic mix of styles you play in your bands - tell us more! And of course, if you do have any clips, then please do share. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Hi Andy,

Sorry i've been a while gettting back to you. Here's a bit about my eclectic music taste's and the bands i'm in.

I got fed up of playing in other peoples bands a few years ago so i started my own project. This project has gradually evolved into Alligator, a 5-piece Jazz/Funk/HipHop act. At the start it was just me playing acoustic with a couple of female vocalists. Gradually we added instruments and musicians and it became a full band. At one point we were a 7-piece! We've had rappers, scratch-DJs, various Sax players and are actually on our 9th bass player! All this in under 5 years. We've actually got very few recordings but for a basic preview check out myspace.com/alligatornotts. Excuse the basic myspace - i haven't actually seen it myself! Can't get myspace at work and no internet at home :-(

The second band is called David Blayze and The Reservations. This is based around David Blayze (pronounced blazey) - a close friend of mine and a very talented songwriter. Look him up on Google. Think Niel Young, Ryan Adams, Wilco etc and you're pretty close to our live sound. Dave is in the process of mastering his second album - his first release was put out on DB Records, home to Tom Mcray, Electric Soft Parade etc; but after DB were droped from the major (BMG, EMI? can't remember which) they dropped Dave. So he's in the process of looking for another deal.

The thing is, no mater what sound i need - from bouncing Jazz HipHop clean tones to bone-crunching distortion with Alligator; or warm, chiming transparent country clean to gorgeous crumbley overdrives to classic rock with The Reservations- the F50 nails it all! The little amp with the BIG sound! I've really had to raise my game as a player to feel like i deserve it - (after 10years, i had my first lesson a couple of weeks ago!)

Hope that gives you an idea of where i'm coming from.

Still lovin the forum - keep up the good work!

Peace,

Chris :thu:

Alligator

07-07-2006, 07:12 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
How sensitive is the F-50 to pickups? The pups in my Ibanez SZ are stock Ibanez/Duncan designed. I'm going to try my Highway 1 Telecaster tonight.

In my experience the F50 brings out the real character or your guitar - i replaced the pick-ups in my Epiphone just after buying the F50 and the originals weren't up to the job. Having said that, i wouldn't rush out to replace your pups straight away - try a few different guitars and see what results you get thats my advice :)

Lt_Core

07-07-2006, 07:22 AM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Hi Lt_Core,

Sorry to hear about your woes - it certainly does not seem normal. Do you think your amp is unwell? Have you considered trying a new set of tubes in the amp, and seeing if that might be a quick fix?

Big smiles,

Andy.

What tubes do you recommend? Just V1 and V2? This is my first tube amp and I'm not sure how to proceed, or how the amp "should" sound like.

hal9000

07-07-2006, 07:46 AM

I got this little gem in the mail last week:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000HBEGermaniaTrebleBooster.png

Mmm, crispity crunchity goodness. I'd only played around with the Home Brew Electronics Germania Treble Booster for about and hour for the clips below. I used the Lo-Fi (vintage Dallas Arbiter Rangemaster clone) boost with the gain around 10:30. You can add a ton of gain with this monster, but I've found that it gets a bit noisy over 12:00, and it does the trick pretty early-on in the sweep of the knob.

Using my Tonelab, I setup a Recto patch specifically for use with the treble booster on board, and used the same setting with the external booster. The two clips use the identical patch, and the only difference is the Germania on the second. If you look at the waveform, you can see the Germania adds a bit of compression and makes the rhythm parts quite a bit louder even though the relative levels are the same. Also, I know the non-boosted clip isn't the best tone, but for the sake of comparison it was better to use an identical setting.

ToneLab Clip - COC It is that way Recto (http://www.64graphics.com/clips/COC%20It%20is%20that%20way.mp3)

ToneLab Clip - COC It is that way Recto (Germania Treble Booster) (http://www.64graphics.com/clips/COC%20It%20is%20that%20way%20Germania.mp3)

So, you can clearly tell what it does tone-wise. It'll tighten the low end by limiting the bass going into the preamp. Then, you can boost the bass on the other end (FX loop) where it doesn't affect the quality of the distortion.

Practice Report
I used the Germania last night at practice and it was awesome! Where has this pedal been for all of my playing life?

Germania for heavy sounds in Lo-Fi
Using my F-100, I setup the Germania with the gain knob around 10:30 on Lo-Fi mode to see how it interacted with contour with the gain around 12:00. It cuts just enough bass to tighten the whole amp and adds a righteous amount of hair to the top end and upper-mids so the amp crunches wonderfully. It's almost like switching to EL-34s. I loved the Corrosion of Conformity tones I got with that setup. You’ll have to dial-in your amp a bit different to take advantage of the voicing it offers and I found that it has a lot of mids in the tone. I messed with my G-Major’s parametric EQ to pull some of the mids out to and add bass to even the tone and the result was a nice balanced crunchy distortion.

Germania for solos in Lo-Fi
Then, I switched back to the normal overdrive channel on the F-100 which I use for all my solos and lower-gain rhythm playing. Man, I can't get over the sweet solo sounds you can get with this pedal. First, you get more gain because of the boost so the sustain is increased quite a bit, but the upper mids and treble dominate lending to a tone that slices through the mix like nothing I've heard before.

Germania for converting a SC into a HB in Hi-Fi
Switching over to the Hi-Fi mode, I used the middle single coil of my Strat and I found it almost makes it sound like a humbucker. It’s not exactly the same of course, but you can really kick your sound up a notch using only single coils and this pedal. Tele? Heavy Metal? No problem. (You’re going to want to turn down the treble a hair methinks).

Germania for converting a HB into SC in Lo-Fi
On the F-100's clean channel, you can convert a dual-HB guitar into a Tele right-quick. :) I got some sweet chickin-pickin tones out of my Ravelle (Les Paul-like). Also, boosting the clean channel with Germania was a pleasant experience. I could go from ultra-clean up through AC/DC just using the volume knob on my guitar and the tone was so dynamic it was scary.

Overall, I love this pedal. I was concerned about the noise it produces when I first used it with my Tonelab, but it didn’t really bother me where I had it set last night (I was on battery power BTW). This single pedal has added a lot to my sound by simply offering me a few new voicings that enhance my already great sounding amplifier. More than likely, I’ll use this pedal in Lo-Fi mode with gain at 10:30 for all my solos and some of my rhythm playing. I really see this pedal as helping provide me with a unique solo voice and an alternate rhythm tone. So, thumbs-up for Home Brew Electronics and the Germania!

markmann

07-07-2006, 08:52 AM

Originally posted by hal9000
Overall, I love this pedal. I was concerned about the noise it produces when I first used it with my Tonelab, but it didn’t really bother me where I had it set last night (I was on battery power BTW). This single pedal has added a lot to my sound by simply offering me a few new voicings that enhance my already great sounding amplifier. More than likely, I’ll use this pedal in Lo-Fi mode with gain at 10:30 for all my solos and some of my rhythm playing. I really see this pedal as helping provide me with a unique solo voice and an alternate rhythm tone. So, thumbs-up for Home Brew Electronics and the Germania! Sweeeet!!!
Looks like another pedal I need to check out.
Hey Neil, it sounds like you'll be using the Germania mainly for solo boost? What have you used in the past?

jpoprock

07-07-2006, 09:06 AM

Hey everyone. I just purchased a Mesa F-100 and use it with an Avatar 2x12. My cab came as a 3/4 closed back, but I purchased another back for it to make it closed. I use an 83 Les Paul Std w/ a JB bridge PU as my primary guitar, but I also have a 69 SG Special, and just ordered a Fender Am Deluxe V neck! I still have my Marshall JCM900, but planned on selling it to pay for this Mesa. Here are some of my thoughts after playing it a little bit. This is cut from an email that I sent to my buddy/bandmate/guitar player this AM:

I stayed home and rocked on that amp for 30min this AM. One thing that I remembered reading about was that this amp is not a "high gain" amp. The Marshall would kind of be considered more of a higher gain amp, with the SL-X being even more punishing.

The Marshall's distortion is smoother and much warmer. Which is funny cuz it has the same exact tube set up! HA! Anyway, the Mesa isn't as warm and doesn't have that nice warm (perfect) type distortion (which I KNOW that Mesa's are like Marshall's). BUT, after playing the Mesa for a while, you kinda get used to it. I think it will do a really good job cutting thru the mix. I will say that the amp is VERY VERY responsive to the slightest little thing. If you back your vol knob off a little, the tone changes quite a bit. Which can be very cool.

So, I messed and messed with the distortion for a while and got a pretty good tone. A nice "rock" tone I guess. It's not warm and creamy like the Marshall, but I think it's pretty good. The main thing with the Mesa distortion, and this is NOT a good thing, is that to my ears, it's fatiguing. There is this "harsh bite" that just doesn't go away. The louder I turned it up, the more I thought, "what IS that?? It hurts my ears!" The Marshall doesn't do that. The louder it gets, the creamier it gets. HA! And with the Mesa, it helps if you dial out the highs and mids a little. But it seems odd to me that in order for it to sound "good", i have to have the gain on about 2PM highs on about 10AM and the mids on about 10AM, and the bass at like 3AM. So, what I'm saying is... EQ is part of it, but it's also the nature of that distortion I think. It just has a bite to it that won't go away. So.. that is BAD. But I think once I get into a live sitch, that Mesa will cut thru well, and the sounds I'm hearing now will probl get filtered out. I just don't know.

I guess it could be the tubes too, but they have a nice orange glow to them. I think they are fine. So, unless I want to venture on a tube changing oddessy, I'll never know!

Then I switched to the clean sound... and it was bonerville!! I may change my mind in the "real world" but it is really really nice. Warm, rich, lots and lots of body, nice top end, etc. It's really sweet. If I experience that the distortion sounds really good on stage and blends well with the band, then I think I can be totally satisfied with it. I just need to always remember to never play my Marshall cuz it'll erase everything I've convinced myself of regarding the distortion. HA!!

-----------------

So, keep in mind that I play in a cover band that does anything from Motown to Fall Out Boy and everything in between. Funk, Disco, Classic Rock, Modern Hits, 80's classic pop hits, etc. So, I don't need a high gain amp. I need an amp that would sound good playing middle of the road rock ala Aerosmith/Tom Petty/Skynyrd/Zep. I THINK this amp will do it. According to Harm Cent reviews, etc this amp is supposed to have this great low end, perfect distortion, etc. But this just goes to show you and everything is totally subjective!! The perfect distortion to you could be crap to me. The ONLY reason I bought this amp was because my JCM900 is a one trick pony. It's distortion for my needs is perfect. I simply LOVE that amp. BUT, it's one channel, and doesn't clean up all that great. If I were in an original band that played rock all the time, then great! But I need to cover a lot of ground halfway convincingly. So, I needed a two channel amp that had a good clean sound. I figured I've give Mesa a shot. But so far, I'm not all that blown away. I think it's a really nice amp, etc, but I'm not exploding with joy either.

I was also wondering how much more of a diff it would make if I bought a 4x12 cab to use with it? OR, what if I took the closed back off my cab and went back to the partial opened back? That partial opened back didn't sound all that great with the Marshall because it kind made it sound slightly mid/boxey sounding. Typical of a 2x12 for sure. You can't beat the "thrust" of a 4x12 for sure. I know some guys who play their heads thru 4x12 end up thinking "Wow, that sounds much much better". So, I just don't know.

I'm hoping you guys can give me some really good advice!

Thanks! Jason

hal9000

07-07-2006, 09:29 AM

Originally posted by markmann
Sweeeet!!!
Looks like another pedal I need to check out.
Hey Neil, it sounds like you'll be using the Germania mainly for solo boost? What have you used in the past? I'm actually going to use it for both solos and rhythm playing since it adds a more vintage voice to the regular OD channel, and a tighter low end to the contour channel. For solo boosts, I've been using my G-Major for a 3 dB bump on channel 2 (no contour). I still love that sound, but it's nice to have some options. Also, because of the increase in gain, you get more fluid sustain. Brian May and Eric Clapton both used treble boosters to good effect.

hal9000

07-07-2006, 01:42 PM

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000GigRig7_10_06.png

Surfcaster

07-07-2006, 03:12 PM

Originally posted by jpoprock
Hey everyone. I just purchased a Mesa F-100 and use it with an Avatar 2x12. My cab came as a 3/4 closed back, but I purchased another back for it to make it closed. I use an 83 Les Paul Std w/ a JB bridge PU as my primary guitar, but I also have a 69 SG Special, and just ordered a Fender Am Deluxe V neck! I still have my Marshall JCM900, but planned on selling it to pay for this Mesa. Here are some of my thoughts after playing it a little bit. This is cut from an email that I sent to my buddy/bandmate/guitar player this AM:

I stayed home and rocked on that amp for 30min this AM. One thing that I remembered reading about was that this amp is not a "high gain" amp. The Marshall would kind of be considered more of a higher gain amp, with the SL-X being even more punishing.

The Marshall's distortion is smoother and much warmer. Which is funny cuz it has the same exact tube set up! HA! Anyway, the Mesa isn't as warm and doesn't have that nice warm (perfect) type distortion (which I KNOW that Mesa's are like Marshall's). BUT, after playing the Mesa for a while, you kinda get used to it. I think it will do a really good job cutting thru the mix. I will say that the amp is VERY VERY responsive to the slightest little thing. If you back your vol knob off a little, the tone changes quite a bit. Which can be very cool.

So, I messed and messed with the distortion for a while and got a pretty good tone. A nice "rock" tone I guess. It's not warm and creamy like the Marshall, but I think it's pretty good. The main thing with the Mesa distortion, and this is NOT a good thing, is that to my ears, it's fatiguing. There is this "harsh bite" that just doesn't go away. The louder I turned it up, the more I thought, "what IS that?? It hurts my ears!" The Marshall doesn't do that. The louder it gets, the creamier it gets. HA! And with the Mesa, it helps if you dial out the highs and mids a little. But it seems odd to me that in order for it to sound "good", i have to have the gain on about 2PM highs on about 10AM and the mids on about 10AM, and the bass at like 3AM. So, what I'm saying is... EQ is part of it, but it's also the nature of that distortion I think. It just has a bite to it that won't go away. So.. that is BAD. But I think once I get into a live sitch, that Mesa will cut thru well, and the sounds I'm hearing now will probl get filtered out. I just don't know.

I guess it could be the tubes too, but they have a nice orange glow to them. I think they are fine. So, unless I want to venture on a tube changing oddessy, I'll never know!

Then I switched to the clean sound... and it was bonerville!! I may change my mind in the "real world" but it is really really nice. Warm, rich, lots and lots of body, nice top end, etc. It's really sweet. If I experience that the distortion sounds really good on stage and blends well with the band, then I think I can be totally satisfied with it. I just need to always remember to never play my Marshall cuz it'll erase everything I've convinced myself of regarding the distortion. HA!!

-----------------

So, keep in mind that I play in a cover band that does anything from Motown to Fall Out Boy and everything in between. Funk, Disco, Classic Rock, Modern Hits, 80's classic pop hits, etc. So, I don't need a high gain amp. I need an amp that would sound good playing middle of the road rock ala Aerosmith/Tom Petty/Skynyrd/Zep. I THINK this amp will do it. According to Harm Cent reviews, etc this amp is supposed to have this great low end, perfect distortion, etc. But this just goes to show you and everything is totally subjective!! The perfect distortion to you could be crap to me. The ONLY reason I bought this amp was because my JCM900 is a one trick pony. It's distortion for my needs is perfect. I simply LOVE that amp. BUT, it's one channel, and doesn't clean up all that great. If I were in an original band that played rock all the time, then great! But I need to cover a lot of ground halfway convincingly. So, I needed a two channel amp that had a good clean sound. I figured I've give Mesa a shot. But so far, I'm not all that blown away. I think it's a really nice amp, etc, but I'm not exploding with joy either.

