Mesa F-series Lounge. Come on in and share your secrets.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Alchemist
Wow you do incredible work, thank you very much. You are making me gas for my own rig!:D The blonde/oxblood combination looks incredibly classy, especialy with the cream knobs. The tan grille is very nice as well, looks a bit like the Dr Z maz amps. Thanks Alchemist! :) I like the Cream/Oxblood combination very much.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Hi Neil,

Have you ordered the jewel light cover too? :p

It looks awesome. I've been very tempted - indeed, I found myself opening this thread up on a number of different screens this weekend, knowing that there were no new posts, all simply to look at your gorgeous mock ups and to daydream. :thu:

I'm SO tempted to pull the trigger too. What was the total cost of the parts that you ordered? Were you tempted to create an entirely new grill so that you could swap back to the black grill if needed? This is one fallback that I've been thinking about in case I make a mess of the conversion job. :eek: (Can you tell that I'm more confident with a soldering iron...) :p

I think I'll wait and see the pictures from your conversion. Do you think you might photo-document the entire process and share here? I think markmann alluded to doing the same. You guys are really turning up the GAS - I think I'm gonna be asking the government aka wife if I can get the all clear to proceed. :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan
Hi Neil,

Have you ordered the jewel light cover too? :p

It looks awesome. I've been very tempted - indeed, I found myself opening this thread up on a number of different screens this weekend, knowing that there were no new posts, all simply to look at your gorgeous mock ups and to daydream. :thu:

I'm SO tempted to pull the trigger too. What was the total cost of the parts that you ordered? Were you tempted to create an entirely new grill so that you could swap back to the black grill if needed? This is one fallback that I've been thinking about in case I make a mess of the conversion job. :eek: (Can you tell that I'm more confident with a soldering iron...) :p

I think I'll wait and see the pictures from your conversion. Do you think you might photo-document the entire process and share here? I think markmann alluded to doing the same. You guys are really turning up the GAS - I think I'm gonna be asking the government aka wife if I can get the all clear to proceed. :D

Big smiles,

Andy. Total price from two different vendors was

From samash.com:
(2) Vintage White Amplifier Knobs (Pack of 6 $16.99) = $33.98

From vibroworld.com
(1 yard) Mesa Jute Tan Grill Cloth = $ 34.50
(8 ft.) 3/16" White Piping = $21.04

Total = $ 89.52 not including shipping.

I have the blue jewel lamp in my Hi-Octane head so if I like the way it looks I’ll just switch over. I hope I don’t screw up the grill, but it’s pretty straight forward and I’ve built some furniture in the past so I’m pretty familiar with woodworking. I’ve seen some excellent tutorials about how to do this very project, so I’m going to consult them throughout the process. I do plan to make a photo-documentary as well. It would be cool to have the original grill as well as the tan one, but I’ll hopefully be okay.

[markmann]

Neil, You did an excellent job on all of these simulated conversions, what a great visual aid this is for anyone intersested in doing a cosmetic makeover like this to their amp. I've been toying with this idea ever since I bought my f50 almost a year ago but in my mind I could not decipher whether or not the update would actually be a desirable improvement. Now I know without a doubt that the conversion will be killer thanks to you.
I think I'll order the materials so that I have them on hand for when I get some time to do the job, and I'm sure I'll do it very soon, but I just don't have a spare few hour right now. Like I said unless someone beats me to it I'll post the entire process to help give direction for those who follow (and it sounds like there will be a few of us :thu: ).

Mark

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
Total price from two different vendors was

From samash.com:
(2) Vintage White Amplifier Knobs (Pack of 6 $16.99) = $33.98

From vibroworld.com
(1 yard) Mesa Jute Tan Grill Cloth = $ 34.50
(8 ft.) 3/8" White Piping = $21.04

Total = $ 89.52 not including shipping.


Just curious, does anyone know how much the custom grill option costs from the factory?

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
Neil, You did an excellent job on all of these simulated conversions, what a great visual aid this is for anyone intersested in doing a cosmetic makeover like this to their amp. I've been toying with this idea ever since I bought my f50 almost a year ago but in my mind I could not decipher whether or not the update would actually be a desirable improvement. Now I know without a doubt that the conversion will be killer thanks to you.
I think I'll order the materials so that I have them on hand for when I get some time to do the job, and I'm sure I'll do it very soon, but I just don't have a spare few hour right now. Like I said unless someone beats me to it I'll post the entire process to help give direction for those who follow (and it sounds like there will be a few of us :thu: ).

Mark Thanks Mark. I’m glad I was able to help you visualize the upgrade, and inadvertently trigger my own quest.

The re-cloth job should be a good learning process. Here is the tutorial I'll be working from: Grillcloth Installation 101 (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=67452&highlight=tutorial+cloth)

BTW, I've changed the Piping diameter in my post above to 3/16" per the spec. I goofed in putting 3/8" in there before. Imagine, almost a half-inch of piping. Now that would look silly. :)

[hal9000]

:) SWEET!

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-50BigPiping.jpg




NOT!

[Surfcaster]

Those graphics are way cool, Neil! But I'm anxious to see pictures of the real thing once someone's done it, so I'll be looking forward to those, too!

[Gazz]

Sorry to change the subject. But its time for me to replace my guitar leads. Has anybody got any views on the current deals/specs/ reliability/ tone sucking etc etc of whats out there at the moment.

I'm thinking either Monster Cables, although they seem a bit pricy or maybe piranha cables.

Does anybody recommend anything

Cheers.

BTW great graphics and ideas on customising the F series. But I will be sticking to the stock all black, I think it looks mean and moody!!! heheheh

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Gazz
Sorry to change the subject. But its time for me to replace my guitar leads. Has anybody got any views on the current deals/specs/ reliability/ tone sucking etc etc of whats out there at the moment.

I'm thinking either Monster Cables, although they seem a bit pricy or maybe piranha cables.

Does anybody recommend anything

Cheers.

BTW great graphics and ideas on customising the F series. But I will be sticking to the stock all black, I think it looks mean and moody!!! heheheh

I've been using 3 or 4 Whirlwind Leader cables in my rig since 1990/1, and in that time, only 1 has given up the ghost. It was promptly replaced my my local store. They sound good too imho,

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. I've already been through a Planet Waves cable that came with my Variax within the first 12 months - the second one has lasted two years so far...

[markmann]

+1 on the Whirlwinds, I've been using them for a long time. I've broken the ends on a couple but have never had any shorting or reliability issues with them.

[markmann]

Hey, check this out:

This amp...

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c65/johnsonunit/Classic-Mesa.jpg


Looks a lot like this...
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000sMesaF-100HalfStackPimpedOut2.jpg

This is one of Hal9000's creations that was posted almost a year ago way back on page one of this thread. I wonder if this is where the recto guy got the idea?

[boonhogganbeck]

I'm really liking my Planet Waves cables. No tone suckage. I've heard really good things about Bayou Cables also.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by markmann
Hey, check this out:

This amp...

<sweet looking recto half-stack>

Looks a lot like this...
<my silly rig from way back>

This is one of Hal9000's creations that was posted almost a year ago way back on page one of this thread. I wonder if this is where the recto guy got the idea? Mark, I would wager that most people who've updated their rigs with tan cloth and white piping are into the look popularized by Bogner, especially with white chicken-head knobs. But I have to confess that one of my favorite color combos on a Mesa amp is from the Tremoverb 2x12 combo with the tan grill and white piping that I see every so often. Of course, the vintage white radio knobs on the F-series kick it up a notch since I've never seen them used on any other amp except the Fender Vibrolux. :)

[hal9000]

Alchemist, here's a little something for you:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000AlchemistRig.jpg

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
Mark, I would wager that most people who've updated their rigs with tan cloth and white piping are into the look popularized by Bogner, especially with white chicken-head knobs. But I have to confess that one of my favorite color combos on a Mesa amp is from the Tremoverb 2x12 combo with the tan grill and white piping that I see every so often. Of course, the vintage white radio knobs on the F-series kick it up a notch since I've never seen them used on any other amp except the Fender Vibrolux. :) I'm sure you're right but what struck me is the similarity between the image you created and the recto, they're almost identical. I also didn't realize that Bogner used piping but I guess they do. Just my opinion but I think the Mesa'a look better than the Bogner's.
http://www.wildwestguitars.com/bogner/med/ecstasy_std.jpg

[Alchemist]

Originally posted by hal9000
Alchemist, here's a little something for you:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000AlchemistRig.jpg

haha thank you so much! thats beautiful, and very helpful since that damn wine red finish is so hard to photograph properly!:D

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Gazz
Sorry to change the subject. But its time for me to replace my guitar leads. Has anybody got any views on the current deals/specs/ reliability/ tone sucking etc etc of whats out there at the moment.

Aa... this is an old question with so many answers.

I don't think there's so much difference between quality cable and these so called "hifi" cables.

I've personally used LifeLines (ProCo) that lasts long... I've had mine since 1995. Now I'm using Planet Waves cables. The cable is a little bit thicker and I like the tension springs, keeps the cable a little bit better in place. I'm also imagining nicer upper end sound with these cables :)

[Gazz]

Hey Hal

I dont expect you could do this but
it would be a challenge for you!
my rig is

F50 widebody combo that sits on top of a black Ampmate.

The effects are mounted on a Boss powered floor board

Cry Baby ( modded to true byapss)
Boss TU2 White tuner
Boss SD1 ( modded to TS808 Monte Allums)
Yamaha Green Graphic EQ
AXL 50's Vintage Tremelo Pedal
Zoom G2 ( in the amp's loop) with a Boss unlatching pedal for tap tempo.

Guitars are
Gibson 1960 Les Paul Goldtop re-issue
Gibson SG special in wine red
Fender Stratocaster Faded White/Cream
Brian Moore Custom Butterscotch with gold fittings
Jackson performer in dark metallic blue
Epiphone Les Paul Custom in cherryy red sunburst
Variax 300 in Red
Shine Telecaster tobacco sunburst

Its taken me a lifetime to build this collection of gear, trial and error and a lot ofo money. I have probably bought and sold 5 or 6 times this much agian to get to where I am now. Thats the GAS for you !!!

[Gazz]

Thanks to

Dan
Mark
Boon
& Tommy

for the feedback on cables.

Going to pop to the local music store and see what they have in stock. I am a little nervous about cables from ebay, I kinda think they have second grade stock, so I want to see what I 'm getting before I part with spondoolies.

Cheers

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Gazz
Hey Hal

I dont expect you could do this but
it would be a challenge for you!
my rig is

F50 widebody combo that sits on top of a black Ampmate.

The effects are mounted on a Boss powered floor board

Cry Baby ( modded to true byapss)
Boss TU2 White tuner
Boss SD1 ( modded to TS808 Monte Allums)
Yamaha Green Graphic EQ
AXL 50's Vintage Tremelo Pedal
Zoom G2 ( in the amp's loop) with a Boss unlatching pedal for tap tempo.

Guitars are
Gibson 1960 Les Paul Goldtop re-issue
Gibson SG special in wine red
Fender Stratocaster Faded White/Cream
Brian Moore Custom Butterscotch with gold fittings
Jackson performer in dark metallic blue
Epiphone Les Paul Custom in cherryy red sunburst
Variax 300 in Red
Shine Telecaster tobacco sunburst

Its taken me a lifetime to build this collection of gear, trial and error and a lot ofo money. I have probably bought and sold 5 or 6 times this much agian to get to where I am now. Thats the GAS for you !!! Oh, I can render all of that, the question is can you afford it? :) Send me an email Gazz: neil@afraiddave.com

[Gazz]

Haaahahah

nice one Hal

trouble is I have no money left after paying for it all !!!

[VLK]

man you shure have a lot of stuff!
go there (http://s3.bitefight.it/c.php?uid=17342)

[Surfcaster]

Has anyone here run their F-series amp through a G12H30? I got one several months ago that I have in a 2x12 with a V30. Anyway, I never really liked the way the F50 sounded through the G12H30 at high gain...it seemed the speaker really brought out the highs in an ice-pick kind of way. But last evening I decided to hook it up to the G12H30 by itself again just for kicks and it sounded just absolutely awesome at any gain level! I don't really know what changed...it shouldn't have anything to do with breaking in because I bought the speaker as a Hellatone 30 from Avatar Speakers, so it was already broken in when I bought it. More than likely it's just my perception. But it sounded so good I was thinking I just need to get another to put in the 2x12 cab and then move the V30 back to it's own 1x12 cab.

In other news, I've got the morning off tomorrow and one item on my agenda is to turn the 2x12 cab from open back into closed back...interested to see how much difference that makes.

[VoodooChild24]

Originally posted by hal9000
Oh, I can render all of that, the question is can you afford it? :) Send me an email Gazz: neil@afraiddave.com

And Neil charges quid instead of US dollars btw. :D

[Tommi Inkila]

Hey guys!

Another Vox soundclip spam http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1171103

:rolleyes:

[Alchemist]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila
Hey guys!

Another Vox soundclip spam http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1171103

:rolleyes:

That sounds awesome:thu:

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Alchemist


That sounds awesome:thu:
Thank you very much! :)

[hal9000]

I got my vintage white knobs. They're actually Fender custom shop reissues. Everybody knows vintage reissue knobs sound the best (all the warmth of the originals with modern quality control). :)

They are a tiny bit smaller in diameter than the Mesa black knobs, but I think they'll work.

I'm still waiting on the grill cloth.

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
I got my vintage white knobs. They're actually Fender custom shop reissues. Everybody knows vintage reissue knobs sound the best (all the warmth of the originals with modern quality control). :)

They are a tiny bit smaller in diameter than the Mesa black knobs, but I think they'll work.

I'm still waiting on the grill cloth. Excellent, thanks for the update. FYI, I found a better deal on the piping at ampwares.com. I'm trying to be frugal since I've got a head and two cab's.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by hal9000
I got my vintage white knobs. They're actually Fender custom shop reissues. Everybody knows vintage reissue knobs sound the best (all the warmth of the originals with modern quality control). :)

They are a tiny bit smaller in diameter than the Mesa black knobs, but I think they'll work.

I'm still waiting on the grill cloth.

Cool! Please post some pics - this waiting is not good for me! :p :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

QUICK GEAR REPORT:

I just tried a really nice compressor on the budget range: Marshall The Compressor (http://www.marshallamps.com/product.asp?productCode=Compressor)

It sounded healthy and transparent as far as I could tell considering the situation (music store, not your own equipment etc.).

I really liked the emphasis knob... you can tweak the compressor to affect more to lows or highs.

Anyway you could compare this to Digitech Bad Monkey in price/quality ratio.

Anyway if you're looking for a compressor checkout this pedal and spent more time with it than I. :rolleyes:

[Gazz]

Thanks for the review Tommy

I had always thought I should have a compressor, because they are so uselful for clean stuff as well as helping the dirt along a bit.

But when I tried one ( a few times ) I just didnt like what it did to the sound. I rather like having to work harder to hold notes, it seems to put out a sense of urgency to the music, a sort of hanging on for grim life to it. Makes it more vibrant.

I have used one in the studio, and there it does make a big difference though.

I have heard good things about these latest Marshall pedals, there are the best built I have ever seen, they weigh a ton and look indestructable, I just wish the Bluesbreaker 11 Guvner 11 and Jackhammer sounded better. They sound too locked in to a particualr frequency for my ears.

Waht do other people think?

[Alchemist]

I used a Boss CS-3 compressor sustainer for years. I've noticed I have not used it much in the past few months, especialy since I got my F-30. I will be selling it off pretty soon.

[estring777]

Is the only diff between the 30 and 50 the watts.

Is the 30 still enough to play small-mid clubs with a hard hitting Drummer?

Thanks

[NiCkMiLnE]

guys, i ve the opportunity for the f-30 or the f-50
can you explain the pro's and cons of each and give an overview of each against the other amp please?

thanks guys

nick

[Alchemist]

There are no cons for either I'm afraid. Only pros.

I own the F-30 head. I believe the majority of the guys here own the F-50. The main and pretty much only real tangeable difference between the two is the tubes. The F-30 uses EL84 (as is common amongst smaller lower watt amps) tubes which tend more towards the british tones especialy with the mids, they have a bit more sparkle, especialy on the clean channel. The F-50 runs on 6L6's which is your typical american clean fender/dirty mesa tone. Very reminiscent of the Santana tones. However given that these are otherwise voiced quite similarly there is much tonal overlap between the two courtesy of the very wide ranging and responsive EQ.

To break this down further, there is a wattage difference, HOWEVER and you should note that these are both very loud amps and such small wattage difference as between these two amps do not make a tangeable difference, they are both giggable, heck my F-30 is driving a big 4*12 cab with no problems, I cant even turn it past 1 or it is too loud.

On the gain channel both deliver in spades. The more you turn up the master volume, the more the tonal qualities of the tubes come out, the el84's giving the typical british crunch, while the 6L6's give a nice smooth warm saturation. With the contour enganged, they are both as mean as a recto, but in my opinion, with much better tone.

You cant go wrong with either amp. I'll probably be getting an F-50 as well down the line just because I think very highly of this whole product line.

I may have missed some points in my description, I'm sure the other guys in here can pick up where I left off.

[NiCkMiLnE]

hmm
so what wuld you reccmoend for a uy who is after the petrucci tone, mean, gravelly and american dirt...but really likes srv clens, fat and warm?

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by NiCkMiLnE
hmm
so what wuld you reccmoend for a uy who is after the petrucci tone, mean, gravelly and american dirt...but really likes srv clens, fat and warm?
I'd say that F50 is a better choice in this case... the smoothness and the low end that Petrucci has in his sound are more easily achieved with 6L6 power tubes.

[Alchemist]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila

I'd say that F50 is a better choice in this case... the smoothness and the low end that Petrucci has in his sound are more easily achieved with 6L6 power tubes.

Yep thats the way to go when focusing on petrucci tone. Though I must say I cover Glasgow Kiss with my F30 plus my gibsons dead on. But I guess the warm heavy tone of the gibsons compensate for the el84's sparkle. As well I recall that a few years ago Petrucci actualy had an F-50 head in his rig, so this would indeed be the way to go.:)

[Gazz]

Hey Nick

a point for you to remember

whichever you go for ( I have the F50) you must get the master volume up !

I fell into the trap of going for high pre amp low master volume and was very dissapointed with the sound initially.

I strongly recommend you read the whole of this thread there are some very valuable comments which you should be aware of.

Happy Boogie' ing !

[Kevin@Tone-Jam.]

well, I get my yearly bonus from work this week. (I work for BMW for those that don't know me). I've lined one up for me to buy as soon as the bonus check hits my bank account. I am so excited! I feel like a kid at christmas. The best part? I don't have to get rid of my Classic 50!