I was also wondering how much more of a diff it would make if I bought a 4x12 cab to use with it? OR, what if I took the closed back off my cab and went back to the partial opened back? That partial opened back didn't sound all that great with the Marshall because it kind made it sound slightly mid/boxey sounding. Typical of a 2x12 for sure. You can't beat the "thrust" of a 4x12 for sure. I know some guys who play their heads thru 4x12 end up thinking "Wow, that sounds much much better". So, I just don't know.

I'm hoping you guys can give me some really good advice!

Thanks! Jason

I agree with you...the F-Series distortion is not perfect to my ears, either. Like you, I think I prefer a Marshall type distortion...played a 100W Plexi Reissue a couple weeks ago and to me that was THE sound I'm looking for...probably need to use a boost pedal to get the gain levels I'd want, but I think I could make it work. But I don't have the money for the amp OR the Hot Plate that you'd have to have with one of those amps (though I've heard the 50W Plexis do much better at lower volumes than the 100 watters). But the F50's distortion is still quite good...and I've found with some pre and post EQing, I can get a more Marshally tone from my F50...though it obviously complicates my setup and makes switching channels more cumbersome (though I did rig up a switcher pedal to switch both EQs on and off simulatneously). Further, the clean channel is quite amazing, so in the end the F50 is a more versatile amp.

I also think it's probably about the best sounding amp out there in it's price range. The new Fender Supersonic is pretty sweet, too, but I think the F50s distortion is better...and I've yet to be impressed with a Marshall combo...they've not figured out how to get the tone of a vintage Marshall stack into a combo that I've heard. So all in all, I'm pleased with my F50 and don't see getting rid of it anytime soon.

I'm also wondering what type of speakers you have in your avatar cab. I've got a 2x12 cab with a V30 and G12H30 in it and I prefer my F50 through that than the stock C90. And I recently tried the F50 just with the G12H30 and liked that, too...tightened up the low end a bit and added some crispy highs.

jpoprock

07-07-2006, 03:24 PM

Originally posted by Surfcaster
[I'm also wondering what type of speakers you have in your avatar cab. I've got a 2x12 cab with a V30 and G12H30 in it and I prefer my F50 through that than the stock C90. And I recently tried the F50 just with the G12H30 and liked that, too...tightened up the low end a bit and added some crispy highs. [/B]

I have the exact same speakers as you do in mine!

I'm going to do some more testing tonight and tomorrow for sure. I gig with it tomorrow night.

I was going to buy this or a Rectoverb, and probl should have gotten the Rectoverb. OR a Marshall JCM90 4100 which is the 2chan version of what I already have. The clean is passabe, but not like the F100's. However, I'm a classic rocker!

Thanks!

Jason

markmann

07-07-2006, 04:33 PM

Originally posted by jpoprock

I have the exact same speakers as you do in mine!

I'm going to do some more testing tonight and tomorrow for sure. I gig with it tomorrow night.

I was going to buy this or a Rectoverb, and probl should have gotten the Rectoverb. OR a Marshall JCM90 4100 which is the 2chan version of what I already have. The clean is passabe, but not like the F100's. However, I'm a classic rocker!

Thanks!

Jason Hey Jason, congrat's on the new amp!

Here's an FYI... I, along with a million other cats LOVE Marshall stack tone, which is one of the reasons I don't own one because I've been a bit over-served by it. When I first played through an F50 I thought it sounded pretty awesome but did not really appreciate it until I used it in a band situation. Yes, the F50 sounds a bit harsh when compared to the creamy distortion you're used to but reserve judgement until you hear it cut through a mix.

Also, I own a vintage Hiwatt half stack that I always considered to posess holy-grail tone, which it does, but I was amazed at how the F50 did against it in a side-by-side comparison. The Hiwatt is truly a one trick pony and what it does it does well, but the F50 does a whole bunch of things equally well.

jpoprock

07-07-2006, 06:00 PM

Well that is certainly encouraging!! I can't wait to try it! I'll report back!

Also.. so you guys use a Tube Screamer to enhance the tone, or is that kinda pointless? Also, what about an EQ pedal in the FX Loop?

Thanks!

Jason

Lt_Core

07-07-2006, 07:28 PM

OMG!!! HOLD THE PHONE!

Left work early to give it one more shot. I had the masters around 9 - 11 o'clock on both channels. This time I really dove into the amp. Played it hard, soft, inbetween. Messed around with the knobs a bit and the tone jumped right out. I don't what was different but it was just singing.

Next I plugged in a Fulltone OCD pedal. Holy shit!!!! Tight crunch. Palm-mute heaven! Played through some parts, wife ran out and said, "And you were going to send amp back?".

My neighbor comes running over who has a solid state 112 Marshall. He couldn't believe it.

Chorus pedal sounded ok. Going to put it in the effects loop next. Used the EQ with a mid boost for solos and the notes just flew out of the amp. WTF was I thinking before? I didn't really open it up before.

The only thing weird is that there is a big difference between my Tele and Ibanez SZ pickup volume. Tele is a lot quieter, obviously. What do you guys do to get around this? Just turn up the amp when playing the Tele? Get a dedicated clean boost pedal?

So, in the end I'm keeping the F-50.

Go Mesa!

ashjn

07-07-2006, 09:15 PM

My Les Paul is suprisingly louder than my Anderson through my F-100 too. I think it has to do with the pickups

Lt_Core

07-07-2006, 11:51 PM

Originally posted by ashjn
My Les Paul is suprisingly louder than my Anderson through my F-100 too. I think it has to do with the pickups

My Ibanez is a lot louder than my Tele. Yes, it's the pickups for sure. Might try to find a clean boost for the Tele.

Dann'sTheMan

07-08-2006, 02:05 AM

Originally posted by hal9000
I got this little gem in the mail last week:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000HBEGermaniaTrebleBooster.png

<snip/>

Hey Neil,

My friend, I fully agree that a boosted F-series really is stunning. My vintage Dynacomp is a obligatory part of my rig, and I love what it does for both dirty and clean sounds. I have to be a little careful with dirty tones that I don't use too much compression and make things a little muddy, but I'm loving the learning process. :)

I have no doubt that a treble booster would work particularly well with the dirty tones as it doesn't dump those additional bass frequencies into the pre-amp. I'd love to give it a try, so roll on the opportunites. :p I'm also keen to try boost pedals like the RC Booster and maybe even the OCD. You're right to mention May and Clapton - if you've not come across this site before, check out how these tonesmiths use different types of boosts to push a just cooking tube amp into sonic nirvana: :cool:

http://www.prosoundcommunications.com/english/video/

BTW, your latest Gig Rig pic looks gorgeous - love it! :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-08-2006, 02:12 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core

What tubes do you recommend? Just V1 and V2? This is my first tube amp and I'm not sure how to proceed, or how the amp "should" sound like.

Hi Lt_Core,

It's great to hear that you're making progress with your F-50 - yep, it certainly needs to be opened up a little to sing. If you're not sure how old the tubes are - it may be worth replacing the power tubes and perhaps even V1 and V2, and see if that helps with tonal consistency, crackling etc. I hope the amp continues to deliver as many smiles to you as mine does to me. :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. Oh, and I agree with Alligator, the F-50 has a very sensitive (and very unique according to Randall Smith) front end. It makes the amp very touch sensitive, and responsive to different guitars. I usually find myself reaching for the Gain and the Treble knobs when I swap between my PRS and my Strat. :)

Dann'sTheMan

07-08-2006, 02:45 AM

andershoeg

07-08-2006, 08:05 AM

Hi again. Thought the f30 needed some clips :) I have recorded a couple at very low volume!! Not very good played, just some ultra-fast recordings ;) So don't expect any Steve Vai-ish here!!! :) Used a sm57 and some pedals (Emma Reezafratzitz, Emma Transmorgrifier, Carl Martin Hydra Boost, Carl Martin Delayla XL). All the clips recorded with the F30 on the clean channel, using a American Telecaster Deluxe. Living in an appartment i was not able to turn the volume up, so actually these clips will not do the f30 very much justice (or whatever it's called :rolleyes: ). Nevertheless, here you are (located lower right, push the red play-buttons):
F-30 CLIPS (http://www.soundvenue.com/band.asp?id=1032)

B.R. andershoeg

Iced Tea

07-08-2006, 10:52 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
OMG!!! HOLD THE PHONE!

Left work early to give it one more shot. I had the masters around 9 - 11 o'clock on both channels. This time I really dove into the amp. Played it hard, soft, inbetween. Messed around with the knobs a bit and the tone jumped right out. I don't what was different but it was just singing.

Next I plugged in a Fulltone OCD pedal. Holy shit!!!! Tight crunch. Palm-mute heaven! Played through some parts, wife ran out and said, "And you were going to send amp back?".

My neighbor comes running over who has a solid state 112 Marshall. He couldn't believe it.

Chorus pedal sounded ok. Going to put it in the effects loop next. Used the EQ with a mid boost for solos and the notes just flew out of the amp. WTF was I thinking before? I didn't really open it up before.

The only thing weird is that there is a big difference between my Tele and Ibanez SZ pickup volume. Tele is a lot quieter, obviously. What do you guys do to get around this? Just turn up the amp when playing the Tele? Get a dedicated clean boost pedal?

So, in the end I'm keeping the F-50.

Go Mesa!

Welcome Lt_Core to the F-Series and F-50 legion. I too am a new F-50 owner from back in May. Seems you too have discovered the joys that I feel now that I had a chance to gig w/ my F-50 2 times, one an outdoor gig and the other in a small club. Once I have been able to push the master up to that 10:00/11:00 (no loop attenuation, amp mic'd) area which I did at the outdoor gig (actually in a large barn) my F-50 simply blew me away. :thu: I do not think it was any secret why several people told me it was the best I ever sounded. I could not have been more thrilled with how my PRS Custom 24 and Highway One Strats sounded. I have my gain at around 9:00 which is more than adequate for classic rock, aided at times by a treble booster or compressor when I do modern rock. Even at the small club gig w/ the master at 9:00 (again no loop attenuation, no mic either) I loved the result. I was particulalry thrilled the way my Les Paul sounded at that gig. Keep in mind that I supplement my F-50 w/ a 2x12 THD cabinent which really helps fill the sound out even more, but the main secret is the F-50 for sure. The other thing I found so neat is the great SRV tone I can get by using the clean channel w/ the gain at 12:00 aided by my V-Stack Classic in Treble Booster mode.

Again welcome and let's trade F-50 secrets/stories!

garylawhon

07-08-2006, 11:18 AM

Second report, now after 3-4 gigs under it's belt.

When I first got this amp and played it at home at bedroom levels I just wasn't sure about it. After gigging with it, man, I gotta tell you thats what this amp is all about. All my guys in the band love the sound, the tone, and especially how they can hear it, yet it's not harsh. It blends into the mix crazy stealth like, and when I turn it up it could cut your head off!

I too thought the distortion was weak, until playing some gigs and hearing it in a live situation. There is a big difference between a stomp box fuzz, and actual overdrive like in the Mesa. I gotta tell you that I'm liking the Mesa tone on both channels, adding only chorus, delay and a volume pedal. I have a GT-8 that I'm going to work in there after I get it set up the way I want it. Which btw, anyone using one of these to do amp control? I was the post about the pin setup, but does anyone make a cable by chance? Any info here would be great!

The only things I don't get about the amp, is the reverb button lacking a light (hey, I love lights!) and the storage space in the back, that velcro pouch that I can't seem to get the cables in and actually close it! Any secrets out there?

Count me as a Mesa F-50 Happy Camper.

fyi, we do mainly 80's cover stuff, from Cheap Trick, The Vapors, Ozzy, Green Day, Foo Fighters, etc. Works perfect.

gdwill2u

07-08-2006, 11:51 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
OMG!!! HOLD THE PHONE!

Left work early to give it one more shot. I had the masters around 9 - 11 o'clock on both channels. This time I really dove into the amp. Played it hard, soft, inbetween. Messed around with the knobs a bit and the tone jumped right out. I don't what was different but it was just singing.

Next I plugged in a Fulltone OCD pedal. Holy shit!!!! Tight crunch. Palm-mute heaven! Played through some parts, wife ran out and said, "And you were going to send amp back?".

My neighbor comes running over who has a solid state 112 Marshall. He couldn't believe it.

Chorus pedal sounded ok. Going to put it in the effects loop next. Used the EQ with a mid boost for solos and the notes just flew out of the amp. WTF was I thinking before? I didn't really open it up before.

The only thing weird is that there is a big difference between my Tele and Ibanez SZ pickup volume. Tele is a lot quieter, obviously. What do you guys do to get around this? Just turn up the amp when playing the Tele? Get a dedicated clean boost pedal?

So, in the end I'm keeping the F-50.

Go Mesa!

You just experienced one of the strangest things about the F series amps, at least it is the same experience I have had and heard others have had it too.

One day my F50 sounds too good to be true, everything is just lovely and I think I am crazy for all the time I have been spending lately looking at boutique amps costing up to three times as much as the F50.....then the next day I plug in and it just sound flat and there seems to be nothing I can do to dial in a good sound. Well that is not totally true, the clean channle is consistantly excellent.

Anyway on the bad days I leave the amp on the clean channel and use an OCD for dirt (the OCD is a great pedal and really goes well with the Boogie).

Arpie92

07-08-2006, 06:59 PM

hey i'm back with another question, i may be asking this a bit early since i'm not going to try a F-50 or any mesa for the first time until this tuesday (im excited! :eek: ) but anyways:

I heard that the mesa recto-verb combo is way much better than the F-50 for distortion and overall tone? And it's only about $350 more than an F-50. What are your opinions, F-series owners, on these two amp's compared to each other?

thanks in advance:D.

oh and btw i'm currently trying to read the whole forum but only on page 4 so sorry if this was brought up earlier

ashjn

07-08-2006, 07:32 PM

You will like the Rectoverb better if you like Mesa Rectifer Distortion tone. The Rectoverb is geared towards that, where as the F-Series have their own tone, which you can hear in many clips on this site

ashjn

07-08-2006, 09:01 PM

Anyone using a Boss DD20 with their F-Series? I just picked one up today...

Dave2

07-09-2006, 07:02 AM

I have a f-50 and love it but does anyone use a treble booster w/ it like a keeley java boost?

hal9000

07-09-2006, 07:20 AM

Originally posted by Dave2
I have a f-50 and love it but does anyone use a treble booster w/ it like a keeley java boost? Dave, welcome to the forum and the F-series Brotherhood! :)

If you'll check back to my post about the HBE Germania Treble Booster hopefully you'll find some answers to your questions. The Keeley Java boost is very similar to the Germania since they are both Dallas Arbiter Rangemaster clones (albeit with different features). I love what it does for my F-100 during solos, for adding a vintage overdrive voice on both the overdrive channels, and tightening the low end.

aerianne

07-09-2006, 08:36 AM

I'm looking into picking up an F-30 or F-50 head... what would be a fair price for them used?

Lt_Core

07-09-2006, 08:46 AM

Last night was my first gig with the F-50. It was a success! My brother, our bassist, could finally hear all the nuances of my plaing, especially since my PODxt/Atomic was soooo directional.

I kept getting "Turn it down!" from our singer. I had to laugh. He's used to my old amp not cutting through. Might have to get a volume pedal to start experimenting with attenuation. Can I still use other pedals in the effects loop if I have a volume pedal there as well?