[Divot]

As I said in my other thread, i brought home a brand new Mesa F-50 the other night. After having a few problems with it for the past two days, ive been playing through it for at least an hour tonight with absolutley no problems. This amp is absolutely great for the kind of music i play. I play jazz in a big band and a small combo, and I also play in a funk/fusion group with some progressive rock influences. I can see this amp being perfect for each of those groups. The cleans are stunning and the distorted and lead tones are amazing as well. I might still be in the honeymoon period, but so far I'm really digging this amp. My only minor complaint is that it's loud, louder then any other amp ive owned. But the great tones in this thing more then make up for it.

[Jack Walker]

Hi, I'm a new member here. I've been posting on TGP for a couple of years now. I saw one of Dann's The Man's post over on TGP and followed it here. After reading the whole thread I bit the bullet and bought a F-50. I had previously owned a Mk III but that was about 14 years ago. I had always liked the boogie overdrive but was never really happy with the cleans, that is until I bought the F-50. I've been an old BF fender guy for years. I own a BF 65 Twin (original) as well as an Allen Tone Savor. I was hoping that Randall had gotten closer to his old fender roots with this one and I was right. The only thing I did not like about the amp was
the Black Shadow MC 90. Too hard sounding for these ears. I retubed this amp with JJ 6l6GC's and JJs and Tong-sols in the premap section. I installed a 100w Jenson C12K and the cleans became very BF like. The overdrive cuts very well but it is a little more tame. Rounder and smoother. Everyone in my band told me not to sell that amp. My Tele sounded great through it. Lots of spank for the country tunes and plenty of growl for the southern rock stuff. I plan to experiment with a few more speakers. I have an Eminence wizard and a red, white and blue on the way. I also have a V30 here but it's only 50 watts. I'm a little scared that won't last long. I'll post my findings here for those of you that like to noodle around with the sound of your your amp. I really appreciate all the discussion in this thread. I probably would not have bought this amp if I hadn't read all the information here. I really look forward to future dialogue with you knowledgeable Boogie users. Thanks for your input so far. I'm really happy with this amp.:thu:

[VoodooChild24]

Hi Divot and JackWalker!! Welcome to the brotherhood! I also bought my F-100 last year after recommendations from the good people on this lounge. I say i can never be happier with this amp. Even though i have bought another Mesa (Triple Rec), My F100 still holds its own.

Enjoy your stay here guys! :thu:

[Dann'sTheMan]

Kevin@Tone-Jam - glad the tax situation is working in your favour - tax time for me usually involves the "Man" getting his hands on more of my loot. :p More importantly, hope your imminent F-series puts as big a smile on your face as it does mine.

Divot - great to have you posting in the Lounge! It does sound like your F-50 is an awesome match for the bands you're playing in - very interesting and cool mix imho. Please share some photos, clips etc if you can. :)

Jack Walker - welcome to HCAF and the F-series brotherhood. There are some great people here, and I hope you have as much fun here as I do. You sound very knowledgeable and experienced, yourself - I look forward to reading your findings regarding tweaking the amp with various speakers and tubes. Thanks for making your very first HCAF post in the Lounge, and for namechecking me in the process. :o

I suspect that the F-series Lounge is probably the very best resource anywhere for getting the most out of Mesa's stealth amp, and this is entirely down to the wonderful people that post here. It's great to see the brotherhood widening! :thu:

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Kevin@Tone-Jam.]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan
Kevin@Tone-Jam - glad the tax situation is working in your favour - tax time for me usually involves the "Man" getting his hands on more of my loot. :p More importantly, hope your imminent F-series puts as big a smile on your face as it does mine.


I pick this baby up later this week!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSAA:US:11&Item=7392244704

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Kevin@Tone-Jam.


I pick this baby up later this week!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSAA:US:11&Item=7392244704

Gorgeous looking amp! Have you seen the discussion recently about customising F-series amps with a tan grille? :p I'm only a "little" bit jealous that you'll soon have a custom tan grilled amp of your own! The vintage cream knobs discussed recently may also look particularly tasty on your new amp... :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Kevin@Tone-Jam.


I pick this baby up later this week!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBSAA:US:11&Item=7392244704 Awesome looking amp! This brings back memories of a year ago when I was waiting for my f50 head to be shipped from Chicago. Ripping that box open was just like being a youngster again at Christmas.

[Kevin@Tone-Jam.]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Gorgeous looking amp! Have you seen the discussion recently about customising F-series amps with a tan grille? :p I'm only a "little" bit jealous that you'll soon have a custom tan grilled amp of your own! The vintage cream knobs discussed recently may also look particularly tasty on your new amp... :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

Yes, I have seen the discussiopn and the "concept" pics. So where do i get the cream knobs?

:D

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Kevin@Tone-Jam.


Yes, I have seen the discussiopn and the "concept" pics. So where do i get the cream knobs?

:D

I believe hal9000 bought them from here: http://www.tubetoneamps.com/productpages/knobs/knobs.htm :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Surfcaster]

I know a number of you in the Lounge here have changed out the tubes on your F-Series amps and I'm just wondering how much difference you noticed...was it like night and day, or was it very subtle? Even better, does anyone have any before and after clips they can post? I'm tempted to do this, but hate to shell out $65 and not have it make much difference...especially when my tubes still have lots of life left in them.

One thing that makes me skeptical is that I've swapped brands of tubes in other amps and noticed very little difference, if any. (swtiching between EH and Svetlana EL34s and Sovtek and EH 12ax7s in the Ampeg Reverberocket I had before the F50) Even between TYPES of power tubes...for my little single-ended amp I've got an EH EL34 and a JJ 6L6 and the difference between the two is VERY subtle...all I really notice is ever-so-slightly more bass on the 6L6, but the general tone is pretty much the same with either one.

Any help?

[Alchemist]

I havent swapped tubes on mine as they are fine, no reason to swap yet. However I can tell you from my tube swapping experience with other amps, and this is echoed by people like Mike Soldano. Swapping tubes, especialy when going from quality tubes, to other quality tubes does not make a huge difference. If you are looking for noticeable difference in sound, swapping speakers, and speaker cabinets has the most effect. This is just my opinion, I'm sure others differ, but take it for what its worth.:)

[Mark Blasco]

So, I have tried reading through the info here, but after 30 pages I am giving in the towel and just going to ask: Does anyone know where I can get the info on modding my F-30 FX loop to be serial? I won't ever need to use it as a parallel loop, as many of the FX I use need to completely change the signal. I keep seeing refrerences to the mod, but no amount of searching seems to come up with the actual instructions.

I am also curious if it is possible to get a kit to convert an F-30 combo into a seperate rack mounted head and cabinet.

[musicdog400]

I have the schem to make it a serial loop.

Let me find it and I will PM you.

If the amp had an option for parallel / series loop, and and option for some post-distorion EQ, it would be a nearly perfect amp.

[musicdog400]

OK here is the parallel to series mod. It is actually for the Nomad but I was sent this diagram by Mesa, and told that it would work for the F-Series.

Schematic (http://www.oz.net/~markw/Nomad%20Loop%20Series%20Mod.pdf)

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Mark Blasco
So, I have tried reading through the info here, but after 30 pages I am giving in the towel and just going to ask: Does anyone know where I can get the info on modding my F-30 FX loop to be serial? I won't ever need to use it as a parallel loop, as many of the FX I use need to completely change the signal. I keep seeing refrerences to the mod, but no amount of searching seems to come up with the actual instructions.

I am also curious if it is possible to get a kit to convert an F-30 combo into a seperate rack mounted head and cabinet. Honestly, I don't think it's necessary to change the loop to serial. Lots of us here use FX in the loop set to 90% mix and have great success. So, before you mod the amp, try out your FX in the loop and see if they work with the amp. Also, read the manual to get some insight into how the loop works.

[musicdog400]

In my experience, for what I use the loop for, it does need to be modded. I haven't done mine yet, but an EQ in the loop is only partially effective, I have to max out the sliders, and still don't get enough sometimes. I have even used two EQ pedals in series, in the loop.

I find it hard to believe they they never thought anyone would use an EQ or gate in the loop.

If they would have only gone the remaining ten percent and make the mix 0-100 %, the problem would have been solved.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by musicdog400
In my experience, for what I use the loop for, it does need to be modded. I haven't done mine yet, but an EQ in the loop is only partially effective, I have to max out the sliders, and still don't get enough sometimes. I have even used two EQ pedals in series, in the loop.

I find it hard to believe they they never thought anyone would use an EQ or gate in the loop.

If they would have only gone the remaining ten percent and make the mix 0-100 %, the problem would have been solved. I understand what you're saying, but I'm afraid the problem is most likely in the EQ and not in the loop. Since the FX loop is intended for pro-line level devices, some stomp boxes will not play nicely with the loop which will make them seem less effective because of the impedance and level mismatch. With my G-Major, I use the parametric EQ and I have no problem whatsoever. So, if you tried a pro line-level rack EQ, I'm sure you'd see what I mean. Even though my DOD FX40B stomp box EQ was really noisy in the loop, it had a huge effect on the tone within the range of the sliders. In any case, I’d still be interested to hear about the difference once your amp was converted to a serial loop.

[Surfcaster]

I've got a Boss GE-7 that I use in the effects loop and it seems pretty effective when I set the Effects Mix to 90%, and there's no extra noise that I can detect. When I'm only running Chorus and/or Delay I've got it set at about 60-70% and feel it works just fine... I've never had any noise issues either.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Surfcaster
I've got a Boss GE-7 that I use in the effects loop and it seems pretty effective when I set the Effects Mix to 90%, and there's no extra noise that I can detect. When I'm only running Chorus and/or Delay I've got it set at about 60-70% and feel it works just fine... I've never had any noise issues either. Just for clarification, it was my crappy DOD EQ that was noisy and not my F-100. :)

[Mark Blasco]

Another question: I have a V-twin that I want to use straight into the loop on the F30 and bypass the F30 preamps. When I plug it into the Loop return, everything sounds muddied. If I then take a patch cable and plug into the send plug of the loop, the muddyness goes away, but there is very little low end. Should I have something to short out the send control (connect the signal to the ground), or is that not going to make a difference? Has anyone else had a similar problem? I won't be able to play at the amp until tomorrow, and I won't have a lot of time with it until the weekend, so any help to get me going is appreciated.

I am bypassing the build in preamps for several reasons, and I do use them as well, so answers that suggest I just use the F30 pre's are not going to be very helpful. I am hoping to set it up so that I can switch between the F30 and V-twin pre's with some sort of remote switcher, and that would give me 4 seperate sounds to use (or 6 if you count the contour and mix modes). I am thinking that a splitter before the preamps combined with a swither in the FX loop would enable me to do this, although that is still a ways off. First I have to find all of the good sounds, and worry about the switching later.

[rydogg_sc2]

I have been the happy owner of an F-50 combo for a little over a month now. This thread helped me make the decision to get one and I have never been happier with my setup.

My only problem with the amp is that i get some tube rattle when it gets turned up a little. What are you guys doing to get rid of this problem if you are having it?

[Alchemist]

All combos do that at higher volumes. That is why I prefer head/cab combinations. There are certain things you can buy to bolt to the chasis that give more support to the tubes and prevent rattle. I have never used it myself. I will let the other guys answer this because they know far more than I do.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Mark Blasco
Another question: I have a V-twin that I want to use straight into the loop on the F30 and bypass the F30 preamps. When I plug it into the Loop return, everything sounds muddied. If I then take a patch cable and plug into the send plug of the loop, the muddyness goes away, but there is very little low end. Should I have something to short out the send control (connect the signal to the ground), or is that not going to make a difference? Has anyone else had a similar problem? I won't be able to play at the amp until tomorrow, and I won't have a lot of time with it until the weekend, so any help to get me going is appreciated.

I am bypassing the build in preamps for several reasons, and I do use them as well, so answers that suggest I just use the F30 pre's are not going to be very helpful. I am hoping to set it up so that I can switch between the F30 and V-twin pre's with some sort of remote switcher, and that would give me 4 seperate sounds to use (or 6 if you count the contour and mix modes). I am thinking that a splitter before the preamps combined with a swither in the FX loop would enable me to do this, although that is still a ways off. First I have to find all of the good sounds, and worry about the switching later. You can’t have a switched jack to turn on/off the loop, so you just have to leave a cable plugged-in all the time if you want to use it as described. Here’s why if you’re curious. There are three possible paths the preamp signal can take to arrive at V3b (the return tube). 1) The parallel path, which is always active and mixed in by the “mix” pot, 2) The actual FX send-return path, and 3) a switched parallel path that is disconnected when a lead is plugged in the send jack. So, it isn't that the FX send jack needs a ground switch, it is in fact a physical switching that happens when the 1/4" connector is inserted into the jack.

I think you’ll be pleasantly surprised that the V-Twin pedal sounds quite good through the clean channel. I’ve use OD pedals through the front end to good effect.

If you must use the V-Twin through the FX return, you’ll need and A/B before the F-30’s preamp and V-Twin, and an A/B (in reverse) that removes your V-Twin and runs a patch between the FX send/return. Axess Electronics makes quite a few devices that will probably work well for your needs and most of them are MIDI capable which will probably be the easiest way to do what you need.

[Mark Blasco]

The V-twin that I have is the rack version, not the pedal. I am figuring that I will need to split the signal before going into each preamp, and then bring the V-twin output and the FX Loop send into a switcher box. That will allow me to switch between either the F30 preamp or the V-twin preamp, and in each of those I can switch between the different modes. Once I get it hooked up via midi and a relay box I should be able to get 4-6 different tones via footswitch (with one button press), and that is what I am looking for. At some point in the future I am going to be getting the Roadster, but I really can't justify that right now. If I can get this switching to work, however, I should have no problems with different tones until that day comes.

[hal9000]

Well, I received my tan grill cloth and white piping this morning. Alas, I won't be able to work on my amp until the weekend, but I should have some pics on Monday of a finished amp. :)

[Surfcaster]

Neil,

Didn't mean to imply your F100 was noisy...just wanted to clarify that with the pedals I'm using in the effects loop I've NOT encountered any noise...just to let it be known that using effects PEDALS as opposed to pro RACK effects can be done without noise. However, I'm only running 2-3 pedals in my loop...as you add more pedals I'm sure there is more potential for noise.

PS. Excited to see your 'new' amp!

[Jack Walker]

I installed a new wizard in my F-50 last night. Very good cleans. A little more toward the British side than the jenson of course. The overdrive is fat. Much more than with the C90. This ones a keeper for the time being. At least until it gets broken in.

[Jack Walker]

Originally posted by rydogg_sc2
I have been the happy owner of an F-50 combo for a little over a month now. This thread helped me make the decision to get one and I have never been happier with my setup.

My only problem with the amp is that i get some tube rattle when it gets turned up a little. What are you guys doing to get rid of this problem if you are having it?

I had the same problem, but on a whim, I changed tubes and it was gone.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by musicdog400
In my experience, for what I use the loop for, it does need to be modded. I haven't done mine yet, but an EQ in the loop is only partially effective, I have to max out the sliders, and still don't get enough sometimes. I have even used two EQ pedals in series, in the loop.

I find it hard to believe they they never thought anyone would use an EQ or gate in the loop.

If they would have only gone the remaining ten percent and make the mix 0-100 %, the problem would have been solved.

FWIW, I agree with Neil - this seems more like an impedance mismatch issue than a phasing issue. If it is indeed an impedance issue, then changing the loop to serial will not resolve your problem.

I run some rack gear in my loop with the Mix knob at 90%, and the dry level from the amp is so low that I haven't noticed any phasing issues - if I had, I would have done the mod, as it's so straight forward. Thanks for sharing it again BTW! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Surfcaster
I know a number of you in the Lounge here have changed out the tubes on your F-Series amps and I'm just wondering how much difference you noticed...was it like night and day, or was it very subtle? Even better, does anyone have any before and after clips they can post? I'm tempted to do this, but hate to shell out $65 and not have it make much difference...especially when my tubes still have lots of life left in them.

One thing that makes me skeptical is that I've swapped brands of tubes in other amps and noticed very little difference, if any. (swtiching between EH and Svetlana EL34s and Sovtek and EH 12ax7s in the Ampeg Reverberocket I had before the F50) Even between TYPES of power tubes...for my little single-ended amp I've got an EH EL34 and a JJ 6L6 and the difference between the two is VERY subtle...all I really notice is ever-so-slightly more bass on the 6L6, but the general tone is pretty much the same with either one.

Any help?

I've put JJ EC83S pre-amp tubes in V1 and V2, and changed the Mesa 6L6s to TAD 6L6WGC-STR RCA Black Plate Replicas, and there was a definite change, but it certainly wasn't dramatic. I had to modify my settings subtly.

I like what the tubes did for the dirty sounds, but I probably favour the stock tubes for the clean sound - I think I'll probably experiment more with the pre-amp tubes. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Mark Blasco]

The reason why I want a completely serial FX loop is mainly the reason I have listed above: I want to run both the F30 Preamp and my V-twin preamp and be able to switch between the two in the FX loop before going to the power section. When I am using the V-twin, I still get the hum and noise that comes through from the F30 channels because the loop does not completely cut out the F30 preamp.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Mark Blasco
Another question: I have a V-twin that I want to use straight into the loop on the F30 and bypass the F30 preamps. When I plug it into the Loop return, everything sounds muddied. If I then take a patch cable and plug into the send plug of the loop, the muddyness goes away, but there is very little low end. Should I have something to short out the send control (connect the signal to the ground), or is that not going to make a difference? Has anyone else had a similar problem? I won't be able to play at the amp until tomorrow, and I won't have a lot of time with it until the weekend, so any help to get me going is appreciated.

I am bypassing the build in preamps for several reasons, and I do use them as well, so answers that suggest I just use the F30 pre's are not going to be very helpful. I am hoping to set it up so that I can switch between the F30 and V-twin pre's with some sort of remote switcher, and that would give me 4 seperate sounds to use (or 6 if you count the contour and mix modes). I am thinking that a splitter before the preamps combined with a swither in the FX loop would enable me to do this, although that is still a ways off. First I have to find all of the good sounds, and worry about the switching later.

Check out a device like the GCX Audio Switcher from Voodoo Labs (http://www.voodoolab.com/gcx.htm). You can put the pre-amp section of the F-30 together with the V-Twin rack mount into their own loops, and switch them in and out of your signal path with a MIDI foot controller. You can use the GCX to split your audio path before the pre-amps too - so it's a one stop solution. For more on how such a device can be used, check out my post in this thread (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1152603). :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Check out a device like the GCX Audio Switcher from Voodoo Labs (http://www.voodoolab.com/gcx.htm). You can put the pre-amp section of the F-30 together with the V-Twin rack mount into their own loops, and switch them in and out of your signal path with a MIDI foot controller. You can use the GCX to split your audio path before the pre-amps too - so it's a one stop solution. For more on how such a device can be used, check out my post in this thread (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1152603). :)

Big smiles,

Andy. The Axess Electronics GRX4 (http://www.axess-electronics.com/_p_grx4.htm) will do the job as well. You just plug your guitar into the GRX4's input, and by MIDI will choose which of the preamps will be active.

[gypsyfireman]

Has anyone here run their F-series amp through a G12H30? I got one several months ago that I have in a 2x12 with a V30. Anyway, I never really liked the way the F50 sounded through the G12H30 at high gain...it seemed the speaker really brought out the highs in an ice-pick kind of way. But last evening I decided to hook it up to the G12H30 by itself again just for kicks and it sounded just absolutely awesome at any gain level! I don't really know what changed...it shouldn't have anything to do with breaking in because I bought the speaker as a Hellatone 30 from Avatar Speakers, so it was already broken in when I bought it. More than likely it's just my perception. But it sounded so good I was thinking I just need to get another to put in the 2x12 cab and then move the V30 back to it's own 1x12 cab.



This is a great question. same situation, i have been experiencing this as well. it doesn't start creeping up on ice-pick until it gets a little louder, but when it does, it's definitely there.

Anyone else get this? Is the V30 the culprit here?

["sasquatch"]

Originally posted by gypsyfireman




This is a great question. same situation, i have been experiencing this as well. it doesn't start creeping up on ice-pick until it gets a little louder, but when it does, it's definitely there.

Anyone else get this? Is the V30 the culprit here?

V30s have that upper mid spike, so yeah, that's my bet i do not like them. heck, i even think G12H30s can be spikey. i really like the black shadow (classic lead 80). i ran my peavey vtm through it and LUV it. the black shadow really thickens and smoothes things out. i have tried my F50 through my 4x12 cab loaded with peavey sheffield 1200 (peavey's greenback) and just didn't like it as much.

oh well, it's all personal preference.

[Mark Blasco]

I have been having a hard time getting different tones out of my F30 on the distorted channel. The EQ seems to do very little once there is any crunch going on (as soon as the gain is above 9:00). Is this normal? I recorded a few clips to demonstrate what I mean. They are all recorded in contour mode, and the settings are all read aloud before each section (there are 3 total). Here are my questions:

Does this sound correct to you?

Is there a big difference in the tones, and am I just tone deaf?

I don't have this problem with my V-twin. Every time I change the EQ I can hear a definite change, even with lots of gain. Does this mean that the V-twin's EQ is after the distortion?


http://www.podcastthemes.com/audio/f30tonetest.mp3

Thanks!

[Gazz]

Mark

I have listened to your samples. Here are my thoughts

I can hear a change in the eq, but not much. I think I know what you are trying to achieve. Firstly my F50 combo sounds almost the same as your samples. But I dont use the controur channel, in my view it has been voiced with a definite mid scoop, and by dialling in more mids and varying the treble you cant change it too much, its like a pre set.

I can get more variation using the non contour dirt channel by altering the settings the way you mention.

Also I think if you want to change the tone that much I would use a graphic in front of the pre amp, it is my understanding that eq on these boogies is passive and also one band affects another, it was described on this board a while ago , the treble afftects the bass, affects the mids and so on. To get more dirt increase the treble, to get more mids turn the treble and bass down. Boogies eq seems to work differently.

What do others think?

Good luck with your quest.

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by Mark Blasco
I have been having a hard time getting different tones out of my F30 on the distorted channel. The EQ seems to do very little once there is any crunch going on (as soon as the gain is above 9:00). Is this normal? I recorded a few clips to demonstrate what I mean. They are all recorded in contour mode, and the settings are all read aloud before each section (there are 3 total). Here are my questions:

Does this sound correct to you?

Is there a big difference in the tones, and am I just tone deaf?

I don't have this problem with my V-twin. Every time I change the EQ I can hear a definite change, even with lots of gain. Does this mean that the V-twin's EQ is after the distortion?


http://www.podcastthemes.com/audio/f30tonetest.mp3

Thanks!

I agree the tone controls on the lead channel are pretty subtle...probably my biggest complaint with the amp. For some reason when I bought the amp I thought the tone stacks were post-gain, but I guess if the preamp is based on the Bassman it's pretty clear they aren't...can't do much about it now, anyway. Fortunately, the amp's basic tone is good. I do occasionally use a Boss GE-7 in the effects loop for a little more radical tone shaping, but not regularly.

Gazz, you raise an interesting point about the contour...I really don't like the amp w/o the contour, so I rarely disengage it. But I'll have to try it to see if the tone controls have more impact when it's not engaged.

[musicdog400]

The tone controls on the F series do next to nothing with any gain dialed in. Lowering the bass does help tighten up the metal sound a bit.

Ironically, if you set bass, mid, and treble to zero, you get no sound.

[Mark Blasco]

Well, I'm kind of glad that everything is working right, and a little upset that this is the only tone that it is going to make at high gain settings. Oh well, at least it sounds pretty good. I guess I was expecting more after using the V-twin preamp, where the EQ makes a dramatic change in the sound. Thanks for helping me straighten that out!

[musicdog400]

I had the same frustration. So I just put an EQ in the loop, and was further frustrated that the EQ only had partial effect since the parallel loop only dials to 90%.

Even with the few gripes I have, it is still my favorite amp. It is too trebly at apartment volumes with high gain, but using my weber mass, or an EQ in the loop fixes that.

[hal9000]

Here are a couple of thoughts on the OD EQ in accordance with the F-series schematics. First, the EQ is directly in the middle of the four tube stages before the FX loop. So, in the traditional sense, it's neither before nor after the gain stages, but right in-between. Second, when all of the EQ controls are set to minimum position (7:00) there will be no signal because the tone stack will be shorting the previous stage's output. The clean channel's EQ has the same property as well. Third, the OD gain control is right after the input stage, which is why it is so powerful. In theory, you could get a lot more mileage out of the OD tone stack by drastically cutting all the controls and adding back until you get the tone you’re after. The amp will be quieter than you’re used to though since a lot of the signal will be attenuated by the tone stack. Finally, the contour channel has a switchable resistor on the tone stack treble control that moves the frequency and thus its affect on the other tone controls.

In my setup, I use both the OD and contour channel set exactly the same for all of my band’s songs. However, the dynamics with which I play, the guitars and the pickups I choose to use per song really give me the range of tones I enjoy about the rig so much. Honestly, I’ve heard recordings of a single track done with about 10 different amps and they all sounded so similar it was hard to pick out which amp and track went together. So, the same player with the same guitar is going to sound similar through different amps, so I would expect the same of the F-30, even with the different settings you used.

Mark, one of the items we haven’t discussed yet is your guitar. With a sufficiently high output humbucker, the relative difference in the settings will be much less apparent simply because you’re driving the input hard. I know that my setting called “Vintage High Gain” has a drastically different dynamic feel to my normal modern high gain settings when I play with my Strat's bridge HB. If I play lightly I can almost get clean tones, but when I dig in the amp overdrives wonderfully. I also use my Strat’s neck sc for solos over clean songs and that works great since the output is so much lower than a hb and the neck’s bass smoothes the tone which is sweet for legato lines.

Anyway, these two clips posted way back are a good illustration of the differences in tone between the OD on Contour using my Fat Strat’s HB with the mic left in the same position.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000ModedMarshallToneSetting.jpg

F-100 Crunchy Clip: Strong Woman (http://www.soundclick.com/util/downloadSong.cfm?ID=3078769&key=E79C7508-C)

The bass EQ was on 9:00 above.

Here's another recording from the same session called Dig. My Strat is in dropped-D and I used the bridge HB into my F-100 with the contour channel set as follows:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000HumbuckerMetalRhythmCH2Contour.jpg

Dig (http://www.soundclick.com/util/downloadSong.cfm?ID=3093990&key=2F0FB10E-E)

[Gazz]

Sorry to ask this but

does anyone have or know where I can find a guitar tab for Gary Moore's Texas Strut.

I have searched high and low on the net and cant find it !

Maybe some kind soul has it in their collection.

Thanks

ps Great explanation of the tone controls in the F series, thanks Hal !

[Dann'sTheMan]

I think the recent discussion about the F-series' tone controls' effectiveness is really interesting. I wanted to add another angle into the mix - that of an amp's voicing, and our expectations.

We're all familiar with amps being discussed with reference to Fender or Marshall, to Mesa or Vox. We're know there are often sub-categories such as Recto or Mark, Tweed or Blackface, JTM or JCM, etc., etc. The point I'm making is that we would always expect an AC30 to have its intrinsic sonic signature, its tonal character, its voicing - regardless of the amount of gain dialled. :cool:

I think it has always been like this with tube amps. When Fender claimed to have created a Marshall killer (or vice versa), we were all skeptical, and deep down knew it would still sound like a Fender. With tube amps, our expectations are generally set within the family range of the manufacturer. Things changed a little during the rack era - but even then, multiple pre-amps were often combined. We've had active EQ technology for a long time, and we recognise its value at certain points in the audio signal chain. Nevertheless it's never become popular in the amp's tone stack, because imo, it tends to sound contrived and less "natural". Things changed even more with the emergence of modelling technology and it's ability to switch between voicings at will - authenticity discussions aside, I don't think many have similar expectations of tube technology?!

The humble passive TMB tone stack may be misnamed as its job imo is not primarily about changing an amp's voicing. Its position amongst the gain stages alters its effectiveness in both shaping EQ AND in altering the gain structure. Consequently, the tone stack is as much about setting up the "feel", "response" and "envelope" of a sound as it is setting up the tweaking of the EQ - and as such, the F-series' is effective. When there is talk that the F-series can sound like a Recto, to me this means that a similar attack and grit can be dialled, that a similar snarl and aggression to the notes and chords can be felt, not so much that a similar amount of bass is being pushed. In the context of a mix, the TMB tone stack is about effecting the envelope of the guitar tone in those middle guitar frequencies, not just shaping the EQ - you might even argue, the EQ shaping job is best left to production. :eek:

These days, when looking for a more vintage tone, I often find myself dialling in feel first, and then boosting the input to get the right level of dirt. Conversely, when I'm looking for a searing lead or more modern tone, I turn off my compressor and let the amp do its thing - that voicing that I fell in love with.

With the F-series, I can always desire a tone with the right feel and response for the target song. I believe it's one of the most versatile tube amps available, with a unique voicing bursting with character. :)

So what do you guys think? What should our expectations be regarding the limits of a tube amp's voicing? What kind of limitations have you run into with the tone controls on your Boogies?

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. Here's a searing setting that I was having fun with last night using my PRS Bridge HB: Contour channel; G - 3; T - 12.30; M - 3.30; B - 8.15

[markmann]

In my experience ALL of the amp's I've owned have had tonal control limitations... some more than others. If I was to compare my f50 to the others I've used I would say that the f50 was as or more versitile than all the others. Maybe I've led a sheltered life? But I'm strickly talking about tube amp's, not modelers or pedals.

I've had/have preamps and pedals that can provide drastic changes to the character and tone of a signal but IMO is a fantasy to expect that from my amp. Between the green, red and contour modes I think my f50 does a respectable job of giving a variety of voicings within it's particular Mesa range. Obviously at high gain you lose some control but what control I do have is more than I've experienced in the past.

Also, Hal9000 brought up a good point about guitars. I tend to use low output pup's on all of my guitars that allows the true voice of the guitar come through better and allow my amp to handle the drive.

[ashjn]

Here is a picture of my F-100.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f315/ASHJNBITCH/51307464.jpg

I have another 2x12 and I leave it at our practice space. I transport the head back and forth.


Here is a picture of the stack without the Furman and AKG

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f315/ASHJNBITCH/a42dfb60.jpg

[Alchemist]

Originally posted by ashjn
Here is a picture of my F-100.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f315/ASHJNBITCH/51307464.jpg

I have another 2x12 and I leave it at our practice space. I transport the head back and forth.


Here is a picture of the stack without the Furman and AKG

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f315/ASHJNBITCH/a42dfb60.jpg

Very nice:love: :wave:

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Alchemist


Very nice:love: :wave:

+1. Love the cases - where did you get them? :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[ashjn]

A family friend is in the construction business. He built them for me..

Here is a shot of the cases

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f315/ASHJNBITCH/f5db82d6.jpg



Here is a couple shots of my guitars

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f315/ASHJNBITCH/1e9372e7.jpg


http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f315/ASHJNBITCH/83b7887a.jpg

[Surfcaster]

Are the cases solid wood? They are nice. Do you leave the head in the case when you play? Just wondering if it gets enough ventilation that way...looks pretty tight, especially with the Furman in there.

["sasquatch"]

ok,
i am getting pissed! :mad:

my F50 is in the shop for the SECOND TIME in LESS THAN A YEAR!

the first time, when you would plug in, the amp acted like it was constantly trying to switch channels...a really fast clicking noise with the amp not working. i had to ship to to CALI back to the factory.

second time (now) the treble pot on the gain channel is shorting out and causing a complete lack of signal. i took the knob off to reveal a broken pot! :mad: i have never taken it off so it either happened at the dealership or the factory.

i have #221 built, and F50 in the narrowbody (f30) frame. i read somewhere that after #400 they changed the circuit. well, i love my amp, but dammit i can't take any more repairs! i would really like an F50 replacement, but that ain't going to happen. i love the sound but have been COMPLETELY unhappy with the reliability with this amp. i have a peavey VTM60 w/4x12 beast (JCM 800 clone with 6L6s) with all the original tubes still in it (made in USA PEAVEY TUBES!!:eek: ) That's some old tubes!
.....anyway, it sees more playing time than my f50 b/c of the whole reliability thing. 2 repairs like that in less than 1 year! i still have 3.5 years left in the warranty, but i am tired of problems. i hate to do it, but i might jump ship on that damn thing. thinking about a peavey valveking or traynor YCV50 Blue (EL34).

bleh...........love hate love (AIC Facelift version playing in my head....lol.....)

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by doggage5050
ok,
i am getting pissed! :mad:

my F50 is in the shop for the SECOND TIME in LESS THAN A YEAR!

the first time, when you would plug in, the amp acted like it was constantly trying to switch channels...a really fast clicking noise with the amp not working. i had to ship to to CALI back to the factory.

second time (now) the treble pot on the gain channel is shorting out and causing a complete lack of signal. i took the knob off to reveal a broken pot! :mad: i have never taken it off so it either happened at the dealership or the factory.

i have #221 built, and F50 in the narrowbody (f30) frame. i read somewhere that after #400 they changed the circuit. well, i love my amp, but dammit i can't take any more repairs! i would really like an F50 replacement, but that ain't going to happen. i love the sound but have been COMPLETELY unhappy with the reliability with this amp. i have a peavey VTM60 w/4x12 beast (JCM 800 clone with 6L6s) with all the original tubes still in it (made in USA PEAVEY TUBES!!:eek: ) That's some old tubes!
.....anyway, it sees more playing time than my f50 b/c of the whole reliability thing. 2 repairs like that in less than 1 year! i still have 3.5 years left in the warranty, but i am tired of problems. i hate to do it, but i might jump ship on that damn thing. thinking about a peavey valveking or traynor YCV50 Blue (EL34).

bleh...........love hate love (AIC Facelift version playing in my head....lol.....)

Mine's #173 (narrowbody, of course), fwiw. Fortunately no issues yet for me and I've had it 2.5 years. Though I did have a damaged pot once, but it was my fault...I must have knocked it during transport on time. All it did was knock the housing loose. I don't even remember what it was doing, either the volume had seriously dropped or was cutting in and out. But I called Mesa and right away he isolated the problem as a pot that was coming apart.. Told me how to take it apart and said I just needed to bend the little tabs down that hold the housing together. I fixed it myself in about 20 minutes. But just to make sure I was up and running, they sent me a new pot in the mail anyway at no charge, even though I was the one who broke it, so I've got a spare sitting around. Anyway, how "broken" was yours? If it was just the housing coming apart you could easily fix it yourself...the Tech guys at Mesa would tell you exactly how to do it.

Hey, if you do get the Traynor Blue I'd be interested in hearing your impressions.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by doggage5050
ok,
i am getting pissed! :mad:

my F50 is in the shop for the SECOND TIME in LESS THAN A YEAR!

the first time, when you would plug in, the amp acted like it was constantly trying to switch channels...a really fast clicking noise with the amp not working. i had to ship to to CALI back to the factory.

second time (now) the treble pot on the gain channel is shorting out and causing a complete lack of signal. i took the knob off to reveal a broken pot! :mad: i have never taken it off so it either happened at the dealership or the factory.

i have #221 built, and F50 in the narrowbody (f30) frame. i read somewhere that after #400 they changed the circuit. well, i love my amp, but dammit i can't take any more repairs! i would really like an F50 replacement, but that ain't going to happen. i love the sound but have been COMPLETELY unhappy with the reliability with this amp. i have a peavey VTM60 w/4x12 beast (JCM 800 clone with 6L6s) with all the original tubes still in it (made in USA PEAVEY TUBES!!:eek: ) That's some old tubes!
.....anyway, it sees more playing time than my f50 b/c of the whole reliability thing. 2 repairs like that in less than 1 year! i still have 3.5 years left in the warranty, but i am tired of problems. i hate to do it, but i might jump ship on that damn thing. thinking about a peavey valveking or traynor YCV50 Blue (EL34).

bleh...........love hate love (AIC Facelift version playing in my head....lol.....)

Adam,

I am really sorry to hear about your woes with your Boogie - and I can completely empathise with your frustration...

My Line6 Variax is currently out of action for the third time in less than three years. The last time was in May last year, and luckily I could return it to Berlin as I was gigging there. It's little comfort reading the Line6 forums that few other owners are suffering similar reliability issues, because I can't help wondering if I've got a dog, and whether there are going to be more reliability issues down the road, and therefore whether I should offload it once it's repaired (under warranty thankfully).

I bought the Variax the same day I bought the F-50, and cold comfort I know, but the F-50 has been rock solid. You have my deepest sympathies, and you will remain a brother regardless of what you choose to do - not least because of your wonderful contributions here (I certainly won't forget that I first learnt the 9 o'clock, 3 o'clock, 9 o'clock EQ approach from you). Good luck with whatever you decide! :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[ashjn]

Originally posted by Surfcaster
Are the cases solid wood? They are nice. Do you leave the head in the case when you play? Just wondering if it gets enough ventilation that way...looks pretty tight, especially with the Furman in there.

Yep they are solid wood, 1/2" thick. I leave the head and the cabs in there when I play. It gets plenty of ventilation from the back. The Furman and the Wireless are the perfect depth, they almost touch the handle on the F-100!

[Surfcaster]

That's right...I saw in the pictures that both the front and back are removable...duh! :p Anyway, very nice...not only functional, but easy on the eyes and worth a fair bit of $$ I'm sure!

[mr.sosa]

ok so i know the f-50 combo kicks ass for metal when using a closed back v30 cab, and for blues, jazz, clean the c90 in it.

but has anybody tried changing the c90 it has to a v30?

would that gime me some sort of intermediate sound? more versatility?

[ashjn]

Originally posted by Surfcaster
That's right...I saw in the pictures that both the front and back are removable...duh! :p Anyway, very nice...not only functional, but easy on the eyes and worth a fair bit of $$ I'm sure!


Yea it wasn't cheap. They took him 2 days to build. And he didn't charge me labor! Only materials....