Clean channel w/ OCD pedal and my Tele was very nice. Great cleans and then some grit with the OCD. Gotta love it!

Overdrive channel and my Ibanez was great for palm-mute, rock, punk stuff. Cut through the mix like a knife. Our sound guy loved it. He said it totally kills my old setup.

So, first gig was great. I'm heading out on a week-long camping trip (no guitar :( ) so I'll check in when I get back. Later, guys!

Jeff

NiCkMiLnE

07-09-2006, 09:43 AM

ashjn

07-09-2006, 10:03 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core

I kept getting "Turn it down!" from our singer. I had to laugh. He's used to my old amp not cutting through. Might have to get a volume pedal to start experimenting with attenuation. Can I still use other pedals in the effects loop if I have a volume pedal there as well?

Jeff

yes

andershoeg

07-09-2006, 10:11 AM

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE

awsome!!

all your clips with an f30?
solo jam./A.H is fucking gorgeous!!!!

Hi Nickmilne. Thank you very much. Glad you like it! No, it is not all the clips there is done with the f30. only the ones saying "f30" in the beginning of the track-name :) The other clips is Amplitube (fake amp :D but sounds ok).
If you want to listen to some more f30, you can have a listen at my bands newest demo, all guitars recorded strictly with the f30. I have linked to our h.p. before in this thread, so don't kill me for doing it again! HERE YOU GO (http://www.frangoheep.dk)

It is the first 5 songs in the mediaplayer on the left :)

B.R. andershoeg

markmann

07-09-2006, 10:15 AM

Originally posted by ashjn
Anyone using a Boss DD20 with their F-Series? I just picked one up today... I have one and use it with my f50. The DD20 has a huge fan base as I'm sure you already know and for good reason. I have several delays but the DD20 is the one currently on my pedalboard.

Be sure to read the manual because it will reveal functions that you won't find on your own.

Have fun and ask questions if you're curious about something specific.

NiCkMiLnE

07-09-2006, 10:15 AM

Originally posted by andershoeg

Hi Nickmilne. Thank you very much. Glad you like it! No, it is not all the clips there is done with the f30. only the ones saying "f30" in the beginning of the track-name :) The other clips is Amplitube (fake amp :D but sounds ok).
If you want to listen to some more f30, you can have a listen at my bands newest demo, all guitars recorded strictly with the f30. I have linked to our h.p. before in this thread, so don't kill me for doing it again! HERE YOU GO (http://www.frangoheep.dk)

It is the first 5 songs in the mediaplayer on the left :)

B.R. andershoeg

ah yeah, i remember!

do you have te f-30 at hand to make one clip?

i LOVED the f30 3guiJAM, .mp3 one ..bloody gorgeous!

ashjn

07-09-2006, 10:17 AM

New Pic of the set up....

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f315/ASHJNBITCH/F-100002.jpg

NiCkMiLnE

07-09-2006, 10:20 AM

droooooooooooooool:love:

andershoeg

07-09-2006, 10:21 AM

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE

ah yeah, i remember!

do you have te f-30 at hand to make one clip?

i LOVED the f30 3guiJAM, .mp3 one ..bloody gorgeous!

Yes I have it right beside me :) I'm about to leave in 15 minutes, so i don't want to set it up right now, but what kind of clip are you asking for? Can do it tomorrow.

B.r. andershoeg

andershoeg

07-09-2006, 10:22 AM

Originally posted by ashjn
New Pic of the set up....

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f315/ASHJNBITCH/F-100002.jpg

Yearh, that looks awesome! Nice setup!:cool:

b.r. andershoeg

mrelusive

07-09-2006, 10:27 AM

:mad: my f-50 / cab is at our practice space and i can't pick it up til monday!!!!! AAAUGH!!

there, that's out. moving on.

i have always found the F-50 tone to be perfect for what i'm trying to do. little tweaking here and there, but i can generally get the perfect sound for my big chord / groove riff kinda style.

However, recently i have started playin in a new band (haven't been in one since i got my f-50). These guys are more 'thrashy' than i'm used to. Think old school megadeth / testament / overkill, etc. The other guitarist in the group uses a Marshall head and gets that brittle, shred kinda tone real well. I've been tryin to find a tone on my f-50 that will compliment it in a live situation without getting too muddy or sounding too harsh. I have the gear in my sig at my disposal, plus the fx loop attenuation cicuit deal.

The only thing that sucks is we don't have a bass player at practice, so that makes it harder to divide the frequency spectrum among us, ya know?

any suggestions for a shred-ish kinda tone with a bad monkey and an f-50?

NiCkMiLnE

07-09-2006, 10:38 AM

Originally posted by andershoeg

Yes I have it right beside me :) I'm about to leave in 15 minutes, so i don't want to set it up right now, but what kind of clip are you asking for? Can do it tomorrow.

B.r. andershoeg

cheers man , thansk sooooo muuuuch

im after a clip showing the 30's metal side, some petrucci type tones. and also a general rock tone (motley crue?)

cheers mate
nick

andershoeg

07-09-2006, 10:43 AM

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE

cheers man , thansk sooooo muuuuch

im after a clip showing the 30's metal side, some petrucci type tones. and also a general rock tone (motley crue?)

cheers mate
nick

I'll see what I can do tomorrow. Keyword = metal :cool:
I'll try with some other guitars then. ESP and Patrick Eggle.....more metal than my tele ;)

B.R. andershoeg

NiCkMiLnE

07-09-2006, 12:01 PM

damn you got it right man!
metal, metal and shred metal \m/

Dave2

07-09-2006, 12:30 PM

Originally posted by hal9000
Dave, welcome to the forum and the F-series Brotherhood! :)

If you'll check back to my post about the HBE Germania Treble Booster hopefully you'll find some answers to your questions. The Keeley Java boost is very similar to the Germania since they are both Dallas Arbiter Rangemaster clones (albeit with different features). I love what it does for my F-100 during solos, for adding a vintage overdrive voice on both the overdrive channels, and tightening the low end.

Hey thanks for the welcome...is that all you use with the drt channel? I have a analogman tube screamer for the clean channel but was wondering if the keeley java would brighten up the dirty channel with maybe a Fulltone OCD thrown in for good measure?!? What do you think?

Dave

Arpie92

07-09-2006, 02:45 PM

has anyone used a F-50 or F-100 with a musicman guitar? to be more specific a Musicman S.U.B.?

and italy won!!!!:D

hal9000

07-10-2006, 07:57 AM

Originally posted by mrelusive
:mad: my f-50 / cab is at our practice space and i can't pick it up til monday!!!!! AAAUGH!!

there, that's out. moving on.

i have always found the F-50 tone to be perfect for what i'm trying to do. little tweaking here and there, but i can generally get the perfect sound for my big chord / groove riff kinda style.

However, recently i have started playin in a new band (haven't been in one since i got my f-50). These guys are more 'thrashy' than i'm used to. Think old school megadeth / testament / overkill, etc. The other guitarist in the group uses a Marshall head and gets that brittle, shred kinda tone real well. I've been tryin to find a tone on my f-50 that will compliment it in a live situation without getting too muddy or sounding too harsh. I have the gear in my sig at my disposal, plus the fx loop attenuation cicuit deal.

The only thing that sucks is we don't have a bass player at practice, so that makes it harder to divide the frequency spectrum among us, ya know?

any suggestions for a shred-ish kinda tone with a bad monkey and an f-50? Generally, thrash tones require a tight bottom end, so I would start off with the Humbucker Metal Rhythm setting in my sig, and then use the Bad Monkey to drop some of the incoming bass. If you start with the gain on the amp around 10:30 and use the level on the Bad monkey to get the overall gain a bit higher it should be tight. If you had an EQ in the loop that would really kick it up a notch because you could go from Metallica scoop to Megadeth midrange easily.

hal9000

07-10-2006, 08:14 AM

Originally posted by Dave2

Hey thanks for the welcome...is that all you use with the drt channel? I have a analogman tube screamer for the clean channel but was wondering if the keeley java would brighten up the dirty channel with maybe a Fulltone OCD thrown in for good measure?!? What do you think?

Dave Dave, I used to run a pedal board with a Marshall Guv’nor, EQ, and Digital Delay, but since I replaced all of my FX with a G-Major/FCB 1010 I haven't been using anything up front until recently. So, I'm slowly thinking about adding some boosts out front and the Germania was my first addition. I'm also thinking about an RC or AC booster to run with the overdrive channel for yet another flavor of OD.

I don't personally think the F-series needs a boost, but it's nice to have some other options. I tend to think of boosts are a way to add flexibility to an already outstanding amplifier. Where I would normally use channel 2 with a midrange tone for solos/lower-gain rhythms and contour for heavy rhythms, a simple boost adds a lot of flexibility. If I setup my amp as before (channel 2 – midrangey), but with the gain on say 10:00 rather than 12:00, I can then use a boost to add back gain without changing the tone at all. That way I have four different sounds at my disposal, including two different levels of gain. You could of course also use the boost’s EQ so then you’d have different levels of gain and tone. Since the RC/AC boosters don’t change the tone unless you want them to, you have a lot of flexibility in your setup while continuing to keep your amps’ sweet tone and feel.

I'm sure the Keeley Java Boost would be a nice addition, and basically do the same function that my Germania does. It'll crunch up the tone and drop some bass making it tighter. If you want to brighten the amp, definitely use the treble knob as there is a lot available. I usually run my treble around 11:00-12:00 with both my Strat and Ravelle. The OCD should also work very well as a boost if you run it mainly clean. Dropping the amp's gain and using the OCD to add gain and a bit of highs and mids will give you two alternate voicings on the overdrive channel

musicdog400

07-10-2006, 08:22 AM

The folllowing thread has a clip of a few different sounds I get out of the F-50:

647 Elm Street (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1303168&highlight=CLIP)

hal9000

07-10-2006, 09:19 AM

Originally posted by Arpie92
has anyone used a F-50 or F-100 with a musicman guitar? to be more specific a Musicman S.U.B.?

and italy won!!!!:D Tommi Inlika uses an EBMM John Petrucci JP-6 and you can hear his new album here: http://www.scenerychannel.com/media.html

andershoeg

07-10-2006, 10:30 AM

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE

cheers man , thansk sooooo muuuuch

im after a clip showing the 30's metal side, some petrucci type tones. and also a general rock tone (motley crue?)

cheers mate
nick

Hi Nick! I've made some ( 3 )clips for you, and all other f-series-lovers for that matter :) Tried to get the tones you asked for, but as mentioned before, cannot play that loud in my appartment. Well, here they are, located lower left:
NEW F30-CLIPS! (http://www.soundvenue.com/band.asp?id=1032)

Hope you like it :)

B.R. andershoeg

Surfcaster

07-10-2006, 11:01 AM

Originally posted by musicdog400
The folllowing thread has a clip of a few different sounds I get out of the F-50:

647 Elm Street (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1303168&highlight=CLIP)

Sounds good. I especially like the clean jazzy tone you've got starting about 45 secs or so in. Is that the clean channel? Can you post your amp settings for that...also what kind of guitar/pickups and effects are you using with it?

NiCkMiLnE

07-10-2006, 11:25 AM

Originally posted by andershoeg

Hi Nick! I've made some ( 3 )clips for you, and all other f-series-lovers for that matter :) Tried to get the tones you asked for, but as mentioned before, cannot play that loud in my appartment. Well, here they are, located lower left:
NEW F30-CLIPS! (http://www.soundvenue.com/band.asp?id=1032)

Hope you like it :)

B.R. andershoeg

dude, your awsome
cheers sooo much!!:thu:

your neerly sold an f-30 with those tones!
can you list the settings please?:thu:

petrucci clip = 10/10, :love: WOW!
motley = 9/10 awosme tone my friend!!

musicdog400

07-10-2006, 11:35 AM

Thanks.
Is that the clean channel?
No that is the gain channel on non-contour mode.

Can you post your amp settings for that
If I remember, gain about 9:00, all tone about 12:00, master vol about 10:00, non-contour.

...also what kind of guitar/pickups and effects are you using with it?
The guitar is a custom built headless, fanned fret that is chambered. The neck pickup is a Bill Lawrence L-500 and the bridge is a Carvin M22-SD.

Here is a pic: Custom guitar (http://www.oz.net/~markw/guitar2.html)

andershoeg

07-10-2006, 12:21 PM

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE

dude, your awsome
cheers sooo much!!:thu:

your neerly sold an f-30 with those tones!
can you list the settings please?:thu:

petrucci clip = 10/10, :love: WOW!
motley = 9/10 awosme tone my friend!!

Thanks Nick. You're welcome. About the settings....can't remember now, except the Petrucci-settings (adjusted knobs for every clip, therefor I can't remember :D ). But these settings where something like this: gain 10 o'clock, treble 1:30, mid 11.30, bass 10, master 8:30.

Cheers! (got to have a beer now...it's hot now in denmark, and playing metal in this heat requires an ale ;)
B.r. andershoeg

andershoeg

07-10-2006, 12:43 PM

Had some probs with the clips. Should be ok now ;)

NiCkMiLnE

07-10-2006, 02:15 PM

ah your welcome, glad you remembered the petrucci one..that thing made my balls rattle:thu:

Surfcaster

07-10-2006, 02:23 PM

Originally posted by musicdog400
Thanks.

No that is the gain channel on non-contour mode.

If I remember, gain about 9:00, all tone about 12:00, master vol about 10:00, non-contour.

The guitar is a custom built headless, fanned fret that is chambered. The neck pickup is a Bill Lawrence L-500 and the bridge is a Carvin M22-SD.

Here is a pic: Custom guitar (http://www.oz.net/~markw/guitar2.html)

Thanks!

That's one wild guitar...looks cool. What's the deal with the fanned frets...never heard of that before?

andershoeg

07-10-2006, 02:45 PM

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE
ah your welcome, glad you remembered the petrucci one..that thing made my balls rattle:thu:

Well...rattling balls is what the f-series is all about! That's why we're all this addicted! :p

B.R. andershoeg

garylawhon

07-10-2006, 02:46 PM

Hey kids, I asked this in a previous post but it was buried in the text so I thought I'd re-post the question.

Is anyone using the Boss GT8 to switch their F50? I know on the first page of this forum there are instructions on a cable, but I was curious if anyone switches with the GT8, and if it switches channels only.

hal9000

07-10-2006, 02:50 PM

Originally posted by garylawhon
Hey kids, I asked this in a previous post but it was buried in the text so I thought I'd re-post the question.

Is anyone using the Boss GT8 to switch their F50? I know on the first page of this forum there are instructions on a cable, but I was curious if anyone switches with the GT8, and if it switches channels only. Since the GT-8 only has one relay it can either do CH1/CH2, or Contour ON/OFF, or Reverb ON/OFF. Since you only get one function, you're really limiting the amp's performance. However, you can buy a MIDI channel switcher like the Axess Electronics CFX4 that will do all the functions and can be controlled with a simple MIDI program change message from the GT-8.

garylawhon

07-10-2006, 03:37 PM

Originally posted by hal9000
Since the GT-8 only has one relay it can either do CH1/CH2, or Contour ON/OFF, or Reverb ON/OFF. Since you only get one function, you're really limiting the amp's performance. However, you can buy a MIDI channel switcher like the Axess Electronics CFX4 that will do all the functions and can be controlled with a simple MIDI program change message from the GT-8.

Thanks! So, I went to their web site, I take it you order from them directly? Also, I noticed the AC8 unit. Is that more of what I want?

Thanks for the great info!

ashjn

07-10-2006, 05:16 PM

Yes you order from them directly. You want the CX4 and Mesa F-Series cable, NOT the AC8!

hal9000

07-10-2006, 06:14 PM

Originally posted by garylawhon

Thanks! So, I went to their web site, I take it you order from them directly? Also, I noticed the AC8 unit. Is that more of what I want?