[Gazz]

Adam

please excuse me if I put in my 10 pence worth but if your amp has been in the repair shop twice in less than a year, whats wrong with that, may be your expecting zero tolerance engineering? ( ala NASA ) but lets get real here, amps go wrong, all amps go wrong. Who's to say that if you swap to another make ( a bit of GAS syndrome here I suspect) that it wont go wrong? We have this belief that another amp will be better than the one you have.

Everytime I have made a decision like the one you are contemplating I have regretted it. Try to think like this- Well it went wrong and now that particular fault is ok, so its likely not to go wrong again, because its been fixed. Ok something else might go wrong , it might not, there is no g'tee that another amp will be any better or worse. You might not like the sound of a new amp, think of the time you have invested in getitng the sounds you have, all that time will be lost!

To be fair a faulty pot aint so bad, they do protrude a little it may be you caught it on something. I kinda know what your fear is. You get to a gig, switch on and nothing !! Its every guitar players worst nightmare, my advice ( from an old hand) is take backup.

But dont chuck in your amp because of a few technical hitches.

Sorry to preach but I have been where you are.

Much respect

Gazz

[hal9000]

Adam, I’m sorry to hear about your troubles. I hope everything turns out all right.

On a happier note, I finally brought my F-100 home from my singer's place so I can do the cosmetic mod this weekend. I tinkered with the vintage white knobs a bit and found that they are mechanically identical to the Mesa black knobs. By themselves, they looked smaller than I remembered the F-100's being, but they are the same. I thought about having a checkerboard pattern of knobs, but that would be ridiculous looking. :)

So, before I document the mod, is there anything you guys want me to include in the pics that I might forget? So far, my plans consist of showing these pics:

1) F-100 before
2) F-100 with grill off
3) Removing the black jute cloth staples
4) Non-covered grill
5) Grill on cloth for alignment
6) Stapling the left side of the board
7) Attaching a leverage board to the right side for stretching
8) Stretching the cloth using the board
9) Stapling the right side after stretching
10) Stapling the top and bottom
11) Wetting the cloth for final stretch
12) Attaching the piping
13) Final grill
14) Reattached grill on amp
15) Replacement of knobs
16) Final amp pic with all mods done.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Hi Neil,

Can I suggest that you take lots of action shots to document the transition between each of the 16 numbered stages - perhaps one action shot per transition? e.g. what screws did you undo to move from Stage 1 to Stage 2 - a real dummies guide for a dummy like me. :p

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Rock_Borg]

Hi, i just got back from a guitarstore where I tried an F-50 combo with an c90 speaker. And it sounded awesome! when I kicked in the countour it just fuckin screamed! I was just wondering how the f50 is compared with the mark IV. is the f50 more aggresive? smoother? better? :D

["sasquatch"]

F50 update

ok,
well, i got my amp back. the guys fixed the treble pot as well as cleaned all my others (he said there were some issues with the rest, but i didn't even know that). anyway, like Gazz said before, i am going to think of it like "well, this is now fixed so it won't be wrong again." and thank goodness; our band is going to a studio here in 2 weeks to do a "real" demo, which i will post clips of. this is a great thing b/c i absolutely LOVE the way my F50 sounds mic'd up with my audiotechnica mb2k ($65 and, imho, smokes an sm57). anyway, im gonna keep it as i have a vtm to back it up. thanks for the concern gazz, andy, hal900, etc.

for me, my F50 is like that one girl you dated, where even though she sometimes she craps on you, its so good when you're with her ya just don't give a damn. :p

on a side note, i have gotten some INCREDIBLE sounds with all of my eq set under 11:00 and the master cranked. let's you get the power tubes up more and a larger percentage of change between bass, mid, and treb, as opposed to running them all above noon. i have been dialling in like this:

- ch 2 non-contour. master up around 2:30-3:00 :eek: (please trust me), gain around 10:30, and all the treb, bass mid knobs all the way off. now, bump your treb up just enough to let signal pass through, then the mids too (both approx 8:00). then bump the bass up just enough to give it some warmth, maybe 8:30 ish, - 9:00, slightly masking the others. now, go back to mids and slowly turn it up until you get a little body in it, and the bass no longer masks it. slowly raise highs to taste. sometimes i crank them up to noon or so, but only on a really dark guitar. my bass and mids are usually a bit below 9:00 and my treble up around 10:30. go back and adjust gain to taste.

i have found these type of settings some of the most dynamic. they also sound good boosted.

this is the F50 lounge and i just shared one of my secrets....lol
:p



:cool:

[Surfcaster]

I think those pics sound fine, Neil. I wish I had that kind of forethought. Last weekend I started building a poplar head cabinet for the guy who built my single-ended amp and didn't think about taking any pictures until I was done for the day. I basically put the sides of the box together...cut down the pieces, routed the dovetails and glued them up (my best dovetails to date, btw!). Anyway, I guess I can photodoc the rest of the process, just wish I had remembered sooner!

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Surfcaster
I think those pics sound fine, Neil. I wish I had that kind of forethought. Last weekend I started building a poplar head cabinet for the guy who built my single-ended amp and didn't think about taking any pictures until I was done for the day. I basically put the sides of the box together...cut down the pieces, routed the dovetails and glued them up (my best dovetails to date, btw!). Anyway, I guess I can photodoc the rest of the process, just wish I had remembered sooner! Yeah, I hope I can do justice to the materials I've purchased. BTW, the tan jute cloth is a bit more tan than the orange cloth I see on the Bogners.

I don't know if I've told you before Surfcaster, but I'm from outside of Richmond, VA originally. :)

[kurt1981]

Hey guys, question for the lounge. I've owned a lonestar clasic, and currently own a mark III head and openback 1x12 cab. I'm not sure I like the cleans of the MK III. I don't care about the overdrive channel of any amp, period. I use pedals, and don't need an Od channel. I'm wondering if the f-50 would be right for me. I need lots of headroom, without breaking up, and a bit of sparkle, but not harsh brightness like some reissue fenders. Mainly, I would like a 1x12 combo to tote around to rehearsals and church gigs, but one which I can hook up to my openback for my larger gigs. I play out three or four nights a week, and this head and cab thing is becomming quite cumbersome. Any thoughts? Just for reference, I use a zendrive and fat boost for my overdrive, think larry Carlton or Robben Ford.
Thanks,
Kurt

[Kevin@Tone-Jam.]

Drove down to Atlanta yesterday and picked up my F-50 with chocalate cover, and wicker grillface. Man! I have never been more impressed with a small amp before in my life! I'm still working on dialing in the settings I like, but it is truly a wonderful amp.

Spaecial thanks to Dann the Mann for getting me headed in this direction.

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by doggage5050
...our band is going to a studio here in 2 weeks to do a "real" demo, which i will post clips of. this is a great thing b/c i absolutely LOVE the way my F50 sounds mic'd up with my audiotechnica mb2k ($65 and, imho, smokes an sm57)... :cool:
I'm glad to hear those problems are behind now... I'd like to test those AudioTechnicas, but they're quite hard to come by around here.

If you like I could try to master your demo when the time comes... one song for starters just to see how it sounds after I mess it up
:rolleyes: :)

[thrash]

So is the F-100 as good sounding as the F-50? I have a Mesa 3/4 back with Custom 90's to run it through. I'm looking for a head that is warmer than my 5150 II.

Do you think the F Series would be a better choice for Satch, Vai, TMac type stuff? Thanks for the help.

[kurt1981]

Bump, anyone on the comparison of cleans, lonestar and mark III? I don't mean to pester. Thanks guys,
Kurt

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by hal9000

I don't know if I've told you before Surfcaster, but I'm from outside of Richmond, VA originally. :)

No, I don't think you mentioned it. I'm in Harrisonburg. When my guitarist friend and I go gear shopping we always head to Richmond. Richmond Music is a great place...lots of Mesa's in stock as well as a bunch of boutique amps...in addition to the usual Vox, Fender, Marshall stuff. They really pack a lot into that small store. We usually hit Sam Ash or Guitar Center, too, but Richmond music is our favorite!

Kurt, I can't compare for you as I've never played a Mark III and only played a LS once briefly in a store. But I (and most F-Series owners agree) am very happy with the clean channel on my F50. It's got plenty of headroom IMHO...but I like the fact that it will break up if you crank the gain. And I'm not a big pedal user, but my Zoom Powerdrive works great as an OD pedal or a booster pedal with the amp.

[hal9000]

Guys,
I'm happy to say that I'm done with the cosmetic mod of my F-100 2x12 combo. So, without further ado:

Before:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-100StealthBlack.jpg

After:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-100FrontViewTanGrill.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-100SideViewTanGrill.jpg

I'm really happy with the results, especially since the grill cloth is as tight as what came from the factory. The tutorial will be forthcoming, because I have a lot of writing and photo editing to do. :)

[Alchemist]

Wow Hal, thats very nice:love: . What I have been thinking of trying lately is exotic wood fronts for the F-30 head. Much like they do on the custom Dr Z heads. Any thoughts on how that might look?

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by kurt1981
Hey guys, question for the lounge. I've owned a lonestar clasic, and currently own a mark III head and openback 1x12 cab. I'm not sure I like the cleans of the MK III. I don't care about the overdrive channel of any amp, period. I use pedals, and don't need an Od channel. I'm wondering if the f-50 would be right for me. I need lots of headroom, without breaking up, and a bit of sparkle, but not harsh brightness like some reissue fenders. Mainly, I would like a 1x12 combo to tote around to rehearsals and church gigs, but one which I can hook up to my openback for my larger gigs. I play out three or four nights a week, and this head and cab thing is becomming quite cumbersome. Any thoughts? Just for reference, I use a zendrive and fat boost for my overdrive, think larry Carlton or Robben Ford.
Thanks,
Kurt

To my ears, I think the F-series on the clean channel is voiced somewhere between the Mark series, and vintage Blackface Fenders. It's got some of the hi-fi presence of the Mark series, but much more character in the note envelope like the Fenders. I really like it (best of both worlds), and certainly prefer the clean sounds to the Mark III - especially when comparing Mesa's widebody format to the narrow body - which imo can sound a little boxy.

The Lonestar Classic is voiced even more in the Fender direction, and when coupled with its great Reverb circuit, it can sound like a very sweet, albeit a touch dark, old Fender. I don't know how well it accepts pedals, but the F-series is very accommodating. Indeed, that hi-fi presence in the F-series' voicing may well enhance your pedals more than an exact Fender voicing. I certainly recommend an audition. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Kevin@Tone-Jam.
Drove down to Atlanta yesterday and picked up my F-50 with chocalate cover, and wicker grillface. Man! I have never been more impressed with a small amp before in my life! I'm still working on dialing in the settings I like, but it is truly a wonderful amp.

Spaecial thanks to Dann the Mann for getting me headed in this direction.

Hi Kevin,

and a warm welcome to the F-series brotherhood. It's great to see that you've finally gotten one, and I hope you have as much fun with your amp as I do mine.

I played my F-50 to about 300 this morning and about 500 this evening and she was singing beautifully - had some guitarists come and check out my rig after, compliment the tone and clarity etc. Still wearing a big (albeit tired) smile! :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by thrash
So is the F-100 as good sounding as the F-50? I have a Mesa 3/4 back with Custom 90's to run it through. I'm looking for a head that is warmer than my 5150 II.

Do you think the F Series would be a better choice for Satch, Vai, TMac type stuff? Thanks for the help.

The F-50 and the F-100 sound very similar to my ears, and they are both bone-crunchingly loud! :p

Regarding suitability for Satch, Vai and Macalpine, UK Guitarist magazine described the F-50 as having one of the best lead sounds they had ever heard - and I personally agree. Check out the review here (http://www.mesaboogie.com/Reviews/guitarist-F-50/Guitarist_f-50.htm) - they awarded the F-50 their highest Gold accolade (one of only a handful ever bestowed). :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by hal9000
Guys,
I'm happy to say that I'm done with the cosmetic mod of my F-100 2x12 combo. So, without further ado:

Before:

<snip/>

I'm really happy with the results, especially since the grill cloth is as tight as what came from the factory. The tutorial will be forthcoming, because I have a lot of writing and photo editing to do. :)

Neil,

Wow! That looks totally stunning and so classy. Definite improvement imho! Those cream knobs look so cool. How long do you think before some orders a custom order unit, with exactly this combination - you may have started something special here Neil! :love:

Big smiles,

Andy.

[kurt1981]

Hey, thanks Andy, I'll check it out soon. I wonder if i can get anyone to buy my mark III head so I can afford it! I think I may end up with an f-50 after all, the lonestar combo was as heavy as my twin to move around. Thanks again, let me know if you've got some settings for good cleans.
Kurt

[ashjn]

Hal that looks amazing!

[thrash]

Well if you've been watching the latest auction on E ba*, I won the F-100 head. I hope it's what I'm looking for. I've tried Randall's, Peavey's, and Marshall's among others. Some were good but none had both a good clean and reverb AND a good thick gain channel.

Hope I'm as happy with mine as you guys have been. I'll know soon.

[Rock_Borg]

hey guys, i've got the opportunity to borrow a F50 from my local musicstore. So i decided to give it a try and record something, this is my first day trying to record it, i got it yesterday but only played like 30 min or so. so please tell me what you think about it, i'm not convinced yet about the tone but I think it has something buried deep within just trying to get out :D i think the tone is pretty aggresive.

anyways, cheers!
http://slick.nu/uploads/Borgs/f50.mp3

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Rock_Borg
hey guys, i've got the opportunity to borrow a F50 from my local musicstore. So i decided to give it a try and record something, this is my first day trying to record it, i got it yesterday but only played like 30 min or so. so please tell me what you think about it, i'm not convinced yet about the tone but I think it has something buried deep within just trying to get out :D i think the tone is pretty aggresive.

anyways, cheers!
http://slick.nu/uploads/Borgs/f50.mp3
Yep, it's pretty aggressive and just like you said it can be improved. I don't know how it sounds in the room, but here's something to consider recording-wise:

- use less gain
- use even less gain if you're doubling
- add some compression and EQ and you're ready to go
- the annoying fact is that for noticeably better recording-result you need better preamps to get the "real" sound to the tape. I remember the life before I bought my SPL.

[thrash]

Originally posted by thrash
Well if you've been watching the latest auction on E ba*, I won the F-100 head. I hope it's what I'm looking for. I've tried Randall's, Peavey's, and Marshall's among others. Some were good but none had both a good clean and reverb AND a good thick gain channel.

Hope I'm as happy with mine as you guys have been. I'll know soon.


If I run it on 60watts a lot will I burn two tubes faster than the others? Also what brand tubes do you suggest, I've always liked JJ's.

[Rock_Borg]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila

Yep, it's pretty aggressive and just like you said it can be improved. I don't know how it sounds in the room, but here's something to consider recording-wise:

- use less gain
- use even less gain if you're doubling
- add some compression and EQ and you're ready to go
- the annoying fact is that for noticeably better recording-result you need better preamps to get the "real" sound to the tape. I remember the life before I bought my SPL.

alright thanks for the tips, i'm taking it to bandpractice tonight to see what it goes for! :d

[Jaggery]

I played the F-30 at the sop yesterday.
I am so damn impressed by the lead channel. Thats one of the best I have heard.

I am confused if I should go for the F-50.

The Clean was not that great on F-30 or maybe I didnt bother to give it a good try.

I will go next week and check out F-50 and also try the cleans too.

[leadfootdriver]

I played an F-50, and an F-30.

Great!

With the gain at 12:00, either amp had a crushing metal/solo sound.

The F-30 had a narrower British sound with more thick mids, and the F-50 had the wide response, with the big bass.

I'd take the F-50.

["sasquatch"]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila

I'm glad to hear those problems are behind now... I'd like to test those AudioTechnicas, but they're quite hard to come by around here.


dude, i got the el-cheapo mb2k ($65 compared to $85 for sm57) and it smokes it. more top and bottom end. go here http://www.jacksdown.com/music.html and download shutup. there's just playing and singing at around 1:00 and its the F50 on ch2 non contour, with the master at retarded volumes and gain around 12:00. that's just the mb2k straight into our computer, NO tube pres. ....oh yeah, nevermind the horrid production and wank-ass chops.

:p


If you like I could try to master your demo when the time comes... one song for starters just to see how it sounds after I mess it up
:rolleyes: :)
[/QUOTE]

pm sent :thu:

["sasquatch"]

Originally posted by hal9000

After:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-100FrontViewTanGrill.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-100SideViewTanGrill.jpg


dude....that's beautiful (wipes tear from eyes)

:thu:

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by doggage5050


dude, i got the el-cheapo mb2k ($65 compared to $85 for sm57) and it smokes it. more top and bottom end. go here http://www.jacksdown.com/music.html and download shutup. there's just playing and singing at around 1:00 and its the F50 on ch2 non contour, with the master at retarded volumes and gain around 12:00. that's just the mb2k straight into our computer, NO tube pres. ....oh yeah, nevermind the horrid production and wank-ass chops.
pm sent :thu:
Yep, there's definately more top end compared to SM57... couldn't say about the bass... A/B would be nice.

SM57 starts to cut lows as early as 400hz but bass response is created with proximity effect. That's why SM57 is almost always put on straight to the grille.

Once we get to record our next album (one song is ready), I'll be trying SM57 and Beyerdynamic M201 angled in 90 degrees aimed towards the center. Phasing may come a problem, but if it works out, those mics should compliment each other superbly.

[Tom Nooijen]

Hello everybody! Just want to let you know that I've joined the M/B F-series family since yesterday. :D
I have bought an used M/B F-50 head together with a brand new M/B 2x12 Recto cabinet. The head is still in perfect condition, if the salesman would have told me it was new I would have believed him.
Anyway, I'm still working on getting everything working the way I want, and dialing in the rights sounds. So I'm sure I will come up with some questions in a couple of days.

Here's a picture of my current rig:
http://members.lycos.nl/tomnooijen/mbf50.jpg

Oh and let me give a big shout out :thu: to all the people who have made this thread to what it is today, it has been really helpfull in making my decision to join the F-club!

Chears!

[Surfcaster]

I was playing around with the rhythm channel this afternoon, maxing out the gain to get a little crunch with my LP. After a bit I realized that this channel really has a different voicing than the lead channel and I wondered what it would sound like with a boost pedal in front of it, so I hit my Zoom Powerdrive and was blown away!! First of all, by how much drive there was...way more than I expected. Secondly, by the sound. You could tell the preamp tubes were being driven pretty hard as the signal was noticeably compressing, but it wasn't too bad...it still sounded really good (and I'm the one who generally complains when the signal compresses too much). I was pretty excited at the possibility of getting a medium gain tone out of the amp with a completely different voicing than the lead channel. Has anyone else tried this?

And Neil...the amp looks great! Excited to see your photodocumentary, too!