Thanks for the great info! Yeah, they sell direct. You want the CFX4 since it will do everything you need and have some room for expansion. Also, IMO, the cable is a bit expensive and I can help you build one if you'd like to take that on for a lot less money.

garylawhon

07-10-2006, 06:45 PM

jpoprock

07-11-2006, 08:08 AM

Well, you won't believe the weekend I've had. HA! So, I went to Guitar Center and thought I'd play their F-100 head thru a 4x12 to see if that changed my mind. It didn't. I plugged into the Dual Recto that was next to it, and it was heaven. HOWEVER, after playing that DR for a while, I realized that the tone was super great, but almost too modern. It would be great if you wanted all the covers we play to sound like the Foo Fighters. HA! But it's a nice nice head. The F-100 sounded almost like "rat pedal" distortion. Very ratty and hot. I just didn't like it.

I spied a used/mint Marshall Lead1960a cab there and played thru that a while. I decided that I had to have it, and got it for $450. It's dead mint too. I'm really excited about it. So as I'm leaving the store, I saw this Marshall 6100LM on clearance for $1100. I asked the guy about it, and he said it's their 30th anniv head and kinda like all the great Marshall's rolled into one. I noticed it had all kinds of advanced features on it, plus a clean channel, crunch, then lead. So, I plugged it in to try it out. I immediately went to the clean channel and was quite impressed. For a Marshall, it was outstanding and very usable for MY needs. Not as good as the F100 clean, but still fine for me. Then the crunch channel... it was more gainey than I had expected it too be, but it could be dialed in. Then the lead... it was warm, full, and pure Marshall. I was simply in hog heaven. It took me literally 30 seconds to realized, "My god, I love the Marshall sound". I played with that F-100 for HOURS and never loved it once (except the clean). So, like the crazy fool I am, I bought that Marshall! HA! Now that I've had time to investigate it, I might have paid a little too much for it. They had $1250 in it, so they lost money on the deal. For some reason, they couldn't get rid of it. The sales guy said that since it's 30th anniv, it will surely be worth more in the future. It's really just worth whatever the user thinks it's worth. I think it's damn near perfect for me, so I guess it's worth it. You don't see them on Ebay a lot, so it could be an amp that one day people will go, "Man, that was the amp to have!". So, who knows! I know that it sounds like a JCM800, a 900, and it has a great clean. Perfect.

Ok so... I get to our gig with my Gibson's in tow, new 4x12, Marshall, and F-100. I played thru 2 sets with the Marshall and was loving it. Then for the 3rd set I announced to the guys, "Well, I guess I'll fire up this F-100 for this last set just to say I actually DID gig with it before selling it. That way you guys can hear for yourself the worst sounding distortion ever!". I fired the amp up and off we went.

"Hmm... this amp sounds pretty good"

"This amp sounds DAMN good!"

"I can't believe this amp sounds this good! It didn't sound like that at home or in the store!"

"Gone is that harshness that I heard and it cuts thru great, just like that guy on the forum said it would!"

"Time for a clean sound... HOLY CRAP that clean is the business!!"

"Back to distortion... the distortion is a bit angry sounding no matter what I do, but it's a good sound no question."

"Great, now I have a SERIOUS dilemma!!!!"

"Maybe I'll suck it up and keep both amps"

So.. that's how my thought process went. I play again this weekend, and it's in a club that can handle volume well. I'm going to bring both again, this time I'm going to play the Mesa for 2 sets, and the Marshall for the 3rd. BOTH amps are killer, and both sound different. I just don't know what to do.

My very experienced buddy/bandmate had some things to say. He said he thought the Marshall was the safest bet, but that the Mesa did sound great. My Marshall emits a slight "hum" though no matter what. He thinks it's no biggie and that I shouldn't worry about it. I think it's something in the power section that is causing it. But the tonality of the amp is pure creame.

Couple things to consider are, I can take the Marshall back for a full credit within 30 days. I did pay a little more than I should have for it so that is an option. I can then wait and try and score one on Ebay later if I want to, and at a cheaper price.

The nice thing about the Mesa is that I can change tubes and never have to worry about rebiasing. With the Marshall, if I want to change the tubes, I pretty much HAVE to have it rebiased right?? Or can you just put new tubes in and NOT have it rebiased? It's a tough call. I just don't know!

Or like I said, I can suck it up and keep both and alternate weekends with them and be REALLY happy, but broke! HA!!

HELP!!

garylawhon

07-11-2006, 09:31 AM

Originally posted by hal9000
Yeah, they sell direct. You want the CFX4 since it will do everything you need and have some room for expansion. Also, IMO, the cable is a bit expensive and I can help you build one if you'd like to take that on for a lot less money.

One last question... So is there an ideal placement for the CFX4? I was thinking it would be cool to have it on or very near the amp vs. having something near my feet or GT8. I would then only need about a 1-3 foot special cable, and just a regular 10-20ft midi cable.

hal9000

07-11-2006, 09:34 AM

Originally posted by garylawhon

One last question... So is there an ideal placement for the CFX4? I was thinking it would be cool to have it on or very near the amp vs. having something near my feet or GT8. I would then only need about a 1-3 foot special cable, and just a regular 10-20ft midi cable. Yep, close placement to your amp is best. You can even attach it to the back of your amp if you want and then you only have to run the single MIDI cable from the GT-8 to the CFX4.

Dr. Tweedbucket

07-11-2006, 10:09 AM

I like the F30 the best :idea:

markmann

07-11-2006, 10:20 AM

Originally posted by jpoprock
...
"Hmm... this amp sounds pretty good"

"This amp sounds DAMN good!"

"I can't believe this amp sounds this good! It didn't sound like that at home or in the store!"

"Gone is that harshness that I heard and it cuts thru great, just like that guy on the forum said it would!"

"Time for a clean sound... HOLY CRAP that clean is the business!!"

"Back to distortion... the distortion is a bit angry sounding no matter what I do, but it's a good sound no question."

"Great, now I have a SERIOUS dilemma!!!!"

"Maybe I'll suck it up and keep both amps"

So.. that's how my thought process went. I play again this weekend, and it's in a club that can handle volume well. I'm going to bring both again, this time I'm going to play the Mesa for 2 sets, and the Marshall for the 3rd. BOTH amps are killer, and both sound different. I just don't know what to do.

My very experienced buddy/bandmate had some things to say. He said he thought the Marshall was the safest bet, but that the Mesa did sound great. My Marshall emits a slight "hum" though no matter what. He thinks it's no biggie and that I shouldn't worry about it. I think it's something in the power section that is causing it. But the tonality of the amp is pure creame.

Couple things to consider are, I can take the Marshall back for a full credit within 30 days. I did pay a little more than I should have for it so that is an option. I can then wait and try and score one on Ebay later if I want to, and at a cheaper price.

The nice thing about the Mesa is that I can change tubes and never have to worry about rebiasing. With the Marshall, if I want to change the tubes, I pretty much HAVE to have it rebiased right?? Or can you just put new tubes in and NOT have it rebiased? It's a tough call. I just don't know!

Or like I said, I can suck it up and keep both and alternate weekends with them and be REALLY happy, but broke! HA!!

HELP!! Well, I guess you understand why so many guitar players have muliple amp's :thu:

Here's another thing you should try that might sway your decision: get a guitar buddy to play through the Marshall and you through the Mesa and then switch (preferably along with bass and drums). Record the session if possible and listen to what the amp's sound like. More than likely one will dominate the other and in my experience it's always the Mesa.

Another thought: Experiment with pedals. You might find that you can get an acceptable Marshally tone using a pedal with the Mesa. I doubt you'll get there with a tube screamer or Rat but I get Marshall-like crunch with a vintage Arion pedal. You should pose an inquiry to the F-Series brothers and see what they say because if you can get by with a pedal it will be much cheaper than keeping two amp's.

jpoprock

07-11-2006, 10:22 AM

Which channel do you use your distortion pedal on? The clean or the dirty?

Thanks!
Jason

markmann

07-11-2006, 10:32 AM

Originally posted by jpoprock
Which channel do you use your distortion pedal on? The clean or the dirty?

Thanks!
Jason Clean.

Check this out:
Page three of this thread (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=885856&perpage=20&pagenumber=3)

hal9000

07-11-2006, 10:33 AM

Originally posted by jpoprock
Which channel do you use your distortion pedal on? The clean or the dirty?

Thanks!
Jason For an alternate voicing distortion pedal, I would use the clean channel which accepts pedals very well.

The Electro Harmonix English Muff'n might be exactly what the doctor ordered: http://www.ehx.com/ehx2/Default.asp?q=f&f=%2FCatalog%2F01%5FNew%5FProducts%2F10%5FEnglish% 5FMuff'n

http://www.ehx.com/ehx2/images/e_englishmuffn.jpg

There are also a lot of other cool pedals for Marshall sounds like the Tonebone Hot British: http://www.tonebone.com/tb-hotbritish.htm

http://www.tonebone.com/images/hotbrit-slice-w-awards.jpg

andershoeg

07-11-2006, 10:36 AM

try a Boss OD-3! I do sometimes, and it sounds very classic rock'ish! ....not sure if that is mashall'ish, but it sounds very organic, and have a nice drive, from mild to wild :)

andershoeg

07-11-2006, 10:38 AM

AND the Carl Martin Plexitone is THE Marshall-in-a-box!!

garylawhon

07-11-2006, 10:48 AM

Originally posted by hal9000
Yep, close placement to your amp is best. You can even attach it to the back of your amp if you want and then you only have to run the single MIDI cable from the GT-8 to the CFX4.

Thanks hal9000! Do you by chance have the wiring diagram for the cable handy, or where I can find it. Want to get started on that puppy!

hal9000

07-11-2006, 11:08 AM

Originally posted by garylawhon

Thanks hal9000! Do you by chance have the wiring diagram for the cable handy, or where I can find it. Want to get started on that puppy! Gary, Andy detailed the F-series footswitch connections on the first page of this thread: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=885856&perpage=100&pagenumber=1

The other end can either be three (3) 1/4" TS plugs (CH1/CH2, Contour ON/OFF, Reverb ON/OFF), or a 5-Pin DIN plug to the Axess custom connector. IMO, the custom connector is the way to go. If you can find a full five conductor 5-PIN DIN cable male/male then all you'd have to do is swap the connections on one side to match the F-series pins. You only have three functions to switch plus ground. I don't know what the pin out of the Axess Custom connector is, but with a simple ohmmeter, you can quickly test each pin against ground. Or, you could call Axess and see if they'll give you the pin out.

I bought my G-Major cable parts from RAM electronics and the quality is outstanding (CBI cable, Neutrik connectors). I'm pretty sure this a 5-conductor cable. If so, this should be all that you'll need if Axess' connector is five pins. http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/midi_cables.html

Surfcaster

07-11-2006, 12:47 PM

jpoprock,

To answer your biasing question, yes, the Mrashall would probably need to be rebiased for new tubes. However, www.thetubestore.com will send you tubes with a specfic number so that once your amp is biased to that number, you'll never have to rebias again so long as you indicate the number when you order again. Their prices are competitive, so that would be one option. I used them to buy tubes for my previous amp...an Ampeg Reverberocket, but sold it before I needed tubes again, so I've never tried it out, but I may one day.

Another "Marshall in a box" pedal that I've heard great things about and am thinking about getting myself is the MI Audio Crunch Box. You can hear samples on their website: www.miaudio.com.

jpoprock

07-11-2006, 12:49 PM

Thanks for the info Surfcaster!!

J

jpoprock

07-11-2006, 03:06 PM

What the hell happened to Harmony Central's Review site?? They no longer give you a "Sound" rating, and it's format has changed. Seems much much worse!

j

Alligator

07-12-2006, 06:46 AM

Hello peeps!

Has anyone tried the Hermida Zendrive pedal with an F-series amp?? Guitarist magazine raved about it, just wondering what the brothers thought...

I'm addicted to the F-50 gain channel but thought this may add some flexability. :)

UsrName

07-12-2006, 12:24 PM

Originally posted by andershoeg
Hi again. Thought the f30 needed some clips :) I have recorded a couple at very low volume!! Not very good played, just some ultra-fast recordings ;) So don't expect any Steve Vai-ish here!!! :) Used a sm57 and some pedals (Emma Reezafratzitz, Emma Transmorgrifier, Carl Martin Hydra Boost, Carl Martin Delayla XL). All the clips recorded with the F30 on the clean channel, using a American Telecaster Deluxe. Living in an appartment i was not able to turn the volume up, so actually these clips will not do the f30 very much justice (or whatever it's called :rolleyes: ). Nevertheless, here you are (located lower right, push the red play-buttons):
F-30 CLIPS (http://www.soundvenue.com/band.asp?id=1032)

B.R. andershoeg

Great clips, man! :thu: I am seriously considering the F-30 combo right now, and with these clips, I think I'm sold.

Are you using the pedals mainly because you are in an apartment, or are they necessary to get the sound you have in the clips? Just wondering how close the tones are on the amp by itself.

I got a chance to play one for about an hour yesterday, and I liked the tone, but the story is always different once you get an amp home and start tweaking. ;)

PS. Anyone else is more than welcome to chime in. :)

andershoeg

07-12-2006, 03:27 PM

Originally posted by UsrName

Great clips, man! :thu: I am seriously considering the F-30 combo right now, and with these clips, I think I'm sold.

Are you using the pedals mainly because you are in an apartment, or are they necessary to get the sound you have in the clips? Just wondering how close the tones are on the amp by itself.

I got a chance to play one for about an hour yesterday, and I liked the tone, but the story is always different once you get an amp home and start tweaking. :)

Buy it. You won't regret!

B.R. andershoeg

PS. Anyone else is more than welcome to chime in. :)

Thanks usrname! The last three clips there is no pedals used. Only the f30. Its just the fist clips that i used pedals on. the f30 ones named smething with motleyc, petrucci and rock is the f30 exclusively :)

cacheek

07-12-2006, 08:34 PM

I really like my F-100. Had it about 2 wks now, but I'd like a little more clarity. Ideas on how to accomplish this?

VoodooChild24

07-12-2006, 11:43 PM

Originally posted by cacheek
I really like my F-100. Had it about 2 wks now, but I'd like a little more clarity. Ideas on how to accomplish this?

Cacheek, the pulled gain setting of the F100 gives me the clarity and fenderish type clean i like. If that doesn't work for you how about using a clean boost? Max the volume of the pedal and set overdrive to zero.

Let me know if this works.

ostap_custom

07-12-2006, 11:56 PM

I change all tube to 12AX7EH (with black plate) , all metal film cap's (203 (0,022uf) 473 (0,047uf) 104 (0,1uf)) to papier in oil , change all ceramic cap's (82p , 120p , 220 p ) to metal film and papier in oil (1000 p , 2200 p ,3300 p ,4700p) and have super sound a.k.a. old amp's .....

Grinder72

07-13-2006, 02:02 AM

Hello,
I've an F-50 and Hal9000 directed me here from another thread, thanks Hal.Excellent thread by the way and I'm looking forward to reading it all at the weekend.
Just a quick question.I'd like to get some clips posted up to join the party but I've never done any home recording and I haven't posted any music on the net.So I was wondering if this unit would be a good entry level studio.
Tascam dp-01 (http://www.tascam.com/Products/dp01.html)
It seems pretty user friendly and reasonably priced.

Stephen.