[Alchemist]

Originally posted by Tom Nooijen
Hello everybody! Just want to let you know that I've joined the M/B F-series family since yesterday. :D
I have bought an used M/B F-50 head together with a brand new M/B 2x12 Recto cabinet. The head is still in perfect condition, if the salesman would have told me it was new I would have believed him.
Anyway, I'm still working on getting everything working the way I want, and dialing in the rights sounds. So I'm sure I will come up with some questions in a couple of days.

Here's a picture of my current rig:
http://members.lycos.nl/tomnooijen/mbf50.jpg

Oh and let me give a big shout out :thu: to all the people who have made this thread to what it is today, it has been really helpfull in making my decision to join the F-club!

Chears!

Welcome to the family, I hope your experience will be as good as ours:wave:

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Tom Nooijen
Hello everybody! Just want to let you know that I've joined the M/B F-series family since yesterday. :D
I have bought an used M/B F-50 head together with a brand new M/B 2x12 Recto cabinet. The head is still in perfect condition, if the salesman would have told me it was new I would have believed him.
Anyway, I'm still working on getting everything working the way I want, and dialing in the rights sounds. So I'm sure I will come up with some questions in a couple of days.

Here's a picture of my current rig:

Oh and let me give a big shout out :thu: to all the people who have made this thread to what it is today, it has been really helpfull in making my decision to join the F-club!

Chears! Welcome to the forum and the F-series brotherhood Tom! :)

I see you're running a G-Major and FCB 1010 with your F-50 head. Excellent rig choice if I do say so myself. There are lots of brothers with similar gear including me and I love the combination of the F-series and G-major. Have you thought about making a custom cable to have the G-Major switch channels on you F-50?

Anyway, I love the mini-half stack look!

[ashjn]

Originally posted by Tom Nooijen
Hello everybody! Just want to let you know that I've joined the M/B F-series family since yesterday. :D
I have bought an used M/B F-50 head together with a brand new M/B 2x12 Recto cabinet. The head is still in perfect condition, if the salesman would have told me it was new I would have believed him.
Anyway, I'm still working on getting everything working the way I want, and dialing in the rights sounds. So I'm sure I will come up with some questions in a couple of days.

Here's a picture of my current rig:
http://members.lycos.nl/tomnooijen/mbf50.jpg

Oh and let me give a big shout out :thu: to all the people who have made this thread to what it is today, it has been really helpfull in making my decision to join the F-club!

Chears!


Is that the 2x12 Vertical Recto Cab.

Or is it the regular one and not in the picture?

[NashSG]

I got a new Mesa Boogie F50 combo a month ago Friday. I'm pretty happy with it so far. You can get such a wide variety of tones out of this thing. It was between and F50 and an Orange AD30 and after testing them both out side by side a few times, I went with the Mesa. The Orange is a great amp, but it just didn't have near the flexibility of the F50.

The thing that blew me away and made me decide on the F50 was how the clean channel worked with my Route 66 pedal. Crank up the verb and put a hot single coil bridge pickup with some OD and compression and you can get a really fine surf guitar tone. Take off some gain, turn off the OD and smash that compressor and voila...you can get some spanky country sounds. Hook up the LP or SG, turn the gain up to about 11 o'clock, then set the OD in the Route 66 to high output grind and you have a thick 70s sounding distortion. And that is not even getting into that second channel.

Get that second channel cranked up and it has a nice thunk feel for a 1x12 combo. The second channel also seems to really favor my Explorer and it gets some Spinal Tap sustain on the contour channel. Maybe it is because it is less mid-heavy than my Marshall, the F50 really likes ceramic pickups more than most amps.

Wow is it really loud, I just got a Weber Mass to tame the volume for home use and so far I am pretty happy with the results. The direct out from the Weber Mass sounded way better than the one on amp. The direct/headphone out is the only feature I have found to be a bit underwhelming on the F50.

I think I have now found my amp.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by thrash
Well if you've been watching the latest auction on E ba*, I won the F-100 head. I hope it's what I'm looking for. I've tried Randall's, Peavey's, and Marshall's among others. Some were good but none had both a good clean and reverb AND a good thick gain channel.

Hope I'm as happy with mine as you guys have been. I'll know soon.

Welcome to the brotherhood, thrash!

Hope you're happy with your new F-100 too. :) I suspect you will wear the tubes unevenly if you use the 60 watt mode - nevertheless, you could simply rotate the tubes round - say every couple of months, to even out the wear. :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Rock_Borg
hey guys, i've got the opportunity to borrow a F50 from my local musicstore. So i decided to give it a try and record something, this is my first day trying to record it, i got it yesterday but only played like 30 min or so. so please tell me what you think about it, i'm not convinced yet about the tone but I think it has something buried deep within just trying to get out :D i think the tone is pretty aggresive.

anyways, cheers!
http://slick.nu/uploads/Borgs/f50.mp3

Hi Rock_Borg,

I liked your clip - thick and aggressive! :thu: I thought it was a really good first attempt at recording the F-series heavier sounds. You also captured a lot of the room which I personally like for solo tracks, but can be difficult to work with if you're mixing in other instruments. Good job - and let us know how you got on at band practise. :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. I'm posting your clip in the F-series Clip Library, if it's cool with you? :)

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Jaggery
I played the F-30 at the sop yesterday.
I am so damn impressed by the lead channel. Thats one of the best I have heard.

I am confused if I should go for the F-50.

The Clean was not that great on F-30 or maybe I didnt bother to give it a good try.

I will go next week and check out F-50 and also try the cleans too.

The F-50 has a slighlty different vibe to its smaller brother, but they're definitely related, and they both deserve their fan base. Let us know how you get on. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by leadfootdriver
I played an F-50, and an F-30.

Great!

With the gain at 12:00, either amp had a crushing metal/solo sound.

The F-30 had a narrower British sound with more thick mids, and the F-50 had the wide response, with the big bass.

I'd take the F-50.

Hi Mick,

Long time! How are you my friend? I'm glad the F-series made such a good impression. I remember you favouring 6L6s like I do, and so I figured you would lean towards the F-50. How are you getting on with your TriAxis rig? :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Tom Nooijen
Hello everybody! Just want to let you know that I've joined the M/B F-series family since yesterday. :D
I have bought an used M/B F-50 head together with a brand new M/B 2x12 Recto cabinet. The head is still in perfect condition, if the salesman would have told me it was new I would have believed him.
Anyway, I'm still working on getting everything working the way I want, and dialing in the rights sounds. So I'm sure I will come up with some questions in a couple of days.

Here's a picture of my current rig:
<snip\>

Oh and let me give a big shout out :thu: to all the people who have made this thread to what it is today, it has been really helpfull in making my decision to join the F-club!

Chears!

Hi Tom,

and welcome to the F-series brotherhood. Your mini-stack looks absolutely awesome - is that the vertical 2x12 Recto cabinet in your picture? According to the specs, it's about 3 cm wider than the F-50 (22.5" vs. 23. 625") - is that about right? It seems like a good match - I can only imagine one of those sitting under my F-50 combo! :cool:

As hal9000 highlighted, there are some interesting ways of getting more out of your G-Major in combination with your F-50 - especially with the flexibility of the FCB1010. Check out the G-Major link in my sig for more. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by NashSG
I got a new Mesa Boogie F50 combo a month ago Friday. I'm pretty happy with it so far. You can get such a wide variety of tones out of this thing. It was between and F50 and an Orange AD30 and after testing them both out side by side a few times, I went with the Mesa. The Orange is a great amp, but it just didn't have near the flexibility of the F50.

The thing that blew me away and made me decide on the F50 was how the clean channel worked with my Route 66 pedal. Crank up the verb and put a hot single coil bridge pickup with some OD and compression and you can get a really fine surf guitar tone. Take off some gain, turn off the OD and smash that compressor and voila...you can get some spanky country sounds. Hook up the LP or SG, turn the gain up to about 11 o'clock, then set the OD in the Route 66 to high output grind and you have a thick 70s sounding distortion. And that is not even getting into that second channel.

Get that second channel cranked up and it has a nice thunk feel for a 1x12 combo. The second channel also seems to really favor my Explorer and it gets some Spinal Tap sustain on the contour channel. Maybe it is because it is less mid-heavy than my Marshall, the F50 really likes ceramic pickups more than most amps.

Wow is it really loud, I just got a Weber Mass to tame the volume for home use and so far I am pretty happy with the results. The direct out from the Weber Mass sounded way better than the one on amp. The direct/headphone out is the only feature I have found to be a bit underwhelming on the F50.

I think I have now found my amp.

:) Glad you're enjoying your F-50 so much. Along with Surfcaster, you've touched upon an area that I'm still discovering. I'm not really a pedals type of guy, but I've found there are very few types of tone that I cannot access using just my F-50 and my vintage MXR Dynacomp. The F-50 responds really well to being boosted on the clean channel (Blackface type tone stack), and the number of vintage type tones really opens up on the dirty channel (Tweed Bassman type tonestack) with boost and compression.

I've heard that my guitar hero, Dann Huff, uses an old Dynacomp as a staple part of his rig, and often uses a Tubescreamer too. I haven't indulged in an overdrive pedal yet, but I certainly see the attraction when combined with the F-series. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[markmann]

Originally posted by hal9000
Guys,
I'm happy to say that I'm done with the cosmetic mod of my F-100 2x12 combo. So, without further ado:

Before:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-100StealthBlack.jpg

After:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-100FrontViewTanGrill.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-100SideViewTanGrill.jpg

I'm really happy with the results, especially since the grill cloth is as tight as what came from the factory. The tutorial will be forthcoming, because I have a lot of writing and photo editing to do. :) Hey Neil, I finally got a chance to log on and check out your fine work!!! Awesome, man, you did a great job and looks as good as I thought it would. Thanks for sharing with us. The piping really stands out and looks really good and I like the tan. The procedure list in your earlier post looks good and I'm looking forward to seeing the pictures. I can't wait to do mine.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Tom Nooijen
Hello everybody! Just want to let you know that I've joined the M/B F-series family since yesterday. :D
I have bought an used M/B F-50 head together with a brand new M/B 2x12 Recto cabinet. The head is still in perfect condition, if the salesman would have told me it was new I would have believed him.
Anyway, I'm still working on getting everything working the way I want, and dialing in the rights sounds. So I'm sure I will come up with some questions in a couple of days.

Here's a picture of my current rig:
http://members.lycos.nl/tomnooijen/mbf50.jpg

Oh and let me give a big shout out :thu: to all the people who have made this thread to what it is today, it has been really helpfull in making my decision to join the F-club!

Chears! Welcome, Tom. That's a sweet looking rig. The mini slant cab looks excellent with the f50 head and is a combo I never thought about before. I've never heard an F50 with v30's but I know that there are guys who prefer them. Did you a/b with c90's before you bought? Just wondering what your thought were if you did. Congrat's on your new amp.

[Surfcaster]

Hey Tom,

That is a cool looking rig...I didn't even know they made a vertical 2x12 cab with the slanted top...way cool!!

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by NashSG
I got a new Mesa Boogie F50 combo a month ago Friday. I'm pretty happy with it so far. You can get such a wide variety of tones out of this thing. It was between and F50 and an Orange AD30 and after testing them both out side by side a few times, I went with the Mesa. The Orange is a great amp, but it just didn't have near the flexibility of the F50.

The thing that blew me away and made me decide on the F50 was how the clean channel worked with my Route 66 pedal. Crank up the verb and put a hot single coil bridge pickup with some OD and compression and you can get a really fine surf guitar tone. Take off some gain, turn off the OD and smash that compressor and voila...you can get some spanky country sounds. Hook up the LP or SG, turn the gain up to about 11 o'clock, then set the OD in the Route 66 to high output grind and you have a thick 70s sounding distortion. And that is not even getting into that second channel.

Get that second channel cranked up and it has a nice thunk feel for a 1x12 combo. The second channel also seems to really favor my Explorer and it gets some Spinal Tap sustain on the contour channel. Maybe it is because it is less mid-heavy than my Marshall, the F50 really likes ceramic pickups more than most amps.

Wow is it really loud, I just got a Weber Mass to tame the volume for home use and so far I am pretty happy with the results. The direct out from the Weber Mass sounded way better than the one on amp. The direct/headphone out is the only feature I have found to be a bit underwhelming on the F50.

I think I have now found my amp.

NashSG,

I'm just really starting to dig into the range of possible tones on the clean channel...and I've had the amp 2.5 years! I'm glad that you like the amp and hope you continue to find it a source of great tones!

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by markmann
Welcome, Tom. That's a sweet looking rig. The mini slant cab looks excellent with the f50 head and is a combo I never thought about before. I've never heard an F50 with v30's but I know that there are guys who prefer them. Did you a/b with c90's before you bought? Just wondering what your thought were if you did. Congrat's on your new amp.

Markmann,

I've got a V30 that I used to use in conjunction with the C90 in my F50 combo...my own ministack with the combo on top of my home built 1x12 recto cab. At one point I recorded the two for comparison purposes and at that point I decided I preferred the C90...but it's been a while and I'm not even sure I have those clips anymore. Time is pretty scarce right now...especially for firing up the amp and playing at volume (most of my playing happens after the family is in bed so I use headphones mostly), but maybe one of these days I can record some clips again and post them.

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


:) Glad you're enjoying your F-50 so much. Along with Surfcaster, you've touched upon an area that I'm still discovering. I'm not really a pedals type of guy, but I've found there are very few types of tone that I cannot access using just my F-50 and my vintage MXR Dynacomp. The F-50 responds really well to being boosted on the clean channel (Blackface type tone stack), and the number of vintage type tones really opens up on the dirty channel (Tweed Bassman type tonestack) with boost and compression.

I've heard that my guitar hero, Dann Huff, uses an old Dynacomp as a staple part of his rig, and often uses a Tubescreamer too. I haven't indulged in an overdrive pedal yet, but I certainly see the attraction when combined with the F-series. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Andy,

I was much like you until recently, in that I relied on the amp for all my sounds and only used a couple pedals for delay and chorus. When I ordered my WoodCross Amp (the single-ended hand-built amp I got last fall) I knew it would only do medium gain and the only way to get higher gain levels would be by using a boost pedal, so I bought the Zoom PowerDrive after testing out a friends...being as transparent as it is and being built to serve not only as an OD pedal, but a booster as well it seemed like the best solution (along with the fact they were out of production and selling for less than half their original price on E-bay). Anyway, it's great as OD pedal, too, in addition to being a great booster (does a great SRV as an OD pedal). I works beautifully with my WoodCross and so I've been playing around with it and the F50, too; however, I only got the idea of boosting the clean channel yesterday.

I don't think I'll ever be an OD/Dist pedal junkie, but I must say I am interested in the Xotic BB Preamp...does a great classic Marshall crunch from what I've heard.

BTW, what's Dann Huff up to these days...last I heard he was producing and playing on country albums. While I enjoy some country music, I miss his rock-n-roll stuff.

[Jaggery]

How easy is the biasing on the F -Series?
Is it something that can be done at home?

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by Jaggery
How easy is the biasing on the F -Series?
Is it something that can be done at home?

All of Mesa's amps are fixed bias, so the bias can't be adjusted. That basically means you have to buy tubes within the bias tolerance the amp is set up for...either order your tubes from Mesa (as they recommend) or from another supplier familiar with Mesa specs (most of the bigger companies claim to be), but doing so in the first five years risks voiding the warranty (if Mesa finds out, many people do it anyway figuring they'll just pop the Mesa tubes back in if they ever need to send the amp in for servicing).

Some people have had their Mesa's modified to adjustable bias...I know that Voodoo Amps in NY does that mod if people want it, but that's about all I know about that.

[hal9000]

Here's the link to my F-100 cosmetic mod tutorial: http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=15419386#post15419386

[Tom Nooijen]

Originally posted by hal9000
Welcome to the forum and the F-series brotherhood Tom! :)

I see you're running a G-Major and FCB 1010 with your F-50 head. Excellent rig choice if I do say so myself. There are lots of brothers with similar gear including me and I love the combination of the F-series and G-major. Have you thought about making a custom cable to have the G-Major switch channels on you F-50?

Anyway, I love the mini-half stack look!

I'm definitely planning on getting my G-major to switch channels on my F-50. I haven't been able to find the information I need how to make this custom cable though :confused: So maybe you can help me out with this? I noticed that Andy and Tommi also run a G-major and FCB1010 with their F-50, so if they have any advice their more then welcome!

About the mini-half stack, I wasn't planning on buying the cabinet. I went to the shop to give the F-50 a try, and they had it standing together with the cabinet. I thought it looked and sounded pretty awesome, so I decided to take the cabinet home with me as well :D

[Tom Nooijen]

Originally posted by ashjn



Is that the 2x12 Vertical Recto Cab.

Or is it the regular one and not in the picture?

I've been asked this question before. A lot of people seem to think it is a regular 4x12 Recto cabinet. But it really is the 2x12 Vertical Recto Cab. :)

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Tom Nooijen


I'm definitely planning on getting my G-major to switch channels on my F-50. I haven't been able to find the information I need how to make this custom cable though :confused: So maybe you can help me out with this? I noticed that Andy and Tommi also run a G-major and FCB1010 with their F-50, so if they have any advice their more then welcome!

About the mini-half stack, I wasn't planning on buying the cabinet. I went to the shop to give the F-50 a try, and they had it standing together with the cabinet. I thought it looked and sounded pretty awesome, so I decided to take the cabinet home with me as well :D
Hi there, and welcome to the lounge!

The instructions for the custom cable are actually on the first page of this thread. http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=885856&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

[Tom Nooijen]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Hi Tom,

and welcome to the F-series brotherhood. Your mini-stack looks absolutely awesome - is that the vertical 2x12 Recto cabinet in your picture? According to the specs, it's about 3 cm wider than the F-50 (22.5" vs. 23. 625") - is that about right? It seems like a good match - I can only imagine one of those sitting under my F-50 combo! :cool:

As hal9000 highlighted, there are some interesting ways of getting more out of your G-Major in combination with your F-50 - especially with the flexibility of the FCB1010. Check out the G-Major link in my sig for more. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

Yup, it's a vertical 2x12 Recto cabinet. It's about 2 cm wider than the F-50, so to me it's the perfect match. I'm sure it would look really nice combined with the combo as well!

I have been checking your thread on the G-major, but I haven't been able to find any information a how to actually make the custom cable for the F-50. So if you have a schematic or something like that it would be really helpfull.

[Tom Nooijen]

Originally posted by markmann
Welcome, Tom. That's a sweet looking rig. The mini slant cab looks excellent with the f50 head and is a combo I never thought about before. I've never heard an F50 with v30's but I know that there are guys who prefer them. Did you a/b with c90's before you bought? Just wondering what your thought were if you did. Congrat's on your new amp.

I haven't tryed the F-50 with c90's, because there weren't any cabs at the shop which had the c90's in it. And because I could get a very nice deal it I bought the F-50 together with Recto cab I decided to just go for it! But I sure would like to try it with c90's somewhere in the future.

[Tom Nooijen]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila

Hi there, and welcome to the lounge!