UsrName

07-13-2006, 07:56 AM

Originally posted by andershoeg

Thanks usrname! The last three clips there is no pedals used. Only the f30. Its just the fist clips that i used pedals on. the f30 ones named smething with motleyc, petrucci and rock is the f30 exclusively :)

Thanks, I'm thinking of getting the combo and a 1x12 cab to go with it, maybe a theile cab. Should make for a nice little monster stack. :thu:

Dann'sTheMan

07-13-2006, 08:35 AM

Originally posted by UsrName

Thanks, I'm thinking of getting the combo and a 1x12 cab to go with it, maybe a theile cab. Should make for a nice little monster stack. :thu:

:thu: I tried the F-30 combo with the Thiele cab recently and was BLOWN AWAY (see my post on June 30, 2006). Probably the best "small" rig I've ever played through! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-13-2006, 08:41 AM

BTW andershoeg, YOU ROCK!!! Loved your clips, my friend - I know I'm preaching to the choir, but hey, the F-30 has TONE! :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. I've linked to these clips in the Archive. :)

P.P.S. Need to do the same with the excellent song posted by musicdog400 recently. :cool:

Ogi-wan

07-13-2006, 08:50 AM

Please pardon my ignorance, but what is a Thiele cabinet, and how is it different from a non-Thiele cabinet? (I'm relatively new at this.)

Thanks in advance. :)

Dann'sTheMan

07-13-2006, 09:09 AM

Originally posted by Ogi-wan
Please pardon my ignorance, but what is a Thiele cabinet, and how is it different from a non-Thiele cabinet? (I'm relatively new at this.)

Thanks in advance. :)

Thiele is a guitar cab that uses a ported design (most cabs are not ported). You might have noticed on certain HiFi speakers say, that they use a bass port - basically a hole that leads to an internal cavity. That cavity is tuned to certain bass frequencies, so that the bass is particularly enhanced. The end result is a small 1x12 cabinet that shifts a lot more bass than you would normally expect - some players actually prefer them to say a 4x12 cab.

Check out this excellent interview with studio ace, Jerry McPherson (http://www.playlikeapro.com/jerrymcpherson2.htm). He touches upon why he, and sound engineers, like the Thiele ported cabs. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

andershoeg

07-13-2006, 10:43 AM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan
BTW andershoeg, YOU ROCK!!! Loved your clips, my friend - I know I'm preaching to the choir, but hey, the F-30 has TONE! :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. I've linked to these clips in the Archive. :)

Hi Andy. Thank you very much! :)

Yes the f30 is a gem! Great with the linking! I'm getting more and more happy with my f30, it's so easy to make sound good when recordig. Actually, it always sound good ;)
Sometimes I also think about getting a cab for my combo, but I would also love if it would work with my single recto. Maybe a 3/4 back 1x12". But I would imagine the thiele to be a monster as well with the single recto. Well...no money right now, so .......:cry:

Take care!

B.R. andershoeg

musicdog400

07-13-2006, 10:59 AM

So I was wondering if this unit would be a good entry level studio.
I have had a couple of the analog portastudios and liked them. I think that unit would probably be a pretty straight forward way to get started.

For me, I switched to pc recording and there is no looking back. To be honest, it is a hassle at times, configuring and troubleshooting. But the power is worth it to me. I routinely use 40 tracks and 5-6 plugins on a project now.

UsrName

07-13-2006, 02:01 PM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Thiele is a guitar cab that uses a ported design (most cabs are not ported). You might have noticed on certain HiFi speakers say, that they use a bass port - basically a hole that leads to an internal cavity. That cavity is tuned to certain bass frequencies, so that the bass is particularly enhanced. The end result is a small 1x12 cabinet that shifts a lot more bass than you would normally expect - some players actually prefer them to say a 4x12 cab.

Check out this excellent interview with studio ace, Jerry McPherson (http://www.playlikeapro.com/jerrymcpherson2.htm). He touches upon why he, and sound engineers, like the Thiele ported cabs. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Thanks for making it a bit clearer, Andy. :thu: I've never actually heard the Theile cab, but it just makes sense to try and get the most sound from a small package.

BTW, does the Theile add bass or just make the sound fuller? I'd like the low end to be as tight as possible.

UsrName

07-13-2006, 03:16 PM

Well I just bought an F-30 from the HC classifieds. Check it out:

Mesa Boogie F-30 1x12 combo amp
Asking Price: US$499
Condition: Mint
Age: 3 years
Description:
Mesa F-30 1x12 30 watts combo amp 2003. Absolutely clean- looks brand new. Last buyer never followed through so I am relisting. Comes with Studio Slips custom made cover that has extra padding ,strap to secure underneath and zippered pocket for storage. I replaced the stock Mesa tubes with new JJ's and this thing sings, comes with 3 button footswitch to easily switch between totally clean, mild crunch to full on mesa distortion, has effects loop and footswitchable reverb. Great reviews here on HC.
Paypal preferred but will take USPS Money orders
Shipping is 30.00 to CONT USA

What do you guys think? I'll definitely have enough money left over for a Theile cab now! ;)

UsrName

07-13-2006, 03:24 PM

Has anyone had experience with the Theile cabs? I know they make a few different versions with different speakers and wattage. Just wondering which one would go good with the F-30 combo. I'm looking for a tight, full sound with a good cabinet thump if you know what I mean.

I'm looking at one now with a JBL M112-8 300 watt speaker in it? Would this be too much output wise?

"sasquatch"

07-13-2006, 03:56 PM

i sold my F50 a while back :cry: since, i have been running through amps like a madman. i will be back in the saddle...soon; either an F-50 or stilletto. not to hijack, but man, i just played a stilletto ace today.

:love: :love: :love: :love: :love: :love:

sounds better than any marshall i have ever heard, past or present. holy crap. the cleans are better than the F series :eek: dare i say perhaps better than the lonestar i played right afterwards. :eek: the drives are just amazing. fluid gain is incredible for solos. i think it would mix EXCEPTIONALLY well with an F-series, with the stilletto coming to the front just a bit more.

i know this is the F-series thread, but DAMN, you guys have got to go play a stilletto ACE combo. MESA has their shit together.

:cool:

Ogi-wan

07-14-2006, 01:29 AM

Thanks! That's a pretty good explanation.

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Thiele is a guitar cab that uses a ported design (most cabs are not ported). You might have noticed on certain HiFi speakers say, that they use a bass port - basically a hole that leads to an internal cavity. That cavity is tuned to certain bass frequencies, so that the bass is particularly enhanced. The end result is a small 1x12 cabinet that shifts a lot more bass than you would normally expect - some players actually prefer them to say a 4x12 cab.

Check out this excellent interview with studio ace, Jerry McPherson (http://www.playlikeapro.com/jerrymcpherson2.htm). He touches upon why he, and sound engineers, like the Thiele ported cabs. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

plumptone

07-14-2006, 05:52 AM

After waiting for 15 1/2 weeks, my F-50 in Bubinga with a wicker grille, leather handle and old style "Boogie" logo is finally here. Ran a play test last night and was floored. I finally have the amp of my dreams.

Pics below - hope these work

<a href="http://community.webshots.com/photo/2265105140092976189vjRfin"><img src="http://thumb9.webshots.com/t/42/43/1/5/14/2265105140092976189vjRfin_th.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Webshots.com"></a> by <a href=http://community.webshots.com/user/plumptone> plumptone</a>

<a href="http://community.webshots.com/photo/2012249160092976189arCEXq"><img src="http://thumb9.webshots.com/t/64/64/2/49/16/2012249160092976189arCEXq_th.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Webshots.com"></a> by <a href=http://community.webshots.com/user/plumptone> plumptone</a>

<a href="http://community.webshots.com/photo/2029186350092976189UiINRZ"><img src="http://thumb9.webshots.com/t/44/45/1/86/35/2029186350092976189UiINRZ_th.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Webshots.com"></a> by <a href=http://community.webshots.com/user/plumptone> plumptone</a>

plumptone

07-14-2006, 06:07 AM

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k18/plumpton1/Boogie3.jpg

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k18/plumpton1/Boogie2.jpg

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k18/plumpton1/Boogie1.jpg

hal9000

07-14-2006, 06:15 AM

Plumptone, excellent looking amp! I love the "Boogie" plate as well.

If you are perhaps interested in a final bit of modification, I can tell you where to get vintage white knobs which should match the wicker grill beautifully. :)

Dann'sTheMan

07-14-2006, 07:10 AM

Originally posted by Grinder72
Hello,
I've an F-50 and Hal9000 directed me here from another thread, thanks Hal.Excellent thread by the way and I'm looking forward to reading it all at the weekend.
Just a quick question.I'd like to get some clips posted up to join the party but I've never done any home recording and I haven't posted any music on the net.So I was wondering if this unit would be a good entry level studio.
Tascam dp-01 (http://www.tascam.com/Products/dp01.html)
It seems pretty user friendly and reasonably priced.

Stephen.

Hi Stephen,

and welcome to the F-series Lounge. :) Regarding home recording, my usual advice is to try PC recording first (assuming you have a computer anywhere near your amps).

The reason why I suggest this, is because it doesn't cost a great deal of up front investment to try out PC recording, and thus get the experience to decide whether you prefer recording with a computer or would be better off with a standalone.

To get started in PC recording, you will need a Mic, the appropriate cable and adaptors to connect it to your computer, and recording software. This is not really a lot of equipment to get started - and if you need to invest in a Mic (I already had a SM57 from my live rig) you're gonna need it whichever path you follow.

I got some recording software free on a cover disk of a guitar magazine, and recorded the first three clips in my sig in this way on the first evening that I attempted home recording. Later on, I decided I needed some extra control of the input levels, so I started using my POD in the role of a Mic PreAmp. By the time I was ready to make my first Recording purchase - many months and recordings later, I had enough experience to know that I was happy sticking with PC recording, and what I was looking for from my recording equipment.

If I were you, I'd get hold of a Mic; get some recording software (free on many magazine's cover disks; demo versions of many products are downloadable from their manufacturer's website; there are some well respected shareware recording products availabe too); get it connected to your PC, and give it a go! :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-14-2006, 07:13 AM

For those interested in some of the basics of speaker design - including Thiele and ported cabs, I thought this article was a good and readable introduction:

http://www.ishtek.com/software_ts_sdb.html

Big smiles,

Andy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-14-2006, 07:17 AM

Originally posted by plumptone
After waiting for 15 1/2 weeks, my F-50 in Bubinga with a wicker grille, leather handle and old style "Boogie" logo is finally here. Ran a play test last night and was floored. I finally have the amp of my dreams.

Pics below - hope these work

<a href="http://community.webshots.com/photo/2265105140092976189vjRfin"><img src="http://thumb9.webshots.com/t/42/43/1/5/14/2265105140092976189vjRfin_th.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Webshots.com"></a> by <a href=http://community.webshots.com/user/plumptone> plumptone</a>

<a href="http://community.webshots.com/photo/2012249160092976189arCEXq"><img src="http://thumb9.webshots.com/t/64/64/2/49/16/2012249160092976189arCEXq_th.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Webshots.com"></a> by <a href=http://community.webshots.com/user/plumptone> plumptone</a>

<a href="http://community.webshots.com/photo/2029186350092976189UiINRZ"><img src="http://thumb9.webshots.com/t/44/45/1/86/35/2029186350092976189UiINRZ_th.jpg" alt="Image hosted by Webshots.com"></a> by <a href=http://community.webshots.com/user/plumptone> plumptone</a>

plumptone,

Your Boogie looks gorgeous! :love: A real classy combination too! I have no doubt she sounds as fantastic as she looks. :D Welcome to the brotherhood, and I hope your supermodel gives you as much pleasure as my plain jane gives me. :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Alligator

07-14-2006, 09:09 AM

Hi F-Brothers,

I've noticed a very slight blueish glow around my power tubes while playing. It disappears when the amp (F50) is on stand-by. The tone is fine, can't notice any particular degredation in clarity etc - is this what i've heard called "arching"? If so, how is it likely to be effecting my sound? Is it damaging in any way? what causes it??

I replaced both power tubes with a pair of Mesa 's own, shortly after buying the amp, as one of them had become very noisey.

Sorry if this has already been discussed here - i haven't had time to read the whole thread!

Peace

:)

hal9000

07-14-2006, 09:27 AM

Originally posted by Alligator
Hi F-Brothers,

I've noticed a very slight blueish glow around my power tubes while playing. It disappears when the amp (F50) is on stand-by. The tone is fine, can't notice any particular degredation in clarity etc - is this what i've heard called "arching"? If so, how is it likely to be effecting my sound? Is it damaging in any way? what causes it??

I replaced both power tubes with a pair of Mesa 's own, shortly after buying the amp, as one of them had become very noisey.

Sorry if this has already been discussed here - i haven't had time to read the whole thread!

Peace

:) No, blue glow on the outside of the tube is fine. When you see an arc, you'll know it. It's like a lightning show.

All of my Mesa 6L6s have the blue glow which I love. None of my other amp's tubes look so cool. :)

ashjn

07-14-2006, 10:07 AM

When I first got my F-100 I called Mesa because the tubes were glowing blue and I was freaking out, thought my amp was fucking up or I was going to fuck it up. They said everything is fine and that is normal

plumptone

07-14-2006, 12:15 PM

Originally posted by hal9000
Plumptone, excellent looking amp! I love the "Boogie" plate as well.

If you are perhaps interested in a final bit of modification, I can tell you where to get vintage white knobs which should match the wicker grill beautifully. :)

Thanks Hal9000. I was hoping the "Boogie" nameplate would give it that classic look. Combined with the leather handle, I think it all came together beautifully. I know the vintage white knobs you're talking about - I have read the entire thread here and saw your own custom conversion. You have a gorgeous amp there yourself. At some point down the road I may try the other knobs out, but for know I'm just really digging the look as-is.

I couldn't believe how good this thing sounded when I plugged it in at home. I had play tested a bunch before I pulled the trigger on the special order, and althoughg it sounded amazing, it's never quite the same in a store as it is when you get it into a real-life environment. I opened it up last night, and it really blooms when you get it kicking. I was totally floored. Now my strats sound like strats are supposed to sound. What's interesting to me is how transparent the clean channel is - you really get the flavor of the guitar coming through - and if you drive it a little bit, the sustain is remarkable with single coils. I finally have the amp of my dreams.

Tommi Inkila

07-14-2006, 04:05 PM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

Thiele is a guitar cab that uses a ported design (most cabs are not ported). You might have noticed on certain HiFi speakers say, that they use a bass port - basically a hole that leads to an internal cavity. That cavity is tuned to certain bass frequencies, so that the bass is particularly enhanced. The end result is a small 1x12 cabinet that shifts a lot more bass than you would normally expect - some players actually prefer them to say a 4x12 cab.

Check out this excellent interview with studio ace, Jerry McPherson (http://www.playlikeapro.com/jerrymcpherson2.htm). He touches upon why he, and sound engineers, like the Thiele ported cabs. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.
Thanks Andy for the link!

Now we just need to mail him and inform that he needs F50 and SM57. That's it :p

NiCkMiLnE

07-14-2006, 04:42 PM

bah, my local amps f-30 WILL NOT do high gaim metal...:( i tried the attenuator mod, cranking it, tommi's settings and alssorts

ah well, makes me feel better abour not being able to afford it:thu:

nice to see you back tommi!

Tommi Inkila

07-14-2006, 04:49 PM

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE
bah, my local amps f-30 WILL NOT do high gaim metal...:( i tried the attenuator mod, cranking it, tommi's settings and alssorts

ah well, makes me feel better abour not being able to afford it:thu:

nice to see you back tommi!
Thanks!

I've been around here every now and then but my day job, album promoing and some projects takes so much time that I'm mostly laying in my bed when I have free time.