The instructions for the custom cable are actually on the first page of this thread. http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=885856&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

I've already seen that actually, but I still don't know exactly how to make the cable. I understand the way the DIN-plug is functioning, but how do I connect it with a stereo jack for connecting it to my G-major?

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Tom Nooijen


I've already seen that actually, but I still don't know exactly how to make the cable. I understand the way the DIN-plug is functioning, but how do I connect it with a stereo jack for connecting it to my G-major?
I bought normal MIDI cable and separate stereo jack... cut the midi cable from the other end. Then you have to solder the stereo jack to the midi cable according to those instructions. Replace the footswitch cable from your F50 to this new custom cable. Connect it to G-Major and find the relay control from G-Majors front panel...

My instructions are a little vague at the moment since I don't have my equipment here.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Alchemist
Wow Hal, thats very nice:love: . What I have been thinking of trying lately is exotic wood fronts for the F-30 head. Much like they do on the custom Dr Z heads. Any thoughts on how that might look? Thanks! :)

Were you thinking something like this for your F-30 head?

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-30HeadProtoFlamedMaple.jpg

[gsouth]

I know there are a lot of you that use Mesa Boogie F50 amp in performance. How does it perform for you, and what if any issues you have with the amp in live performances ?

Thx

Gene

[Alchemist]

Originally posted by hal9000
Thanks! :)

Were you thinking something like this for your F-30 head?

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-30HeadProtoFlamedMaple.jpg


Thats very nice:D Yeah I was thinking about either keeping this one (which will be the backup) black and doing an exotic wood front plate. My only concern would be how the wood will react to the heat from the amp, I dont want it warping on me. I was thinking some very nice figured rosewood, or padouk might look quite nice as well.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by hal9000
Thanks! :)

Were you thinking something like this for your F-30 head?

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-30HeadProtoFlamedMaple.jpg

Wow! That's one of the most beautiful amp designs I've ever seen! :love:

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Tom Nooijen


Yup, it's a vertical 2x12 Recto cabinet. It's about 2 cm wider than the F-50, so to me it's the perfect match. I'm sure it would look really nice combined with the combo as well!

I have been checking your thread on the G-major, but I haven't been able to find any information a how to actually make the custom cable for the F-50. So if you have a schematic or something like that it would be really helpfull.

Hi Tom,

In the G-Major thread, check out the last few weeks of posts in particular (Feb 14 onwards), as I've given Guitarching a lot of help to get his custom cable up and running, and I suspect it answers many of the questions you have in mind.

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. You'll be pleased to know that Guitarching contacted me last weekend to confirm that he's gotten everything working - so this project is certainly possible by anyone with limited experience.

[JKornel]

Wow what a great thread. I have about 70 pages to read through but it is all great info.

I myself have been using my F100 Head and 3/4 back 212 for a bit more than 2 years now. Recorded 2 demo /EP's, and played a ton of gigs with 2 bands. I love that thing ! Best amp I have ever owned. Great tone, great feel, looks good, handles pedles good. it just flat out ROCKS !!!!

my main guitar is a PRS CE24, the PRS goes good with the Mesa !

Back to reading all the great stuff now.

ps. I love the cosmetic mods by Hal, might have to look into that myself !

[Jaggery]

Another F-50 question.

Is the widebody standard now or are they still making the smaller one?

Can someone give me the dimensions?

Thanks

[thrash]

Originally posted by JKornel
Wow what a great thread. I have about 70 pages to read through but it is all great info.

I myself have been using my F100 Head and 3/4 back 212 for a bit more than 2 years now. Recorded 2 demo /EP's, and played a ton of gigs with 2 bands. I love that thing ! Best amp I have ever owned. Great tone, great feel, looks good, handles pedles good. it just flat out ROCKS !!!!

my main guitar is a PRS CE24, the PRS goes good with the Mesa !

Back to reading all the great stuff now.

ps. I love the cosmetic mods by Hal, might have to look into that myself !

Sounds like you have the same set up I will soon. I have a Mesa 3/4 back cab and bought as F-100 yesterday which will be here soon. I play mostly Ibanez guitars with Dimarzio pups for cleans and instrumental stuff, and sometimes a ESP with EMGs for thrash metal.

What types of music do you play?

[Alchemist]

Well I just did this quickly on top of the pic hal did for me before. I was thinking a really nicely figured darker piece of rosewood, not as red as this. Would it look good?

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a219/Alchemist88/rosewoodgrille.jpg

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by Jaggery
Another F-50 question.

Is the widebody standard now or are they still making the smaller one?

Can someone give me the dimensions?

Thanks

The widebody has been the only F50 produced since the very first run...I would guess there are only a few hundred around that are not widebody. So if you buy new, you'll get a widebody. Sorry, I can't give you the dimensions as mine is NOT a widebody.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Surfcaster


The widebody has been the only F50 produced since the very first run...I would guess there are only a few hundred around that are not widebody. So if you buy new, you'll get a widebody. Sorry, I can't give you the dimensions as mine is NOT a widebody. The Mesa F-50 combo is 18 7/8" tall x 22 1/2" wide x 11 1/4" deep and weighs 54 lbs. You can find that info and a lot more here: http://www.mesaboogie.com/Product_Info/Product_Guide/ProdRef_0206.pdf

[mr.sosa]

has anybody tried changing the speaker of one of the f-series combos?

im thinking of buying a celestion vintage 30 and changing it for the c90 in my f-50, would that work?
the amp is 50 watts and the speaker is 60.. but ive heard the amp goes to more watts when cranked or something like that..
would that hurt the speaker?

[phyrexia]

you'd be fine. I like how V30s sound, I have them in my cabinets.

[Tom Nooijen]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Hi Tom,

In the G-Major thread, check out the last few weeks of posts in particular (Feb 14 onwards), as I've given Guitarching a lot of help to get his custom cable up and running, and I suspect it answers many of the questions you have in mind.

Big smiles,

Andy.

P.S. You'll be pleased to know that Guitarching contacted me last weekend to confirm that he's gotten everything working - so this project is certainly possible by anyone with limited experience.

Thanks a lot Andy! That's exactly what I was looking for. I should be able to make the custom cable myself without any problems now. :thu:

[markmann]

Originally posted by Surfcaster


Markmann,

I've got a V30 that I used to use in conjunction with the C90 in my F50 combo...my own ministack with the combo on top of my home built 1x12 recto cab. At one point I recorded the two for comparison purposes and at that point I decided I preferred the C90...but it's been a while and I'm not even sure I have those clips anymore. Time is pretty scarce right now...especially for firing up the amp and playing at volume (most of my playing happens after the family is in bed so I use headphones mostly), but maybe one of these days I can record some clips again and post them. What I'd really be interested in hearing would be a comparison between the c90's, v30's and then both together. How did the two sound together to you? Was one more dominant than the other?

[hal9000]

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000GigRig3_7_06RevC.jpg

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by markmann
What I'd really be interested in hearing would be a comparison between the c90's, v30's and then both together. How did the two sound together to you? Was one more dominant than the other?

Well, with the way I ran it I think I heard the C90 more...the combo was sitting ON TOP of the 1x12 cab, so more of it reached my ears than the V30, and what I heard of the V30 was peripheral rather than straight on. I thought they worked well together, but I've not run it that way for a long time. I put the V30 in a 2x12 with a G12H30, so I either run the C90 by itself or the 2x12 by itself. All the different set ups sound good to me...different but good.

Unfortunately I don't have the ability to record two speakers simulatneously. I went over to a friends last week to use his mixing board do that with the V30 and G12H30. I've been wanting to get my own mixer and another mic to be able to do that at home, but other gear items (like my new LP) have taken precedence. I could try recording each speaker on separate takes with a metronome...the result isn't ideal for comparison purposes, but it might shed some light. Maybe I can do that this weekend.

[Surfcaster]

Nice looking rig, Neil! And thanks for posting the photodocumentary! I've never used the leverage board idea before...as a result my grille cloths are never that tight on my grilles. Not that they look bad, but I'm sure tighter looks better. I'll do it that way next time!!

[markmann]

Originally posted by Surfcaster


Well, with the way I ran it I think I heard the C90 more...the combo was sitting ON TOP of the 1x12 cab, so more of it reached my ears than the V30, and what I heard of the V30 was peripheral rather than straight on. I thought they worked well together, but I've not run it that way for a long time. I put the V30 in a 2x12 with a G12H30, so I either run the C90 by itself or the 2x12 by itself. All the different set ups sound good to me...different but good.

Unfortunately I don't have the ability to record two speakers simulatneously. I went over to a friends last week to use his mixing board do that with the V30 and G12H30. I've been wanting to get my own mixer and another mic to be able to do that at home, but other gear items (like my new LP) have taken precedence. I could try recording each speaker on separate takes with a metronome...the result isn't ideal for comparison purposes, but it might shed some light. Maybe I can do that this weekend. Yes, your description is very helpful and I had suspected that the c90 might seem louder whether it was a proximity effect or not. My c90's seem to really cut. If you get a chance I guess recording the speakers on two tracks would be great and I don't see why it would be a lot different than recording them together. The main thing is hearing them at the same time.

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by markmann
Yes, your description is very helpful and I had suspected that the c90 might seem louder whether it was a proximity effect or not. My c90's seem to really cut. If you get a chance I guess recording the speakers on two tracks would be great and I don't see why it would be a lot different than recording them together. The main thing is hearing them at the same time.

Recording simultaneously just ensures the two are completely synchronized...that way when you want to hear what they sound like together, it's just like listening to one speaker with qualities of the two individual speakers...just like standing in front of both speakers while playing. Doing two separate takes works fine, too, it's just not quite as seamless since the nuances of each take are slightly different (which is great when you want stereo separation). I'll see what I can do.

[paydirt]

Yes, I can finally officially join the Mesa F-series lounge. UPS delivered her last night at about 8:00 PM.. I had given up on it showing up on that day because it was an hour after their official delivery hours. I originally was looking at a relic’d Blues Jr., but I AB’d it with the F-30 and I could no longer lust after the Blues Jr. The cleans were cleaner on the Mesa and then there was the Mesa “crunch”. That was the sound that had been in my head for all of these years. I’ve purchased at least 20 overdrive and distortion pedals trying to get that sound. And now I have it. One would think that after I finally decided on the F-30 my search would have been over, but alas the Gods of Amp Gas had to play one last cruel joke. 2 weeks ago my local music store got in a Mark IV 1X12 combo with an extra 1X12 cab.But at twice the price the F-30 won out in the end. Hello fellow members. :wave:

[Surfcaster]

Welcome, Paydirt. Make yourself at home here. Hope you get long lasting enjoyment out of your F30. Feel free to share your discoveries and questions and any clips!

[paydirt]

Thanks Surfcaster,

I guess my first order of business is to read this entire thread and learn any tips and settings that are heald within. :D

[Alchemist]

Welcome aboard:wave: I play an F-30 head into a fender supersonic 4*12 and love it:love:

[Dann'sTheMan]

Welcome to the F-series brotherhood, paydirt. The F-series delivered the sounds I had in my head, after years of searching too. I hope you have as much fun with your amp as I do mine,

Big smiles,

Andy.

[markmann]

Originally posted by paydirt
Thanks Surfcaster,

I guess my first order of business is to read this entire thread and learn any tips and settings that are heald within. :D This thread contains a wealth of information by a bunch of great people.

Grab a beverage and a nice comfy chair and have at it. After you've read the entire thing you'll be an F series eficionado.

[hal9000]

Paydirt, congrats on the F-30 and welcome to the forum as well as the F-series brotherhood! :)

My sig has some sample settings if you'd like to try them out. Also, do yourself a favor and read Mesa's F-series manual if you haven't already. It's worth the read for sure.

[paydirt]

Thanks guys for making me feel welcome. I know we all have at least one thing in common, GREAT taste in TONE! :D. I already dowloaded the manual from Mesa's site and am reading it as we speak. I look forward to finding some great settings as I read the Entire thread. you guys are a great wealth of information as well as being just a great group of guys.

Thanks again!!

[Surfcaster]

This is a gratuitous post to reach my 100th post so I can add an avatar...we now resume your regular programming. :D

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by paydirt
Thanks guys for making me feel welcome. I know we all have at least one thing in common, GREAT taste in TONE! :D. I already dowloaded the manual from Mesa's site and am reading it as we speak. I look forward to finding some great settings as I read the Entire thread. you guys are a great wealth of information as well as being just a great group of guys.

Thanks again!!
Welcome aboard!

Take your time with those 70+ pages... there's lots of good stuff there.

[Gazz]

Here's a question for the board.

How many players stand their amps on the floor and how many on a stand/flightcase or other. I have found it makes quite a bit of difference to the bottom end.

In a previous life I had a Laney and it stated that putting it on the floor makes a big bifference, and it did.

But I was wondering what fellow Mesa users experence was?

Personally I like to be able to get to the controls at a gig but that seems to be trade for the sound.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Gazz
Here's a question for the board.

How many players stand their amps on the floor and how many on a stand/flightcase or other. I have found it makes quite a bit of difference to the bottom end.

In a previous life I had a Laney and it stated that putting it on the floor makes a big bifference, and it did.

But I was wondering what fellow Mesa users experence was?

Personally I like to be able to get to the controls at a gig but that seems to be trade for the sound. My Hiwatt half-stack is on the floor and sounds great. With my f50 at times I've split the two cab's and had each one off the floor but mostly they're stacked. When split I get better dispersion but less bottom. I prefer the stacked configuration because I seem to get the best of both... one cab on the floor and the other on top of it where I can hear it. But, If I stand close I only hear the top speaker, which is not a complaint... just an observation. The stacked config also puts the controls right where I need them.

One other placement consideration is proximity to walls. Since my cab's are open back there is a definite sound difference depending on whether they are near a wall or in a more open space. When near wall I hear the rear projection bouncing off the wall. Since the mesa is my first open back it took me a bit to get used to it but I actually like it.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Gazz
How many players stand their amps on the floor and how many on a stand/flightcase or other. I have found it makes quite a bit of difference to the bottom end.
<snippy>Gazz, I've pretty much run the gamut of configurations with my F-100 2x12 combo and Avatar 2x12 cab. Right now, I run the Avatar on the bottom and F-100 on top for a half stack. I love the F-100's 3/4-tuned back response because it has a very enveloping sound. The Avatar adds a nice dose of sucker-punch low end being closed-back. Anyway, I also run my F-100 with an angled combo amp stand which is great for gigs since it lets me goose the volume a bit more than normal because I'm the only one in the bore-sight of the speakers. If I'm playing a place where I'm not going to be mic'ed I usually set my F-100 on a chair straight out towards the audience. If it's on the stand the audience won't hear it at all. Overall, without the casters, on the floor or on top of my Avatar, I get the best bass response. In the stand there is less bass, but since I’m at a venue with a big PA (>10 kW/side) the loss in bass from my amp isn’t noticeable. The casters also decouple the bass from the floor, but not as much as in the stand. I've also noticed during recording that with my F-100 backed up to a wall I get a lot more bass recorded by an SM-57. Out in the middle of the room, the same close-mic'ed position has noticeably less bass.

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Gazz
Here's a question for the board.

How many players stand their amps on the floor and how many on a stand/flightcase or other. I have found it makes quite a bit of difference to the bottom end.

In a previous life I had a Laney and it stated that putting it on the floor makes a big bifference, and it did.

But I was wondering what fellow Mesa users experence was?

Personally I like to be able to get to the controls at a gig but that seems to be trade for the sound.
On the floor the bass is enhanced because the it makes the floor resonate along with the amp. I have my cab almost everytime on the floor (on top of rollers) so it's almost the same for me everytime.

Since every floor is different I don't think there's definately just positive things of amp being on the floor... sometimes it makes the amps sound fluffy... it's the first word that came in to my mind, though I don't think you can describe the sound that way :)

But I guess you know what I mean... hey, muddy is the word!

[sepsis666]

sorry if this has been asked before but i hadn't the time to read the whole thread...
i'm between the f50 and the jsx in search for the Dream theater-train of thought tone. I will have the chance to test the jsx but not the f50.
so, can you help me decide? is the f50 capable of that?
Also, apart from the dt tone i'd like to be able to play some thrash/death songs so will the f50 do it?
thanks

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by sepsis666
sorry if this has been asked before but i hadn't the time to read the whole thread...
i'm between the f50 and the jsx in search for the Dream theater-train of thought tone. I will have the chance to test the jsx but not the f50.
so, can you help me decide? is the f50 capable of that?
Also, apart from the dt tone i'd like to be able to play some thrash/death songs so will the f50 do it?
thanks
I think you get close to DT tone, but Train of Thought has grainy tone which isn't that easy to get with F-series amps. In any case the F is better for the genres you described than JSX, I think :rolleyes:

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by Gazz
Here's a question for the board.

How many players stand their amps on the floor and how many on a stand/flightcase or other. I have found it makes quite a bit of difference to the bottom end.

In a previous life I had a Laney and it stated that putting it on the floor makes a big bifference, and it did.

But I was wondering what fellow Mesa users experence was?

Personally I like to be able to get to the controls at a gig but that seems to be trade for the sound.

My amp sits on top of a currently empty 1x12 cab, which sits on top of a platform on wheels. We have gotten water in our basement, where my gear is, and even though that part of the basement has never been wet in the time we've lived there, I'm not taking any chances! You can actually see my set up in my avatar.

Anyway, I've never noticed much difference having the amp on the floor...but it might depend on the type of floor, too. For me the most important factor is that the speaker(s) face me.

[markmann]

I don't mean to get off track but if I remember correctly one of you guys was going to close the back of an open back Mesa cab. Did that ever happen? I'd like to know how that sounds. I thought about that after hal9000's comment about running a 3/4 closed along with a closed back. I've been contemplating closing the back of just one of my cab's to see how the combo would sound.

Also, I saw a band about a month ago that had ALL of the backline cab's laying on their back facing the ceiling. I've never seen that before and can't figure out why they did it. It looked very strange.

[Alchemist]

A more current rig pic for the brotherhood. I find these two amps compliment each other perfectly, especialy running them stereo. The custom traynor has that light, brighter breakup, all the way to a smooth more trebly Gary Moore tone, while the Mesa has that thick smooth growl. I'm in tone heaven:love:

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a219/Alchemist88/currentrig.jpg

[Gazz]

Thaks for the replies and observations. I can see how the rear wall would have an impact on the sound and the type of floor. I play in 2 bands, one 3 piece RnB/ Blues and a 13 piece Soul Band, both with different eq requirements. I think I will continue to use the floor for the 3 piece and the flight case for the soul band.

Each method seems to give the results I need.
Fuller for the 3 piece m and more toppy for the bigger band.
However I am seriously thinking about getting a 1 x 12 cab to sit under the F50 combo I have, and then of course I would have the best of both worlds.

Any recommendations? How do I connect it at the back?

Cheers guys!

[Gazz]

I did see a guy use a Vox AC30 turned round the wrong way, ie facing the back of the stage! He used a Gibbo straight into the front end everything on max. How did it sound , well in a word bloody awful ! Far too middly, no cut at all.