If you're aiming to deeper sounding metal sound then F50 and 6L6's are the way to go... although the combo models element is not the best for it. For more attacking and cutting metal sound F30 should work better due to power amp tubes.

Some songs coming in few weeks... with AD15VT this time. I'm getting pretty nice results. I'll try to be truly back soon :)

musicdog400

07-14-2006, 05:40 PM

bah, my local amps f-30 WILL NOT do high gaim metal...

That surprises me. My F-50 does fine. Granted it is not a Mark IV or Uberschall, but I rike it a rot.

Lt_Core

07-14-2006, 08:17 PM

Just tried the attenuator mod. Works pretty good. Not true bedroom levels because 100% (off) to 90% is still a big jump but now I can crank the gain and master volume without destroying my windows.

Band practice on in a couple of days and a gig next week so I'll give it a try. Thanks for the info. I didn't solder anything. The 1/4" TS plugs I bought had screws where the tip and lug are so I just screwed in the wire. Easy stuff.

Oh, and my F-50 does high gain pretty easily with my Ibanez SZ720. Not death metal, high-end Mesa gain but damn close.

NiCkMiLnE

07-15-2006, 12:52 PM

nope, i do the attenuator mod, tommi's setting sn it still soudns weak, fuzzy/too bassy and wrong :(
cant sound mike my laney or a cual rec at all...ah well, cant afford one anyway now..new guitar ;)

tommi, PLEASE send me a track off it? i LOVE your stuff, all of the current album is on my works p.a for in-store music!:thu:

Lt_Core

07-15-2006, 01:45 PM

What are Tommi's settings? I'll give them a try.

NiCkMiLnE

07-15-2006, 01:50 PM

more solid, argessive sounds (concrete)contour ON
(b11:00 m1:00 t12:30 G12:30
less agressive, more rhythm sounds(seveno) (b11:00 m11:30 t12:30 G1:30

in o clocks:wave:

Torh

07-15-2006, 06:35 PM

I found I had a patch cable/pedal coupler somewhere, found it, and made use of the single-cable-in-the-fx-loop-attenuating-method, described by hal9000. I wanted to push the master up a bit, in the awaiting of my Minimass. I just wanted to say that it was a far more simpler operation than I thought, and that everyone that have an fx loop (without intending using it for delay and such) should get one of the pedal couplers that costs nothing, and try hal9000's suggestion :)

Lt_Core

07-15-2006, 10:13 PM

The only problem is that some pedals, like delay, are mostly run in the effects loop, right? Until I have some extra cash for a real attenuator every pedal will be in the guitar input chain. Should be fine for live use.

Dann'sTheMan

07-16-2006, 03:20 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
The only problem is that some pedals, like delay, are mostly run in the effects loop, right? Until I have some extra cash for a real attenuator every pedal will be in the guitar input chain. Should be fine for live use.

Hi Lt_Core,

The approach that Neil (aka hal9000) has detailed is a quick and inexpensive way to confirm if you're happy with the results of attenuating in the loop and perhaps avoid the sometimes considersable cost of a speaker level attenuator. Just remember there are several approaches to attenuating in the loop:

* Mix pot mod - quick and inexpensive however prevents you using the loop for anything else (all the other methods below don't).
* Output level control on a pedal - free if you already have a pedal with output level, however have to watch out because some pedals are not happy working at line level in your Mesa's FX loop.
* Build your own line level project box - very cheap in parts and detailed earlier in the Lounge, however need to do a bit of soldering and follow some technical instructions.
* Line level volume pedal - possibly cheaper than a speaker attenuator, however may have to run two long audio cable runs from your amp to your pedalboard, however this shouldn't be a problem if you're already using pedals in the loop.
* Line Level MultiFX unit - most rack type units have output levels remotely controllabe via expression pedal and/or MIDI - so no long audio cable runs, however, watch out for floor based units as some are not happy running at line level.

Hope this summary helps. :)

Big smiles

Andy.

Tommi Inkila

07-16-2006, 03:52 AM

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE
nope, i do the attenuator mod, tommi's setting sn it still soudns weak, fuzzy/too bassy and wrong :(
cant sound mike my laney or a cual rec at all...ah well, cant afford one anyway now..new guitar ;)

tommi, PLEASE send me a track off it? i LOVE your stuff, all of the current album is on my works p.a for in-store music!:thu:
Have you tried to change the V1 preamp tube to something darker and tighter like JJ ECC83S?

My Musicman Petrucci's bridge pickup seems to work well in conjunction with F50. The pickup is essentially Steve's Special and it has mid-scoop. It compliments the F well since it's really mid-driven amp. Petrucci himself changed his pickups to more middle driven D-sonics since Roadkings are naturally middle-scooped and then it obviously works better complimenting each other.

I'll probably finish one of the songs today. I'll have to talk with someone if it's possible to release it before certain date *mysterious* :)

EDIT: okay just got the info. The song(s) will be released on 31st of July.

I'm very happy that our album is rockin' over there!!! :eek: :)

Lt_Core

07-16-2006, 07:48 PM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

* Build your own line level project box - very cheap in parts and detailed earlier in the Lounge, however need to do a bit of soldering and follow some technical instructions.

Hi Andy,

That sounds interesting. I tried to find the project box but, ummm, there's only 100+ pages in this thread :)

When you say cheap in parts, is it less than a Weber Mini Mass? If built incorrectly could it damage your amp? Don't want to destroy my new baby ;) but I'm very interested in trying to build something. Do people in this thread sell them? Thanks for the info!

Jeff

Alligator

07-17-2006, 04:23 AM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

* Output level control on a pedal - free if you already have a pedal with output level, however have to watch out because some pedals are not happy working at line level in your Mesa's FX loop.

Hi Guys - Don't mean to interupt your conversation but i have been dealing with exactly the same issue as Lt_Core and thought a comment may be useful.

I've purchased a volume pedal and am using it in the loop on my F50. With this i find i can acurately adjust the output level of the amp without compromising my tone. The only problem i have with this method is that the F50's FX loop mix only goes to 90% - this means that my volume pedal is great for attenuating the output but i can't use it for volume swells right from zero as there is always that 10% of output not running through the loop. This is quite annoying to a perfectionist like me :)

My question is - can the FX loop mix be modified to go to 100% mix?

Again - sorry to hijack your conversation.

Lt_Core - i hope you find a solution that suits you!

Peace,

Alligator

Dann'sTheMan

07-17-2006, 04:27 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core

Hi Andy,

That sounds interesting. I tried to find the project box but, ummm, there's only 100+ pages in this thread :)

When you say cheap in parts, is it less than a Weber Mini Mass? If built incorrectly could it damage your amp? Don't want to destroy my new baby ;) but I'm very interested in trying to build something. Do people in this thread sell them? Thanks for the info!

Jeff

Check out this post (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=14611847#post14611847) for more on the project box.

Regarding the cost of the components for the box, I suspect it will cost less than $10. The one that Gazz made cost £3.47 which is currently less than $6.50. :)

Furthermore, because the box is only working with line level signals, then it is very unlikely to damage your amp. Effects loops need to be fairly rugged, because there's so many devices that might be plugged in. (On the other hand, if you were trying to build a speaker attenuator box, then there would be significant risk).

I've heard that such boxes are available for sale on e-Bay and such like, but I believe the prices are much higher than the project box approach - unreasonably so, IMO, for what is a very simple circuit. :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Alligator

07-17-2006, 04:38 AM

Hi Hal and Ashjn-

Thanks for the reassurance about my glowing tubes - they do look pretty:)

Alligator

markmann

07-17-2006, 06:44 AM

Lt_core and alligator,

A couple thoughts on attenuation: I've used all of the attenuation methods that Andy listed a few posts back and I want to give a little insight to use as a basic guide for choosing.

In the F-Series Loop:

IMO, an attenuator like a Hotplate works best if you want to use very low or zero volume (use "load" function for direct recordiing with no sound). Keep in mind that you'll lose tone quality below -8 to -12db but is very acceptable for practice.

A volume pedal or other effect unit with an output volume control works very well for lowering the volume to practice levels but I don't use this for TV levels.

The project box that I built works well alone but is most useful when used with effect units that have no output level contol. In other words, using the volume box in line with an effect unit is like adding an output volume control to the device for very low cost.

Hal9000's cable mod works best alone in the loop for using the mix knob as the volume control. This is the simplest and cheapest method when using no effects or when using effects out front.

Volume swells:
A volume pedal in the loop works well for attenuating volume at set levels but for volume swells I highly prefer to use a pedal out front. When using a pedal out front the volume starts at zero and works the same as raising the volume with the guitar volume knob. Basically the tone starts clean and gets dirty as the volume increases.

When used in the loop the volume starts at 10% and is after the preamp so at low volume the tone is already dirty and IMO is not a quality tone until 1/2 to 3/4 of the way up. This is what I found so try it yourself if you haven't already.

Alligator

07-17-2006, 07:47 AM

Hi Markmann (and F-Brothers),

Thanks for the post.

My original intention for using a volume pedal was to be able to give myself a volume boost without affecting the tone too much - ie while soloing. This way I can set the tone between my guitar’s volume pots and the amp and then adjust the over-all volume with the pedal in the loop. My pedal has a minimum volume adjustment, so I can set the standard level with the pedal rocked all the way off and rock the pedal all the way on for a soloing boost, keeping the same tone throughout. This works really well at gigs. At home, I can turn the amp right down and still get decent enough distortion tones using the pedal in the loop, which is all fine. The only problem is the volume swell issue, which is why I asked about the FX loop mix – I guess I can still use the volume pots on my guitar, but it would be nice to be able to fade in a fully distorted tone all the way from zero…

…Also, as there’s always a dry 10% not running through the loop (not including front-of-amp effects), rolling the volume pedal down to zero has the effect of lowering the volume but also slowly mixes out any effects in the loop – which is a cool effect but it would be nice to have the option of running 100% through the loop and using the pedal purely as a master volume.

What do y’all think? Have I missed something?

Peace

Alligator

hal9000

07-17-2006, 08:40 AM

Originally posted by Alligator
Hi Markmann (and F-Brothers),

Thanks for the post.

<snip>

…Also, as there’s always a dry 10% not running through the loop (not including front-of-amp effects), rolling the volume pedal down to zero has the effect of lowering the volume but also slowly mixes out any effects in the loop – which is a cool effect but it would be nice to have the option of running 100% through the loop and using the pedal purely as a master volume.

What do y’all think? Have I missed something?

Peace

Alligator Alligator, I think you're an excellent candidate for converting the loop to series. It's actually quite easy and should only take a few minutes. I can't seem to find the schematic, so I'm sure one of the other brothers here has it available.

markmann

07-17-2006, 09:04 AM

Originally posted by Alligator
Hi Markmann (and F-Brothers),

Thanks for the post.

My original intention for using a volume pedal was to be able to give myself a volume boost without affecting the tone too much - ie while soloing. This way I can set the tone between my guitar’s volume pots and the amp and then adjust the over-all volume with the pedal in the loop. My pedal has a minimum volume adjustment, so I can set the standard level with the pedal rocked all the way off and rock the pedal all the way on for a soloing boost, keeping the same tone throughout. This works really well at gigs. At home, I can turn the amp right down and still get decent enough distortion tones using the pedal in the loop, which is all fine. The only problem is the volume swell issue, which is why I asked about the FX loop mix – I guess I can still use the volume pots on my guitar, but it would be nice to be able to fade in a fully distorted tone all the way from zero…

…Also, as there’s always a dry 10% not running through the loop (not including front-of-amp effects), rolling the volume pedal down to zero has the effect of lowering the volume but also slowly mixes out any effects in the loop – which is a cool effect but it would be nice to have the option of running 100% through the loop and using the pedal purely as a master volume.

What do y’all think? Have I missed something?

Peace

Alligator You should be able to achieve what you're after with the serial mod that HAL9000 refered to, I think it's somewhere in this thread but where is the question.

Have you used a pedal in the loop for swells? Just asking because I can see using one for vol reduction or as a boost but when I tried my Earnie Ball in the loop for swells I didn't care for the effect. That's just me though and I could be in the minority on this for all I know.

For boost I have a couple different pedals that have vol control that allow me to raise my vol when I click them on. That's what I've used so far and like it because it's a bit faster than rocking a vol pedal back and forth.

Alligator

07-17-2006, 09:36 AM

Hi Hal,

That sounds interesting. Not entirely sure what you mean. I've got to run now but i'll log on again tomorrow!

Cheers!

Alligator

Lt_Core

07-17-2006, 09:43 AM

Which is the better box? Probably similar.

http://cgi.ebay.com/TUBE-AMP-VOLUME-BOX-for-FENDER-Hot-Rod-Deville-Deluxe_W0QQitemZ130006292464QQihZ003QQcategoryZ433 75QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

OR

http://cgi.ebay.com/TUBE-AMP-VOLUME-BOX-FOR-FENDER-HOT-ROD-DEVILLE-DELUXE_W0QQitemZ190007685080QQihZ009QQcategoryZ380 74QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Both should be used at the end of the effects loop. Maybe this would solve my Telecaster volume issue. Turn up the volume for my Tele, then back down for my Ibanez which has hotter pickups.

hal9000

07-17-2006, 09:46 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
Which is the better box? Probably similar.

http://cgi.ebay.com/TUBE-AMP-VOLUME-BOX-for-FENDER-Hot-Rod-Deville-Deluxe_W0QQitemZ130006292464QQihZ003QQcategoryZ433 75QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

OR

http://cgi.ebay.com/TUBE-AMP-VOLUME-BOX-FOR-FENDER-HOT-ROD-DEVILLE-DELUXE_W0QQitemZ190007685080QQihZ009QQcategoryZ380 74QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Both should be used at the end of the effects loop. Maybe this would solve my Telecaster volume issue. Turn up the volume for my Tele, then back down for my Ibanez which has hotter pickups. I'd go with the second guy. The parts I listed will run about $10 anyway. You can do it for cheaper, but you have to already have the ability to solder and assemble the box. He used to sell those for $19.99 I believe.

Lt_Core

07-17-2006, 09:54 AM

Yeah, I've never soldered anything or looked at electronic schematics before. I just need something quick that allows me to use the effects loop and that doesn't cost $100+. With the F-50 purchase and some pedals, G.A.S. cash is at a minimum ;)

This may sound dumb, but wouldn't it be easier to have numbers on both boxes? So it can adjusted easily? With shipping one is $24 and the other is $20. Probably no difference is quality, right?

hal9000

07-17-2006, 10:03 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
Yeah, I've never soldered anything or looked at electronic schematics before. I just need something quick that allows me to use the effects loop and that doesn't cost $100+. With the F-50 purchase and some pedals, G.A.S. cash is at a minimum ;)

This may sound dumb, but wouldn't it be easier to have numbers on both boxes? So it can adjusted easily? With shipping one is $24 and the other is $20. Probably no difference is quality, right? I couldn't say anything about the quality since I've not had one in my possession. However, there could be a huge difference in quality based on the type of jacks, pot, and wiring the guy uses to make the box. Both seem to be built off of a standard Hammond project enclosure painted black which is nice and durable. I'd email both guys and ask them what the pot's value and type are and what type of jacks they are using. Then, tell me, and I'll let you know if they are any good. How about that?

Also, I don’t really care for the markings because I would probably just put my own marks in there with a paint pen once I figured out how I like it to be used.

musicdog400

07-17-2006, 10:05 AM

How to make the F-50 Loop series instead of parallel:

Schematic (http://www.oz.net/~markw/Nomad%20Loop%20Series%20Mod.pdf)

UsrName

07-17-2006, 10:53 AM

Originally posted by musicdog400
How to make the F-50 Loop series instead of parallel:

Schematic (http://www.oz.net/~markw/Nomad%20Loop%20Series%20Mod.pdf)

Does this work on the F-30 as well? Does it help out with preserving sound quality when using the FX loop?

markmann

07-17-2006, 10:57 AM

musicdog400

07-17-2006, 11:02 AM

Does this work on the F-30 as well? Does it help out with preserving sound quality when using the FX loop?

My guess is that it works on the F-30 also. I would like to see some F-series schematics to verify.

I have not performed the mod yet, so I can't comment on the sound quality. Running 90%wet sounds ok to me.

hal9000

07-17-2006, 11:04 AM

Originally posted by UsrName

Does this work on the F-30 as well? Does it help out with preserving sound quality when using the FX loop? Yes, it works for all the F-series amps and the nomads apparently.

As far as preserving tone, that's technically what a parallel loop is for. The series loop puts everything through the FX. The real advantage of a series loop is that you can attenuate the signal down to 0, whereas in the F-series loop you're limited to a minimum of 10% which you can still hear.

NiCkMiLnE

07-17-2006, 11:45 AM

i tired it on my laney aor head, success!!
but i get a REALLY bad hum when i plug in the send side, effects, this device or whatever gets plugged in hum like a bee..any advice guys?

Alligator

07-18-2006, 03:02 AM

Originally posted by musicdog400
How to make the F-50 Loop series instead of parallel:

Schematic (http://www.oz.net/~markw/Nomad%20Loop%20Series%20Mod.pdf)

Hi Guys,

Thanks for your help on this – I really appreciate it :) This looks like it would definitely sort out my problem. I’m gonna experiment a bit more with my current set-up before adjusting the loop to series. The schematic looks pretty simple.

Am I right in thinking the series wiring would disable the mix function?

Thanks again,

Alligator

Lt_Core

07-18-2006, 09:06 AM

I'm looking at getting one of those volume boxes on eBay. The 1/4" TS mod works great but I want my delay and mod pedals in the loop.

One thing I don't get is the 10% to 100% knob. With a volume box in the loop where would you set this knob? Does that affect how much of the looped pedals tone is mixed with the amp? Would this get set to 100% with a volume box and various pedals in the loop? The volume box would be at the end of the effects loop. Thanks!

Dann'sTheMan

07-18-2006, 09:23 AM

Originally posted by Alligator

Hi Guys,

Thanks for your help on this – I really appreciate it :) This looks like it would definitely sort out my problem. I’m gonna experiment a bit more with my current set-up before adjusting the loop to series. The schematic looks pretty simple.

Am I right in thinking the series wiring would disable the mix function?

Thanks again,

Alligator

Hi Alligator,

Yes the mod disables the Mix function.

One interesting approach would be to replace the current Mix pot with a similar pot that combines a pull switch. When pulled, the amp would be in Series mode - just push the pot in, and you're back to Parallel operation with Mix control. :cool:

Has anyone identified a pot that would do such a job? :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

markmann

07-18-2006, 09:32 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
I'm looking at getting one of those volume boxes on eBay. The 1/4" TS mod works great but I want my delay and mod pedals in the loop.

One thing I don't get is the 10% to 100% knob. With a volume box in the loop where would you set this knob? Does that affect how much of the looped pedals tone is mixed with the amp? Would this get set to 100% with a volume box and various pedals in the loop? The volume box would be at the end of the effects loop. Thanks! Depends on the effects you use but basically use the loop control to get the effect blend you want and then use the attenuator box control to lower the volume. When I use the box my loop control is set quite high and the box control is to whatever level of attenuation I want which is generally around midway. It's all per your taste though and you'll get the idea once you start twisting the knobs.

Lt_Core

07-18-2006, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by markmann
Depends on the effects you use but basically use the loop control to get the effect blend you want and then use the attenuator box control to lower the volume. When I use the box my loop control is set quite high and the box control is to whatever level of attenuation I want which is generally around midway. It's all per your taste though and you'll get the idea once you start twisting the knobs.

Thanks! I just ordered the volume box. We have 4 shows in the next couple of weeks so hopefully I get it soon.

Jeff

Alligator

07-18-2006, 09:40 AM

Hi Andy

:cool: indeed!

Maybe i'll check Maplin and see what they have.

The only thing that worries me about changing things on my amp is loss of tone. I guess if my soldering is clean and tidy, there shouldn't be a problem... any thoughts?

Peace

Alligator :)

Dann'sTheMan

07-18-2006, 09:44 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
I'm looking at getting one of those volume boxes on eBay. The 1/4" TS mod works great but I want my delay and mod pedals in the loop.

One thing I don't get is the 10% to 100% knob. With a volume box in the loop where would you set this knob? Does that affect how much of the looped pedals tone is mixed with the amp? Would this get set to 100% with a volume box and various pedals in the loop? The volume box would be at the end of the effects loop. Thanks!

If it were me, I would set the Mix knob to maximum (90%), and then adjust the volume box to the desired loudness,

Big smiles,

Andy.

Dann'sTheMan

07-18-2006, 10:02 AM

Originally posted by Alligator
Hi Andy

:cool: indeed!

Maybe i'll check Maplin and see what they have.

The only thing that worries me about changing things on my amp is loss of tone. I guess if my soldering is clean and tidy, there shouldn't be a problem... any thoughts?

Peace

Alligator :)

Hi Alligator,

Yep, as long as you solder cleanly and tidily, then there won't be a problem - the little electrons in the audio circuit won't know that they're travelling through solder that was flowed by a non-Mesa employee! :p :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

Lt_Core

07-18-2006, 10:17 PM

Late night observation....why doesn't the F-50 footswitch have an LED for the reverb? And why doesn't it have a red LED for the Lead channel? The green turns off. The contour channel lights up red, though. Very strange.

I'm sure this has been covered here before. Goodnight!

Jeff

Alligator

07-19-2006, 06:24 AM

Hi Lt_Core

I agreee - The lack of a light for the reverb switch is a real pain - especially at gigs!

I wonder - has anyone managed to install a light successfully??

Alligator

UsrName

07-19-2006, 02:18 PM

Has anyone tried a Black Shadow speaker in the F-30? I find the V30 a little too mid-rangey for my tastes. I like the G12-T75, but I only have the 16 ohm version of it, so I'm afraid it won't sound like it should.

Any others I should consider? Just looking for a more balanced speaker without much breakup. Thanks.

Dann'sTheMan

07-19-2006, 02:29 PM

Originally posted by UsrName
Has anyone tried a Black Shadow speaker in the F-30? I find the V30 a little too mid-rangey for my tastes. I like the G12-T75, but I only have the 16 ohm version of it, so I'm afraid it won't sound like it should.

Any others I should consider? Just looking for a more balanced speaker without much breakup. Thanks.

Hi UsrName,

Touch base with SuperStrat - I believe he once put a MC90 Black Shadow in his old F-30. IIRC he liked the results, :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

UsrName

07-19-2006, 02:58 PM

Thanks! :thu:

benlink

07-19-2006, 04:49 PM

hy guys....I live in france andin France and Europe mesa amps are really expensive...my dream would be a mark IV...but the price of 2300euros for the head makes it too expensive....
so I've got three possibilities:
I have an opporunity to buy a stuio22+ which is really good....and even though I know mesas are well built....I always fear something that goes wrong with an used amp...
So there is the solution of mesa F series :
actually, I would hesitate between the F30 head and F50 head....
from what I read, F50 has more headroom....
the thing is...I love playing old stuff acdc , lynnrd skynnrd etc...which would be better with a sort of marshally amp...so a F30 would fit...
but we love also metal....especially metallica..(I love the metallica black album sound).....so the F50 would be the best for this wouldn't it?
what would you advise me to take?
I have an Ltd EC400 with emg81 and 60 active pickups....
and I think of buying(next year if I buy this amp now)a gibson SG standard ......
thanks a lot guys

thomasmiranda

07-19-2006, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by benlink
hy guys....I live in france andin France and Europe mesa amps are really expensive...my dream would be a mark IV...but the price of 2300euros for the head makes it too expensive....
so I've got three possibilities:
I have an opporunity to buy a stuio22+ which is really good....and even though I know mesas are well built....I always fear something that goes wrong with an used amp...
So there is the solution of mesa F series :
actually, I would hesitate between the F30 head and F50 head....
from what I read, F50 has more headroom....
the thing is...I love playing old stuff acdc , lynnrd skynnrd etc...which would be better with a sort of marshally amp...so a F30 would fit...
but we love also metal....especially metallica..(I love the metallica black album sound).....so the F50 would be the best for this wouldn't it?
what would you advise me to take?
I have an Ltd EC400 with emg81 and 60 active pickups....
and I think of buying(next year if I buy this amp now)a gibson SG standard ......
thanks a lot guys

my F-30 does a great metallica tone in contour mode with the gain at about 5

UsrName

07-20-2006, 08:28 AM

Originally posted by thomasmiranda

my F-30 does a great metallica tone in contour mode with the gain at about 5

:thu: I also love the sound of the black album, which is how I exactly describe channel two with the contour on. I just got to play mine for the first time last night. I'm kina in between guitars at the moment, so I used my kid's Fender squier with the cheapest single coil pickups known to man, you know how they squeal.

Anyway fighting through the feedback, I was able to get Metallica sound, with damn nice cleans as well. I can't wait to get my guitar. I plan to put a Duncan Distortion in it, which should tighten things up nicely. :D

UsrName

07-20-2006, 08:47 AM

On another note, I swore I would never get a Mesa/Boogie because I could never get with the rectifier sound. But when I heard this little monster, I instanly fell in love with the tone, and I compared it to the Nomad 45, Rectoverb, Mark IV, and F-50.

I'd say it's somewhere between a marshall and a recto, but it definitely has it's own tone, which I love. Sounds good a low volumes, but better as you turn it up. I'm definitely trying the FX master thing tonight! ;)

Lt_Core

07-20-2006, 09:07 AM

One thing I noticed at practice last night. (First official band practice with the F-50.)

There is a definite volume difference between the clean channel and the overdrive channel. I tried cranking the clean channel's master volume but it didn't do much good.

I'm using the cheap attenuation mod until my volume box arrives so maybe that's affecting it somehow. Thoughts?

hal9000

07-20-2006, 09:24 AM

Originally posted by Lt_Core
One thing I noticed at practice last night. (First official band practice with the F-50.)

There is a definite volume difference between the clean channel and the overdrive channel. I tried cranking the clean channel's master volume but it didn't do much good.

I'm using the cheap attenuation mod until my volume box arrives so maybe that's affecting it somehow. Thoughts? It's normal for the clean channel's volume to be higher than the OD channel. With the gain set at noon on both channels and using my Strat, I need to set the clean channel's master around 11:30 to equal the OD channel's master at 10:00.

If you have the gain around 12:00 on the clean channel and the master all the way up, you've either run out of clean headroom, or you have a bum preamp tube. I hope it's a tube.

The FX MIX pot master affects both channels exactly the same since it is in the circuit after the preamp. I highly doubt you'll hear any difference at all between the Mix pot master and an external box, other than a bit more noise from the box possibly.

markmann

07-20-2006, 10:20 AM

Originally posted by hal9000
It's normal for the clean channel's volume to be higher than the OD channel. With the gain set at noon on both channels and using my Strat, I need to set the clean channel's master around 11:30 to equal the OD channel's master at 10:00.

If you have the gain around 12:00 on the clean channel and the master all the way up, you've either run out of clean headroom, or you have a bum preamp tube. I hope it's a tube.

The FX MIX pot master affects both channels exactly the same since it is in the circuit after the preamp. I highly doubt you'll hear any difference at all between the Mix pot master and an external box, other than a bit more noise from the box possibly. In addition to that there is a "percieved" volume difference because the clean notes trail off so much faster than sustaining higher gain notes. Clean notes disapear almost instantly in a mix. To solve that problem I do three things:

1. Turn the clean channel up higher so that it is actually louder than channel 2.

2. Turn the gain up on the clean channel a bit to make it stand out more.

3. Use a compressor and set it so the clean notes sustain longer.

I don't run high gain on channel 2 so I never run out of clean headroom.

Lt_Core

07-20-2006, 10:47 AM

Actually, just the opposite. I can't turn up the clean channel enough. Gain channel buries it by a longshot.

I have no idea what tubes are preamp tubes, etc. How would I know if a tube is shot? Thanks!

benlink

07-20-2006, 10:53 AM

so ...so I cannot got wrong with any of these three amps..but..which one would you advise me to take?
and compared to a studio 22+...?
I mean, F30, F50 and studio 22+ all seem great...which one is closer to a mark IV?

Shredhead11

07-20-2006, 11:27 AM

Hello, I hopefully soon will be taking the plunge and buying a Mesa F-30 Combo. From all the clips I heard on this thread, I can tell it can do my music (Metallica, Slayer, Megadeth, Sabbath, Zeppelin, etc.) Hopefully, Guitar Center will have an F-30 on display so I can try one out for myself, because I will be buying one used. Do you think that $650 + the cost of shipping will be enough to get me one of these bad boys?

Thanks for all your help.

AshyLarry

07-20-2006, 11:36 AM

Hey guys, I'm looking for a Mesa and have a couple questions. I'm deciding between a F-30 and F-50 but am not sure what will suit my needs in the long run. I just play for fun, don't gig ever. I'm moving into an apartment also soon so whatever I get will need to sound good, at a somewhat sane level. I currently have a terrible MArshall solid state, that sounds like ass at low volume, and only slightly better when turned up. I do like having the ability to really crank but I have a feeling the F-50 might be too much for me, and my new living situation. So I think the F-30 might be better for me, would you agree? Like I said, it won't be gigged, and will be played just for fun in my apartment. Also, a smaller size than the stupid marshall sounds better too....

Thanks

-Bob

Shredhead11

07-20-2006, 12:04 PM

The F-30 will be way louder than the Marshall MG50. Tube power is way louder than SS power. The 30 would be great for gigging in smaller clubs, or jam sessions. It could be considered overkill for bedroom practice, but you don't need it turned up to eleven.

AshyLarry

07-20-2006, 12:35 PM

Haha, thats pretty much what I was thinking. I'll only be in this apartment for a year then back to a house where I can go nuts so I definetly want to get the F-30. I highly doubt I'll ever need F-50 type of power. So its pretty much decided, time to find my new amp....

-Bob

Surfcaster

07-21-2006, 08:30 AM

There really isn't that much volume difference between the F30 and F50...30W is about 85% as loud as 50W, so you're not really going to notice much difference. Both amps are VERY loud. The main difference between these two amps is tonality due to the different power amps. Ideally, play them both then decide on the basis of tone. In general terms, the F50 has more bottom end and the F30 has a stronger midrange, but it's really best to hear them side-by-side for yourself

Natek

07-22-2006, 04:41 PM

Hello everyone, I'm yet another one who is hooked on the sound of the F series but I DESPERATELY need help as I've been researching amplification for about 8 months now so I don't make a mistake on purchasing the wrong setup. I can't try anything out as I live in a remote part here in the US. Here's the deal:

I own a EBMM JP and my sound goal is to really get the ultimate smoooooth lead tone out of it.....basically just like Tommi Inkila's tone:eek: Also, I really want at least a decent tight low end. Lastly, I need some very nice full cleans.

I'll be playing in my basement and recording mostly. I'll also have an occasional jam with the friends. Here is where the questions arise:

I'm fairly set on the F-50 as I know there's not a huge difference in volume between that and the F-30, and the F-50 has a bit better low end due to the 6L6's correct? Okay, so, first off, keeping in mind I can't spend a fortune, Do I go the head route to a semi-open 2x12 cab with V30's or just go for the combo?