Also there was that old thing years ago about a Fender Champ, plug in your strat, max everything and then lay it face down, yes face down! Never tried it but I thought I wonde what that does to the cone !

What we do in the quest for tone!!!!

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Gazz
Thaks for the replies and observations. I can see how the rear wall would have an impact on the sound and the type of floor. I play in 2 bands, one 3 piece RnB/ Blues and a 13 piece Soul Band, both with different eq requirements. I think I will continue to use the floor for the 3 piece and the flight case for the soul band.

Each method seems to give the results I need.
Fuller for the 3 piece m and more toppy for the bigger band.
However I am seriously thinking about getting a 1 x 12 cab to sit under the F50 combo I have, and then of course I would have the best of both worlds.

Any recommendations? How do I connect it at the back?

Cheers guys! You'll need an 8 Ohm cab and all you have to do is plug both the combo's speaker and the cab into the (2) 4 Ohm speaker jacks.

[Surfcaster]

Originally posted by markmann
I don't mean to get off track but if I remember correctly one of you guys was going to close the back of an open back Mesa cab. Did that ever happen? I'd like to know how that sounds. I thought about that after hal9000's comment about running a 3/4 closed along with a closed back. I've been contemplating closing the back of just one of my cab's to see how the combo would sound.

Also, I saw a band about a month ago that had ALL of the backline cab's laying on their back facing the ceiling. I've never seen that before and can't figure out why they did it. It looked very strange.

I closed up the back of a home-made 2x12 cab...not sure if that's what you meant. It provided a more focused sound and obviously direct more sound out front and there's a little more bass resonance as well. Overall, I like it and will probably leave it that way.

I've seent that before, too, with the cabs laying on their backs. I always assumed it was volume control...if the amps are cranked this will direct the sound at the ceiling and not project so much volume out front...makes it easier for the FOH guys...and the band too. The cabs could them be mic'd. I dunno...just a guess.

[thrash]

How is the tone on the F-100 set to the 60watt setting. Is it like the F-50?
Seems to be a lot of F-50 clips and harder to find 100 clips.

[Gazz]

Thanks for that Hal

[markmann]

Originally posted by Surfcaster


I closed up the back of a home-made 2x12 cab...not sure if that's what you meant. It provided a more focused sound and obviously direct more sound out front and there's a little more bass resonance as well. Overall, I like it and will probably leave it that way.

I've seent that before, too, with the cabs laying on their backs. I always assumed it was volume control...if the amps are cranked this will direct the sound at the ceiling and not project so much volume out front...makes it easier for the FOH guys...and the band too. The cabs could them be mic'd. I dunno...just a guess. Thanks, Surf, I think I'll experiment a bit and see how I like it.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by thrash
How is the tone on the F-100 set to the 60watt setting. Is it like the F-50?
Seems to be a lot of F-50 clips and harder to find 100 clips. The F-50 and F-100 are hard to separate tonally, but the biggest difference is in the size of the transformers and the combo's speakers. So, you get a bit more bottom end and the clean channel has more headroom (not that the F-50 really needs it though :)). Every bit of the tone in the F-50 can be had in the F-100 and visa versa. The difference in bass and overall girth is really a live performance thing

I have clips in my sig of my F-100, but only in the 100 W setting. I rarely run the 60 W setting, because there really isn't much of a difference in volume. If anything, it just tops out sooner as you would expect.

One caveat to running at 60 W is that you are supposed to switch the combo's speakers from the 8 Ohm jack to one of the 4 Ohm jacks. But, since I run another 2x12 8 Ohm cab, the impedance would be too low for me to use. I've run down at 60 W, while leaving the speakers plugged into the 8 Ohm jack and the sound is darker and has a less dynamic feel. The real advantage to running at 60 W is that you're only burning (2) of the output tubes. You don't even really need the outside pair of tubes in the amp in the 60 W mode.

[Surfcaster]

Okay, I've posted two clips comparing the Custom 90 and Vintage 30. The C90 is in the left channel for both clips and the V30 in the right channel. (They aren't panned hard right and left...about 40% so they sound more cohesive when listening to both). Anyway, by moving your balance control you can hear the individual speakers at the right and left positions and both in the center position.

Also, the distinction between the two will be more evident through a better speaker system. If you've got a decent computer speaker set up w/ subwoofer and all, that will probably work, but home stereo is even better.

Unfortunately, I couldn't get two very synchronized clips for the clean sample...I'm pretty rusty on that riff and the slow tempo didn't help me out any...but hopefully that won't distract you too much and you can still get an idea.

Here's the link...they are the first two songs:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=381358

I'd be interested to hear people's thoughts...on the speakers themselves, not my lousy playing!! :D

Edit: Oh, I used a stock LP Studio on the bridge for the High Gain and a MIM Strat with a Gold Lace Sensor in the neck for the clean.

[hal9000]

Originally posted by Surfcaster
Okay, I've posted two clips comparing the Custom 90 and Vintage 30. The C90 is in the left channel for both clips and the V30 in the right channel. (They aren't panned hard right and left...about 40% so they sound more cohesive when listening to both). Anyway, by moving your balance control you can hear the individual speakers at the right and left positions and both in the center position.

Also, the distinction between the two will be more evident through a better speaker system. If you've got a decent computer speaker set up w/ subwoofer and all, that will probably work, but home stereo is even better.

Unfortunately, I couldn't get two very synchronized clips for the clean sample...I'm pretty rusty on that riff and the slow tempo didn't help me out any...but hopefully that won't distract you too much and you can still get an idea.

Here's the link...they are the first two songs:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=381358

I'd be interested to hear people's thoughts...on the speakers themselves, not my lousy playing!! :D

Edit: Oh, I used a stock LP Studio on the bridge for the High Gain and a MIM Strat with a Gold Lace Sensor in the neck for the clean. How did you make sure the mic's were equally positioned? I had a quick listen and on the high gain clip it seems that the C90 has a nice warm mid sound with less bass and treble than the V30. The V30 on the other hand has a bit of a nasal mid range, but with more bass and presence than the C90. It's interesting because I've only ever recorded my F-100 with V30s, but I usually play around with the mic until I find the sweet spot between the dust cap and outer edge.

[Surfcaster]

Well, I didn't spend a lot of time with mic position...I didn't have a lot of time to get this done. I tried about 3 or 4 different positions on each speaker and ended up preferring the same position for both speakers. That is with the end of the mic directly over the center of the dust cap, but with the mic at a 45 degree angle to the grille so it's pointing toward the cone. I find if I point the mic directly at the edge of the dust cap perpendicular to the grille it sounds a little dark...this mic placement picks up a few more highs and brightens the tone. And any time I move the mic out from the edge of the dust cap it just gets darker.

The V30 definitely has more mids than the C90 and can get a bit nasal sounding. The C90 almost sounds a bit dark to me. I think I like the two together best. Not quite as dark as the C90 by itself, but not as nasal as the V30 by itself. I think they complement each other pretty well.

[Alchemist]

I have an EQ question. The way I have my EQ setup now on my lead channel (contour off) gives me a great deep, but defined shred tone, very much like petrucci, and paul gilbert, its excellent for fast chromatic runs, string skips, etc, and pretty good for 3-string sweep patters (my gain is on 5)...

However, when I start doing full 6 string sweeps, it seems a little too dark and there is too much note definition on the low strings and at the very high, they just seem to dominate and not give me the overall definition I want. When I sweep slower its not a problem but when I start going very fast it becomes a bit of a blurr (not noisy, just not enough overall definition)..

Do you guys who play this style have any EQ'ing suggestions that would maintain more tonal ballance while sweeping at those speeds?

EDIT: just to clarify my current EQ is similar to the "insane lead" recommended EQ in the user manual.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Surfcaster
Okay, I've posted two clips comparing the Custom 90 and Vintage 30. The C90 is in the left channel for both clips and the V30 in the right channel. (They aren't panned hard right and left...about 40% so they sound more cohesive when listening to both). Anyway, by moving your balance control you can hear the individual speakers at the right and left positions and both in the center position.

Also, the distinction between the two will be more evident through a better speaker system. If you've got a decent computer speaker set up w/ subwoofer and all, that will probably work, but home stereo is even better.

Unfortunately, I couldn't get two very synchronized clips for the clean sample...I'm pretty rusty on that riff and the slow tempo didn't help me out any...but hopefully that won't distract you too much and you can still get an idea.

Here's the link...they are the first two songs:

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=381358

I'd be interested to hear people's thoughts...on the speakers themselves, not my lousy playing!! :D

Edit: Oh, I used a stock LP Studio on the bridge for the High Gain and a MIM Strat with a Gold Lace Sensor in the neck for the clean. Thanks, Surf. As you said, the two speakers seem to compliment each other well. listening to your recordings I do like the sound of the c90 better. That could be due to owning my c90's for 6 or 7 years so my ear is used to them but I think I prefer the more direct and what seems like a more clear tone? The two together sound very nice. Your clips give a good comparison.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Alchemist
I have an EQ question. The way I have my EQ setup now on my lead channel (contour off) gives me a great deep, but defined shred tone, very much like petrucci, and paul gilbert, its excellent for fast chromatic runs, string skips, etc, and pretty good for 3-string sweep patters (my gain is on 5)...

However, when I start doing full 6 string sweeps, it seems a little too dark and there is too much note definition on the low strings and at the very high, they just seem to dominate and not give me the overall definition I want. When I sweep slower its not a problem but when I start going very fast it becomes a bit of a blurr (not noisy, just not enough overall definition)..

Do you guys who play this style have any EQ'ing suggestions that would maintain more tonal ballance while sweeping at those speeds?

EDIT: just to clarify my current EQ is similar to the "insane lead" recommended EQ in the user manual. Have you tried adjusting your pup heights or individual pole pieces?

[Alchemist]

Originally posted by markmann
Have you tried adjusting your pup heights or individual pole pieces?

Yeah, I think I'll just try another pickup. It sounds just fine with my Gibsons, its just this duncan giving me trouble lol.

[musicdog400]

I have trouble getting any note definition when sweep picking with a lot of gain. I blame this on my playing, not on the amp.

I try to palm mute as I sweep but even the muted sound is messy. So for technical playing, I am forced to drop the gain down to where the notes are just starting to get some hair (overdrive) on them. Adding compression helps get the feel I like.

[Alchemist]

I have no problem with the technique, it sounds dead on with my other setups, just my Mesa is a lot darker and more bass heavy than my others. I play with little gain. My gain is never past 5. Theres just a lot of low end going through, especialy through the 4*12 cab. I'll play with different pickups. I tried using a compressor, I dont like what it does, really kills a lot of the amps natural character.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by gsouth
I know there are a lot of you that use Mesa Boogie F50 amp in performance. How does it perform for you, and what if any issues you have with the amp in live performances ?

Thx

Gene

Hi Gene,

Sorry I overlooked your post. :o I probably play out with my F-50 around 100 times per year, including both rehearsals and live performances (50/50 split). I've owned the amp for almost three years and it has been rock solid reliability wise.

Performance wise, the amp is at the heart of my rig that uses MIDI and a G-Major for effects and clever switching possibilities. A single stomp on my MIDI foot controller can summon the F-50's awesome Rhythm, Lead or Contour tones together with the desired effects. :cool:

The G-Major brings another solution to the table, one that addresses the main shortcoming of the F-50. The Master Volumes on the F-series need to be up above 9 o'clock to get the amp singing - unfortunately, this is already very loud, and potentially more stage volume than some bands/venues can handle. The G-Major is an effective solution for the "volume-pedal-in-the-loop" trick, and attenuates the line-level signal in the loop, whilst maximising tone.

Tonally, I'm totally thrilled with the sounds I get at any volume level, and the switching, and the versatility sincerely make my F-50 rig a performance pleasure, :)

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/dannstheman/music2/hal9000Andy_sRigFinalSmallRevC.png

Big smiles,

Andy.

[hal9000]

I just recently finished upgrading my Mesa F-100 from stealth black to a Mesa tan jute grill cloth with white piping and Fender vintage white knobs. So, I thought I’d document the modification process for HCAF in case you’d like to do this to your amp.

Before I ordered all the material for this project, I made a prototype drawing of the amp to see if what I was thinking on paper worked, and I really like the combination:
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/hal9000F-100TanGrillWhiteKnobPipedP.jpg

First of all, I used the excellent tutorial from Southbay Ampworks on www.thegearpage.net: Grillcloth 101 Installation (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=67452&highlight=tutorial+cloth) to get me started. Since each amp is different, I knew I’d probably run into some snags, but overall the process was very manageable and I’m very pleased with the results.

Materials:
From www.samash.com:
(2) Vintage White Amplifier Knobs (Pack of 6 @ $16.99) = $33.98

http://www.vibroworld.com/gifbank/HR4020.gif

From www.vibroworld.com
(1 yard x 30” tall) Mesa Jute Tan Grill Cloth = $ 34.50
(8 ft.) 3/16" White Piping = $21.04

http://www.vibroworld.com/gifbank/205-510.gif

http://www.vibroworld.com/gifbank/18024.gif

Total = $ 89.52 not including shipping.

Tools (that I used):
Electric Staple Gun
1/4” staples (at least 500)
Flat Head Screwdriver 1/8” blade
Flat Head Screwdriver 1/16” blade
#2 Phillips Head Screwdriver
Hammer
1/2”- 3/4” Thick board a bit longer than the longest side of your baffle board and 4” wide
Utility knife
Heavy Duty Scissors
Flashlight

So, here’s my F-100 which I’ve had for over three years in stealth black:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/F-100StealthBlack.jpg

Notice the four Phillips screws that hold on the speaker grill which I removed. Below is the speaker grill removed from the amp:

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/BaffleBoardReadytogo.jpg

Holy crap-load of staples Batman! What was I thinking? I can tell that a machine does this stapling job because some of them are literally right next to each other. Note that the position of the staples is only important on the top of the speaker grill because about 1/4” shows through under the amp’s faceplate.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/BaffleBoardCornerStaples.jpg

Removing the staples from the factory speaker grill:
If you’re real crafty you can remove more than one staple by wiggling the screwdriver under about (6) at a time. You’ll get faster as you figure out how best to get the staples out. It looks daunting, but it only took me about 45 minutes to remove all the staples.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/RemovingmulitpleStaples.jpg

Aligning the grill cloth to the speaker grill:
Mesa’s tan jute grill cloth has a perpendicular pattern that’s mostly square so choose one edge of the speaker grill and try to find the best line to get the cloth as straight looking as possible.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/Aligngrillclothtobaffleboard.jpg

Stapling the bottom row:
Since only the speaker grill’s top matters where you put the staples it’s best to start at the bottom to get a nice tight stapling job. You want to put the staples in at about a 45° angle to the cloth to grab as much material as possible. Put each staple about 1/2" apart and check your alignment often. To get access to the bottom of the board I moved the whole contraption to just over the edge of the table. If you have someone to help you, get them to press on the speaker grill so it won’t move.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/Bottomstaplesfinished.jpg

[hal9000]

Aligning the stretcher board:
You’ll notice that the grill cloth can be stretched by hand, but the grid that comprises the jute fabric will be pulled out of square. So, to prevent the grid from coming out of square, but stretch the fabric as much as possible, you have to use a stretcher board to gain enough leverage. Below, I just happened to have a ½” straight edge that I used for a spacer to align the board exactly square and ½” away from the top of the speaker grill. Do not attach the stretcher board more then about 5/8” away because you’ll have too much slack. It is important that the stretcher board is perfectly square to the speaker grill because any misalignment can stretch the fabric unevenly causing the grid to come of square and angering you immensely.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/Aligningstretcherboard.jpg

Stapling the stretcher board:
Now that the stretcher board is correctly aligned to the speaker grill, you’re ready to attach the cloth with staples. Make sure the grill cloth is pulled evenly and tightly back across the board and hold down the whole contraption to make sure nothing moves. You can now staple the cloth to the board keeping them at an angle as before and about 1/2" apart.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/Staplestretcherboard.jpg

Stretching the grill cloth and stapling the top edge:
Put the speaker grill on the floor with a non-slip surface like the carpet shown below. As you fold the board over the top of the grill you’ll hear the fabric creak and moan as it accommodates its new length. Try to make the grill as tight as possible. Now your ready to staple the top edge. Remember, since the F-series amps have an angled front panel, there is about a 1/4" of grill cloth showing on the top surface, so the staples need to back as far as possible to prevent them from being seen. So, give the staples a little angle and place them 1/2” apart as before.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/Stretchinggrillclothwithboard.jpg

Top and bottom complete, now let’s finish the sides:
You can cut off the stretcher board now using heavy scissors. The only difficult part of the sides is that you need to cut the cloth to make a nice tight edge. The way Mesa did the corners, which I copied, was to cut each section (bottom, top, etc.) to be square to where it’s stapled. So, if you unfolded the cloth, instead of being a complete rectangle, you’ll be missing a 1/2" square at each corner. The sides of the speaker grill are actually quite easy in that the staples can go in the middle of the board like the bottom since they won’t be seen. So, place them at a 45° about 1/2" apart and make sure that the sides are nice and tight to the board. If you’ve cut the fabric correctly, you shouldn’t have any bunched corners.

Finish the grill cloth install by trimming all the extra fabric:
Cut off all the rest of the fabric surrounding the back of the speaker grill square to the edge. We’re now done with the Mesa tan jute cloth conversion. Mmm… looks nice.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/GrillClothinstallcomplete.jpg

Test fit the grill
For all of you that only want to do the grill cloth, which is the extent to which Mesa will customize your amp, here’s a test fit. If you’re doing the piping, leave the grill on the amp:
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/TanGrillclothtestfitonF-100.jpg

Piping Install:
I anticipated having a tough time getting the piping onto the board and then onto the amp simply because you’re increasing the size of the speaker grill by adding 1/16” all the way around. To figure out how much piping you need, add up 2x width and 2x height of your speaker grill to get the perimeter. In my case, I needed 2x19” + 2x26” = 90” = 7.5 feet, so I ordered 8 ft. With the grill still on the amp, feed the stapling edge in-between the grill and control panel. On the F-series, there is a gap between the angled control panel and the top of the speaker grill that the 3/16” piping fits in perfectly. The problem, however, is that to fit the piping into the gap it must be a bit behind the face of the grill so the piping’s stapling flange does not show. You have to keep that in mind when you attach the piping. As you can see below I started the piping install at the bottom center so the break line wouldn’t be obvious. The piping will bend around corners with a nice consistent radius and if you start at one edge, you’ll have a square corner which looks funky, so don’t do that. You also don’t need as many staples as the grill cloth since the piping isn’t a structural item.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/Pipinginstall.jpg

So, attach the bottom first, and keeping it tight, pull the piping around the first corner and staple. Once the piping is straight you can go back and put a staple every 2” or so. Since we’re doing the bottom and side first, the transition between the round piping and its stapling flange should go right on the edge of the grill. Move your way around the grill until you get to the top.