Next question: What is the most practical and MOST transparent means of lowering the volume a tad when playing inside? Some said a volume pedal works but I just can't believe that. Would a simple THD/Weber attenuator be the way to go? anything else?

Last question: As for effects, I've read that the G-Major works VERY well with the MXR dyncomp in front. What would be better sound quality for the same amount of money? the G-major, or a string of stomp boxes out in front (delay, chorus, noise supressor, ect.)? I know the G-major has a plethora of effects, but I really want a quality transparent sound.

I know this is a long post, but good lord I've been looking for a setup for a little under a year and can't make up my mind:(

Tommi Inkila, Your clips took my breath away might I add:eek:

Tommi Inkila

07-22-2006, 04:52 PM

Originally posted by Natek
Hello everyone, I'm yet another one who is hooked on the sound of the F series but I DESPERATELY need help as I've been researching amplification for about 8 months now so I don't make a mistake on purchasing the wrong setup. I can't try anything out as I live in a remote part here in the US. Here's the deal:

I own a EBMM JP and my sound goal is to really get the ultimate smoooooth lead tone out of it.....basically just like Tommi Inkila's tone:eek: Also, I really want at least a decent tight low end. Lastly, I need some very nice full cleans.

I'll be playing in my basement and recording mostly. I'll also have an occasional jam with the friends. Here is where the questions arise:

I'm fairly set on the F-50 as I know there's not a huge difference in volume between that and the F-30, and the F-50 has a bit better low end due to the 6L6's correct? Okay, so, first off, keeping in mind I can't spend a fortune, Do I go the head route to a semi-open 2x12 cab with V30's or just go for the combo?

Next question: What is the most practical and MOST transparent means of lowering the volume a tad when playing inside? Some said a volume pedal works but I just can't believe that. Would a simple THD/Weber attenuator be the way to go? anything else?

Last question: As for effects, I've read that the G-Major works VERY well with the MXR dyncomp in front. What would be better sound quality for the same amount of money? the G-major, or a string of stomp boxes out in front (delay, chorus, noise supressor, ect.)? I know the G-major has a plethora of effects, but I really want a quality transparent sound.

I know this is a long post, but good lord I've been looking for a setup for a little under a year and can't make up my mind:(

Tommi Inkila, Your clips took my breath away might I add:eek:
Thanks a lot! I'm really happy to hear that my clips had strong impact :)

For smoother ride I'd choose F50 head (6L6's for wider and deeper sound, although EL84's are tighter) and a small cab with vintage30s. Those elements have a lot to do with the tone, they're nicely warm and middy. Then I'd change the first preamp tube to JJ, it tightens and even more smoothens the amp. Not bad for 10$.

I find G-Major to be transparent or at least transparent enough. My ears haven't noticed anything degrading although some people consider it to be somewhat colouring. With it you can change the channels from the F too, basicly it does all my effect and channel changing. Just one step on my MIDI pedal and everything changes smoothly. No extra-stepping-courses needed :)

Hopefully there's something useful on the lines above. Thanks once more for checking out my clips. :)

Natek

07-22-2006, 05:15 PM

anytime!! Okay, one or two more quick questions: by small cab did you mean a 1x12 (say a theile?) or a small 2x12?

Also, Would you recomend change only the first preamp tube to the JJ?

Okay I lied, one more question: I've read up a LITTLE on the attenuation through the FX loop. seems promising no doubt. although, could you do this AND run the G-major through the FX loop?

thanks a bunch guys. It's unreal how helpful you all are on this forum to people like me:eek:

Dann'sTheMan

07-22-2006, 05:17 PM

Originally posted by benlink
so ...so I cannot got wrong with any of these three amps..but..which one would you advise me to take?
and compared to a studio 22+...?
I mean, F30, F50 and studio 22+ all seem great...which one is closer to a mark IV?

Hi benlink,

IMHO, the studio .22+ is the closest to the Mark series in terms of voicing. The F-series owes its pre-amp design to the studio, however there is some additional more modern Recto influence in its DNA - especially on the Contour channel.

If you really want a Mark IV sound, is there any way you can stretch to one? The F-series is a Mesa through and through, but its take on the Boogie tone is slightly different to the Mark series. :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Tommi Inkila

07-22-2006, 05:25 PM

Originally posted by Natek
anytime!! Okay, one or two more quick questions: by small cab did you mean a 1x12 (say a theile?) or a small 2x12?

Also, Would you recomend change only the first preamp tube to the JJ?

Okay I lied, one more question: I've read up a LITTLE on the attenuation through the FX loop. seems promising no doubt. although, could you do this AND run the G-major through the FX loop?

thanks a bunch guys. It's unreal how helpful you all are on this forum to people like me:eek:
Either will do... I just recommend vintage30-speaker... probably 2x12" if you're going for Mesa. Avatar makes nice cabinets with nice prices.

V1 (the first preamp tube slot) affects the tone the most. I used that one JJ on it and the rest was stock tubes ie. in "Building The Mood" -clip.

I don't see why the loop attenuation wouldn't work with G-Major. Actually you could do the attenuation with G-Major since it has volome in and out controls. I haven't compare the end results with attenuator though. I guess the attenuator will sound better but G-Major would get you started.

No problem. I'm glad if I can help :)

Dann'sTheMan

07-22-2006, 05:29 PM

Originally posted by Natek
anytime!! Okay, one or two more quick questions: by small cab did you mean a 1x12 (say a theile?) or a small 2x12?

Also, Would you recomend change only the first preamp tube to the JJ?

Okay I lied, one more question: I've read up a LITTLE on the attenuation through the FX loop. seems promising no doubt. although, could you do this AND run the G-major through the FX loop?

thanks a bunch guys. It's unreal how helpful you all are on this forum to people like me:eek:

Hi Natek,

I use the G-Major to attenuate in the FX Loop - works perfectly. If you get an F-series before you get the G-Major, then you can try the Mix mod approach that hal9000 details in his sig, and use this to get an idea if you're happy with the results. If not, then you can of course try the Weber or Hotplate approach. :thu:

BTW, I also find the G-Major to be very transparent. I use a Dynacomp and Wah in front of my F-50, all the other FX are supplied by my G-Major. The strongest FX in the G-Major imho are the Delays, Chorus/Detune and Reverb. You'd be hardpressed to find stompboxes that sound better, and of course, being a Multi-FX unit, you won't run into the higher noise floor issues that are more of a problem with daisy-chained stomp boxes. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Natek

07-22-2006, 05:36 PM

Hi Natek,

I use the G-Major to attenuate in the FX Loop - works perfectly. If you get an F-series before you get the G-Major, then you can try the Mix mod approach that hal9000 details in his sig, and use this to get an idea if you're happy with the results. If not, then you can of course try the Weber or Hotplate approach.

BTW, I also find the G-Major to be very transparent. I use a Dynacomp and Wah in front of my F-50, all the other FX are supplied by my G-Major. The strongest FX in the G-Major imho are the Delays, Chorus/Detune and Reverb. You'd be hardpressed to find stompboxes that sound better, and of course, being a Multi-FX unit, you won't run into the higher noise floor issues that are more of a problem with daisy-chained stomp boxes.

Big smiles,

Andy.

Wow, so some tweaking with the volume in and outs on the G-major and I don't have to shell out that extra $200 and some for the THD? I can't wait to get my F-50 in:cool:

Alchemist

07-22-2006, 05:38 PM

Hey guys, I finaly got my F-30 jazz-fusion rig finished. Clips to come in the future.

I am using my GT-8 as one would a G-Major, and using its extra looping to run the tuner and my maxon phase tone as needed.... and a Maxon OD808 boosting the front end.

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a219/Alchemist88/Picture242.jpg

Dann'sTheMan

07-22-2006, 06:03 PM

Originally posted by Alchemist
Hey guys, I finaly got my F-30 jazz-fusion rig finished. Clips to come in the future.

I am using my GT-8 as one would a G-Major, and using its extra looping to run the tuner and my maxon phase tone as needed.... and a Maxon OD808 boosting the front end.

<snip\>

:cool: Sweet! Have you considered running something like the Axess CFX4 in your rack, and have it switch channels on your F-30 as you select an FX chain in your GT-8? This kind of control gets addictive fast! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Joeytpg

07-22-2006, 07:20 PM

how many channel does the F-series have?

i'm loving the F series so far, but i need 3 channels.....i want a nice Clean tone, a british (rock) sound, and a TIGHT ASS HEAVY DISTORTION....and i need them in separate channels......

???

hal9000

07-22-2006, 08:06 PM

Originally posted by Joeytpg
how many channel does the F-series have?

i'm loving the F series so far, but i need 3 channels.....i want a nice Clean tone, a british (rock) sound, and a TIGHT ASS HEAVY DISTORTION....and i need them in separate channels......

??? The F-series has two channels, where overdrive has two modes, regular and contour. I use my F-100 like it has three channels since I can equalize the volume between overdrive and contour with my G-Major. The way I usually employ the overdrive modes is to use regular for mid-gain rhythm and solos, and Contour for heavy rhythms and occasional solos.

If you really need three discrete channels, I would look at the Mark IV, which does exactly what you're asking.

Alchemist

07-22-2006, 08:12 PM

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan

:cool: Sweet! Have you considered running something like the Axess CFX4 in your rack, and have it switch channels on your F-30 as you select an FX chain in your GT-8? This kind of control gets addictive fast! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

The GT8 has amp controls as well I believe, I have not played with all the options yet as there are so many.... and yes all this stuff gets addicting. One thing I really like about the GT8 is that rolling back the expression pedal on volume bypasses the unit and gives you the amp alone, then pressing it down slowly fades in the effect, its a cool way to introduce an effect, instead of just having it on right away.... works especially well when I use the harmonizer, its like a second guitarist slowly fading in:love:

Natek

07-22-2006, 08:51 PM

So my friend wants to sell me his THD 2x12 cab with V30's in it for about $250. I can't possibly pass up this deal. I've heard so many good things about this cab. I can't imagine how it would sound with an F-50 head that I want to purchase. everyones thoughts??

Tommi Inkila

07-23-2006, 02:16 AM

Originally posted by Natek
So my friend wants to sell me his THD 2x12 cab with V30's in it for about $250. I can't possibly pass up this deal. I've heard so many good things about this cab. I can't imagine how it would sound with an F-50 head that I want to purchase. everyones thoughts??
To me it sounds like a deal :)

Those THD's are good cabinets and I think it will a great match for the F. The sound will be mostly depending on whether it has closed or open back (if those are the right terms in English... just woke up, where's my coffee...). If it's closed, there's more low-end and it's tighter, if not then the sound is more open and it's better for cleans. In any case, the F will sound like it's ment to sound.

Tommi Inkila

07-23-2006, 08:00 AM

BTW,

Checkout this SC topic: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1315186

Another song off the album... :)

EDIT... heh, that link wasn't certainly what it should have been. It's for the upcoming project.

Natek

07-23-2006, 08:19 AM

To me it sounds like a deal

Those THD's are good cabinets and I think it will a great match for the F. The sound will be mostly depending on whether it has closed or open back (if those are the right terms in English... just woke up, where's my coffee...). If it's closed, there's more low-end and it's tighter, if not then the sound is more open and it's better for cleans. In any case, the F will sound like it's ment to sound.

Yeah, the cabinet has the inputs on the bottom with a 2" slot opening in the middle for both tight low end and nice cleans. the top half of the back can also be easily removed if I want that more open sound for the cleans.

Iced Tea

07-23-2006, 08:22 AM

Originally posted by Natek
So my friend wants to sell me his THD 2x12 cab with V30's in it for about $250. I can't possibly pass up this deal. I've heard so many good things about this cab. I can't imagine how it would sound with an F-50 head that I want to purchase. everyones thoughts??

I just bought the THD 2x12 myself new for use w/ my F50 1x12 back in May. I LOVE it. It is closed back with a slot in the back which acts as a port. Has really added oomph and good bass response to my sound that the lone 1x12 does not have. It really fills out my sound and adds that "thump" I previously lacked. For $250 if is it in good shape DO IT, that is a hell of a deal. It's also quite easy to transport w/ the handle on top (though once your amp is on top obviously the handle is no longer accessible, and then it is not easy to move) and fits in the back of my Stratus R/T coupe (with seats down) very nicely. I have never used it w/ just a head but I still say for $250 you simply should not pass it up. Good luck.

ashjn

07-23-2006, 09:33 AM

Off topic but is the Mesa F-Series Lounge the biggest thread on HCAF?

benlink

07-23-2006, 11:38 AM

and what cab do you advise me to choose for a F50 head....
actually the mesa 2x12 vertical cab is quite heavy....and I can have for really a low price a marshall handwired cab loaded with G12H30 speakers......do you think this could be a good match?

hal9000

07-23-2006, 12:46 PM

Originally posted by garylawhon
So, I just received my Axess CFX4 and I'm using it to switch my Mesa F50 from my Boss GT-8. Anyone using this set up or similar? I'm having issues and cannot seem to make things work. The Axess instructions are rough at best for someone not using midi before, and I'm not even sure how to set up the GT8. Argh!

Please don't make me go back to pedals!!!

Any answers, help, links, etc. would really be great. I wrote this a while ago, maybe it will give you some ideas: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=11181689&highlight=Axess+CFX4#post11181689

OnFire5210

07-23-2006, 03:02 PM

So I finally got to try out a Mesa F-Series this weekend. After reading all about them in this thread and various other threads, I was very excited to try one.

I tried an F-50 and an F-30 combo at my local GC. What I found was CH2 to have a very buzzy quality to it on the F-50. It was still present in the F-30, but less so. It wasn't that the amp was buzzing while I wasn't playing, it was what I was playing that had this "buzzy" quality that my bass player friend also recognized.

I'm not a very high-gain player, more classic rockish, so I thought the F series might be good for me. This said, I didnt' have the gain very high at all on the amp. Do you think this might've been caused by maybe bad tubes or regular GC disregard to maintanence?:(

Tommi Inkila

07-23-2006, 03:12 PM

Iced Tea

07-23-2006, 06:52 PM

Originally posted by OnFire5210
So I finally got to try out a Mesa F-Series this weekend. After reading all about them in this thread and various other threads, I was very excited to try one.

I tried an F-50 and an F-30 combo at my local GC. What I found was CH2 to have a very buzzy quality to it on the F-50. It was still present in the F-30, but less so. It wasn't that the amp was buzzing while I wasn't playing, it was what I was playing that had this "buzzy" quality that my bass player friend also recognized.

I'm not a very high-gain player, more classic rockish, so I thought the F series might be good for me. This said, I didnt' have the gain very high at all on the amp. Do you think this might've been caused by maybe bad tubes or regular GC disregard to maintanence?:(

Definitely you need to turn the amp up. If you go way back in this thread you will see where I made the same comment. As Tommy says, if you are below 9:30 it will definitely sounds buzzy (and granted it is still very loud at 9:30). However as I play in a classic rock cover band, I am sure I play pretty much the same type of stuff you do and it wasn't until I had the opportunity to crank my F50 up at an outdoor gig did I really hear it shine. I can definitely tell you that it is all over the classic rock grind/crunch to full on Santana-type distortion once you crank that baby up. I love it. Problem is if you play in a lot of small bars like I do, that is where you'll need HAL 9000's effects loop attenuation trick. But even then there is nothing like being able to crank it up without attenuation to hear the F50 in all it's glory! For that good classic rock tone I find 9:00 - 9:30 on the gain dial to be plenty. Then I kick in contour for more saturation. Rarley do I need to go above 9:30 on the gain to get what I require. Then if you can get the master up to 10:00 or even above, look-out!! Good luck on your search.