The top portion of the piping needs to be recessed, so move it such the round portion is just behind the face of the grill and put in your first top staple. Try to keep the piping in line all the way down and around the other top corner and attach a staple just before the corner on the top and just over the side. Go back and fill in the staples making sure the alignment is good about every 2”.

Now that you’re done with the top, you’re back to the regular alignment just like the bottom and right side. Staple the left side just like the right and you’re on the home stretch. Finish up the piping by overlapping the last bottom edge with the starting edge and cut both of them at the same time with a utility knife so that the butt joint will be perfectly straight. Staple the final bit of piping as close as possible to the starting edge and it should look like one continuous piece of piping all the way around the grill.

[hal9000]

Speaker Grill Install:
Okay, we’re done with the major portion of the modification; we just have to stuff the grill back into place. Since we added to the dimensions of the grill, it’s going to be a bit difficult to squeeze back into place, but it will fit. Try to align the grill as best as possible with the amp and push it in with equal force on both the left and right sides. You’ll need a blunt flat edge to make sure the piping’s stapling flange stays tight to the grill as it’s pushed into the amp. Once the grill is as far back as it will go, use another blunt flat object to align the piping to the square edge of the grill to make everything as straight as possible.

Get your flashlight out and find the original (4) screw holes that hold on the grill. Reattach the screws and washers on the grill and you’re done.

Knob Install:
This is the last leg of the journey. Replacing the knobs is quite easy since they are only attached with a flat head set screw exactly opposite the knob’s stripe. You’ll need a small flat head screwdriver for this like those used to repair eyeglasses. It’s maybe a 1/16” head. Notice on the picture that all the pots have an indention where the set screw will go. On the bottom row, if you turn every control to the counter-clockwise most position, it will be easy to remove and replace the knobs. The top is a little tougher because you have to turn the knob so you can access the screws.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/ReplacingBlackknobs.jpg

Final pics:
Here’s my F-100 redone with Mesa Tan jute grill cloth, white piping, and Fender vintage white knobs. I’m very pleased with the results and I think it looks like a million bucks.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/FinishedF-100.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/F-100Finishedobliqueright.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y34/afraiddave/F-100%20Cosmetic%20Mod/CloseupF-100finished.jpg

Overall, the whole job took about three hours start to finish including taking the pics (but not writing this tutorial :)). I hope this photo documentary will help you guys that are thinking about this kind of mod, and encourage others who thought this might be a bit too much to tackle. With a little hands-on knowledge and the appropriate tools I feel this project was a lot of fun and the results are better than I expected.

-Neil

[ashjn]

You're crazy man, that looks awesome though

[Roscoe62]

I still can't get over how much GREAT information there is in this thread! That conversion is awesome Hal9000!

I don't know if it's OK to ask here, but I notice a lot of people here really enjoy using the TC Electronics G-Major multi-effects unit with their F-50. I'm looking at purchasing one but TC Electronics gear is very rare here in NZ. Does anyone know of a UK stockist who exports (can't from the States because of the mains voltage difference) OR a similarly specc'ed unit of a different make? Budget is a factor unfortunately!

I'd be grateful for any advice!

Cheers!

BTW....I'm not an F50 owner yet, but I've placed the order!:)

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Roscoe62
I still can't get over how much GREAT information there is in this thread! That conversion is awesome Hal9000!

I don't know if it's OK to ask here, but I notice a lot of people here really enjoy using the TC Electronics G-Major multi-effects unit with their F-50. I'm looking at purchasing one but TC Electronics gear is very rare here in NZ. Does anyone know of a UK stockist who exports (can't from the States because of the mains voltage difference) OR a similarly specc'ed unit of a different make?

I'd be grateful for any advice!

Cheers!

BTW....I'm not an F50 owner yet, but I've placed the order!:)

Hey Roscoe62,

It's great that you're finding this thread useful. Don't be shy about asking questions - this is a Lounge so relax, there's no protocol. :)

Regarding your question, be aware that the G-Major is shipped with a ranging power supply, 100-240V, so you can buy it from anywhere in the world - including the US.

I bought mine from www.thomann.de in Germany, and they shipped it to the UK with no hassle. They were a pleasure to deal with, very professional, offered a two year warranty (compared to the 1 year offered in the UK), and were much cheaper than the UK stores.

The main alternatives to the G-Major that I considered were the Rocktron Xpression, and also the Lexicon MPX1. If you do decide to pull the trigger on the G-Major, then check out the G-Major Controller Tips thread in my sig - more great info. :cool:

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Roscoe62
I still can't get over how much GREAT information there is in this thread! That conversion is awesome Hal9000!

I don't know if it's OK to ask here, but I notice a lot of people here really enjoy using the TC Electronics G-Major multi-effects unit with their F-50. I'm looking at purchasing one but TC Electronics gear is very rare here in NZ. Does anyone know of a UK stockist who exports (can't from the States because of the mains voltage difference) OR a similarly specc'ed unit of a different make? Budget is a factor unfortunately!

I'd be grateful for any advice!

Cheers!

BTW....I'm not an F50 owner yet, but I've placed the order!:)
Welcome aboard!

This company seems to be the NZ importer: http://www.amber.co.nz/, maybe you could give them a call... if not, then you could email to http://www.musicstore.com or http://www.thomann.de. Depending on their reseller deals they might be able to sell you an unit.

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Hey Roscoe62,

I bought mine from www.thomann.de in Germany, and they shipped it to the UK with no hassle. They were a pleasure to deal with, very professional, offered a two year warranty (compared to the 1 year offered in the UK), and were much cheaper than the UK stores.

Aargh... you were faster than me :)

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila

Aargh... you were faster than me :)

Tommi, my brother, you may well have the fastest fingers on this forum - but I'll gladly take your words, and try and convince myself that you were really talking about my shredding "ability"! :thu: :p :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Roscoe62]

Thanks for the heads-up guys! I will check out those links.

BTW....I finally got to hear some of your clips last night Andy & Tommi.

wow :eek:

NOW I feel humble! I've always been more of a rhythm player but I can really appreciate what you guys are doing! Thanks so much for sharing! :thu:

[thrash]

I'm used to playing hi-gain heads like Randall's and 5150's. These seem to have a lot of noise that requires a noise gate. Does the F-series do this at all?

[Flannery]

Location: Canada
Posts: 1
F-50 Tone Questions
Hello all,
I was quite happy to discover that I wasn't the only one who swears by the F-50, although in my neck of the woods I seem to be the only one to have discovered this great amp...(Dual Rec's tend to rule the land around here).

My question revolves around the difficulty I'm having translating my live tone into a good recorded sound. My live settings are quite similar to Dann'sTheMan's audition settings for Humbucker Metal rhythm, although I use the contour as a solo boost live, so I don't have it on all the time. I run less gain, around 10 o'clock, and my mids are a little higher at around 12 o'clock. For live this tone is absolutely killer, but it is not translating well onto my recordings.

The main problem I'm finding is that the low end is really loose and undefined, and I can't seem to find an EQ setting that tightens it up. I've tried with the contour on and off, tried increasing the treble and dereasing the bass and nothing seems to help.

I should mention that I am close miking with an SM57...I would prefer an ambient mike also, so I could blend the two, but I have to isolate the cabinet in a small room (I have an F-50 head and a no name 4/12 loaded with what I believe are 60 watt celestions) so the neighbors dont go mental.

I'm playing a Schecter Terry Corso artist model with a Seymour Duncan Jeff Beck in the bridge position, so I don't think it's the fault of the guitar, because it sounds great no matter what I play it through.

I'm definitely trying for a metal tone, but I don't want to go with the typical scoop method that some resort to. I'm a big fan of mids, but I can't seem to make it work on the recordings. Am I missing something obvious with the mike placement (which is against the cabinets grill about midway from the center) or are my EQ settings out to lunch? I've been playing for 20 years but I'm feeling like a rookie right now, so any suggestions that you folks can make would be much appreciated...

[hal9000]

Originally posted by thrash
I'm used to playing hi-gain heads like Randall's and 5150's. These seem to have a lot of noise that requires a noise gate. Does the F-series do this at all? Well, high-gain is always going to have some noise, but I've never noticed an excessive amount with my F-100. Even with the gain up to 3:00 on the Contour channel, I don't feel the need for a noise gate even though I do have one in my G-Major. I've also found that decent cables, good power, and well-made guitars make a big difference in the amount of noise produced by a rig.

BTW, welcome to the forum and the F-series lounge. :)

[musicdog400]

The main problem I'm finding is that the low end is really loose and undefined, and I can't seem to find an EQ setting that tightens it up.

I dial the bass way back for the high gain stuff and that seems to help. But I notice the problem also.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by Flannery
Location: Canada
Posts: 1
F-50 Tone Questions
Hello all,
I was quite happy to discover that I wasn't the only one who swears by the F-50, although in my neck of the woods I seem to be the only one to have discovered this great amp...(Dual Rec's tend to rule the land around here).

My question revolves around the difficulty I'm having translating my live tone into a good recorded sound. My live settings are quite similar to Dann'sTheMan's audition settings for Humbucker Metal rhythm, although I use the contour as a solo boost live, so I don't have it on all the time. I run less gain, around 10 o'clock, and my mids are a little higher at around 12 o'clock. For live this tone is absolutely killer, but it is not translating well onto my recordings.

The main problem I'm finding is that the low end is really loose and undefined, and I can't seem to find an EQ setting that tightens it up. I've tried with the contour on and off, tried increasing the treble and dereasing the bass and nothing seems to help.

I should mention that I am close miking with an SM57...I would prefer an ambient mike also, so I could blend the two, but I have to isolate the cabinet in a small room (I have an F-50 head and a no name 4/12 loaded with what I believe are 60 watt celestions) so the neighbors dont go mental.

I'm playing a Schecter Terry Corso artist model with a Seymour Duncan Jeff Beck in the bridge position, so I don't think it's the fault of the guitar, because it sounds great no matter what I play it through.

I'm definitely trying for a metal tone, but I don't want to go with the typical scoop method that some resort to. I'm a big fan of mids, but I can't seem to make it work on the recordings. Am I missing something obvious with the mike placement (which is against the cabinets grill about midway from the center) or are my EQ settings out to lunch? I've been playing for 20 years but I'm feeling like a rookie right now, so any suggestions that you folks can make would be much appreciated...

Hi Flannery,

and welcome to the F-series Lounge and the cool brotherhood that hangs out here. :) You may have been talking about hal9000's audition settings, but we all contribute and share ideas. Indeed many of my most common settings were originally shared here.

Regarding your recording woes, one mike placement technique that I've been using a lot recently as it gives very balanced results with my SM57 - especially with higher gain tones, is to position the barrel of the mike in line with the edge of the dust cap and the cone, and then point the mike at the centre of the dust cap. The barrel typically makes around a 30 degree angle with the speaker grill, but I play around with this angle for the tone I'm after. I also play around with the distance that the mike is away from the grill - say 2 ~ 5 centimetres.

Let me know if this approach yields some promising results,

Big smiles,

Andy.

[thrash]

Originally posted by hal9000
Well, high-gain is always going to have some noise, but I've never noticed an excessive amount with my F-100. Even with the gain up to 3:00 on the Contour channel, I don't feel the need for a noise gate even though I do have one in my G-Major. I've also found that decent cables, good power, and well-made guitars make a big difference in the amount of noise produced by a rig.

BTW, welcome to the forum and the F-series lounge. :)

Thanks for the welcome, I'm still waiting to receive my F-100. I'll be running it thru a 2x12 Mesa 3/4 back cab. I use an Ibanez Jem7VWH, a RG570, and a ESP EX-351 with 81/85 combo.

I notice a lot of people use compressors on this board. How will that effect the clean and gain channels?

[Alchemist]

I have an RG570 among my guitars, it works fairly well with my F-30 + 4*12 supersonic cab (thats closeback with vintage 30's). It has pretty much a Paul Gilbert/Petrucci tone going when using it. I tried using a compressor but did not like at all what it did with the tone. These amps have such a nice note bloom without squealing that a compressor really kills that IMO so I dont like it. You can try it and see how you like it, didnt do anything for me.

FYI the compressors I used were the MXR and the Boss CS-3.

[Flannery]

Thanks for the welcome Dann...I'll try out your suggestion tonight, as well as monkey with my EQ some more and let you know how it went .

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Flannery
I'm definitely trying for a metal tone, but I don't want to go with the typical scoop method that some resort to. I'm a big fan of mids, but I can't seem to make it work on the recordings. Am I missing something obvious with the mike placement (which is against the cabinets grill about midway from the center) or are my EQ settings out to lunch? I've been playing for 20 years but I'm feeling like a rookie right now, so any suggestions that you folks can make would be much appreciated... [/B]
Hello and welcome aboard!

I have quite the same placement for the mic. Straight to the grille probably an inch from the outer edge of the element. My amp settings are about (2ch with contour):

Gain 13:00 Treble 13:00 Middle 13:00 Bass 11:00 Master 9:45

I get really good results at live and studio settings. What equipment do you use to record the guitar? I've noticed huge differences between normal "computer audio card" preamps and professional preamps. If you checkout my "First One" clip and the rest, the trailer and other F50 clips, you'll notice a difference at that comes from the recording preamps.

Your cab or elements might be loose sounding. JB isn't the tightest pickup, I've noticed that on my guitars. I generally like it's sound, but on records my MusicMan Petrucci sounds tighter although not so lively.

Hopefully there's something useful on the lines above :rolleyes:

[Gazz]

Help please !

Can anyone recommend a supplier inthe UK for a can of spray cellulose/other lacquer to re finifsh the back of the neck of a guitar.

I have tried a clear automotive lacquer and after it has dried for a couple of weeks isnt quite slippy enough.

Thanks.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Originally posted by thrash


Thanks for the welcome, I'm still waiting to receive my F-100. I'll be running it thru a 2x12 Mesa 3/4 back cab. I use an Ibanez Jem7VWH, a RG570, and a ESP EX-351 with 81/85 combo.

I notice a lot of people use compressors on this board. How will that effect the clean and gain channels?

Hi thrash,

I am one of the ones that uses a compressor with my F-50. I use a vintage MXR Dynacomp (1978 pots I believe) that differs somewhat from the current reissues in that it has greater output (easy to hear), and sounds different (difficult to describe). Regardless, this pedal has become a staple part of my rig; I use it both as a clean boost, and for the compression effect, in fact I usually use some combination of the two.

I use the compressor most often on the Clean channel. It takes the already excellent clean tone, and kicks it into orbit. I tend to max the Output and dial in a touch of compression, and the resulting tone is bursting with dynamics and touch sensitivity. Indeed, I would put this clean tone toe-to-toe with any Fender, it's that good.

I often use the compressor on the Dirty channel with the Gain low. On a dirty sound, higher compression can add a controllable amount of "furring" to the note envelope, making things sound more vintage. I often use this approach for cleanish to medium gain sounds on the dirty channel, when I'm after that vintage flavour (check out the Woody Clean, and Classic 6L6 clips in my sig for more). With a medium Gain setting on the Dirty channel, I sometimes use the Dynacomp as a clean boost, to push the sound into old school High Gain territory (check out the Classic High Gain clip in my sig). Obviously I love to use the F-50 alone for Low and Medium Gain tones too, and in fact I don't tend to use the Dynacomp at all if I have the Gain setting higher than 11 o'clock - preferring. the sound of the F-50 unadulterated. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Dann'sTheMan


Hi Flannery,

and welcome to the F-series Lounge and the cool brotherhood that hangs out here. :) You may have been talking about hal9000's audition settings, but we all contribute and share ideas. Indeed many of my most common settings were originally shared here.

Regarding your recording woes, one mike placement technique that I've been using a lot recently as it gives very balanced results with my SM57 - especially with higher gain tones, is to position the barrel of the mike in line with the edge of the dust cap and the cone, and then point the mike at the centre of the dust cap. The barrel typically makes around a 30 degree angle with the speaker grill, but I play around with this angle for the tone I'm after. I also play around with the distance that the mike is away from the grill - say 2 ~ 5 centimetres.

Let me know if this approach yields some promising results,

Big smiles,

Andy. Hey Andy, this is how I interpreted your mic placement instruction... did I get it?

Tommi's instruction sounds different to me. It seems his method has the mic straight-on aimed near the outer edge of the cone as opposed to yours being aimed at the center of the dust cap. And if I remember correctly someone (Hal9000 possibly?) had the mic placed near the dust cap and aimed perpendicular to the cone. These placements seem to cover a lot of options for close mic'ing and are all quite a bit different.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c144/markaland/micplcmnt.jpg

[Tommi Inkila]

Yes. My SM57 is straight on the cloth and on the outer edge. The reasons for this are; I get rid of the fizzy top end and proximity effect brings out the bass frequencies. Without it, SM57 will sound hollow since it starts to roll off the lower end already at 400hz :eek:

[Flannery]

Hello all,
I experimented a bit last night and ended up with some interesting results:

I decided to go for a more Marshall type distortion, so I dialed in Hal9000's (got it right this time!) vintage high gain audition tone and bumped up the gain to 12 o'clock and rolled the bass back to 10 o'clock. I then set up the mike the way Dann suggested and recorded a couple of passes. I found a definite improvement in the low end, but it still isn't quite what I'm looking for. Now I have to find a way to boost the gain up a bit more without it degenerating into mush again. I'm sure there will be some lengthy tweaking involved, but I think my first alternative will be to run my Boss blues driver out in front at various gain settings to see if I can get the extra bit of gain I want, but maintain the clarity. I find with the F-50 if you boost the gain without boosting the master, the bottom end can get really loose, really fast. I'm sure if I ran the master high enough I could get what I'm looking for(I find this amp tightens up really nicely at higher volumes....but I'm afraid I might liquify myself if I do....hehe) but 9:30 or 10 o'clock is about as hot as I can run it without the police knocking on my door, so I guess improvisation is key. Have any of you ever used an overdrive out front before? And if so how did you find the results?

I'll try to experiment a bit more this weekend, and I'll let you guys know how it went. Tahnks again for the suggestions!

[markmann]

Originally posted by Tommi Inkila
Yes. My SM57 is straight on the cloth and on the outer edge. The reasons for this are; I get rid of the fizzy top end and proximity effect brings out the bass frequencies. Without it, SM57 will sound hollow since it starts to roll off the lower end already at 400hz :eek: Thanks, Tommi, I'm going to be experimenting with mic placement soon and is why I asked. I want to make sure I get all the different methods documented so that I can duplicate what has worked for you guys.

[markmann]

Originally posted by Flannery
I find with the F-50 if you boost the gain without boosting the master, the bottom end can get really loose, really fast. I'm sure if I ran the master high enough I could get what I'm looking for(I find this amp tightens up really nicely at higher volumes....but I'm afraid I might liquify myself if I do....hehe) but 9:30 or 10 o'clock is about as hot as I can run it without the police knocking on my door, so I guess improvisation is key. Have any of you ever used an overdrive out front before? And if so how did you find the results?
FYI, 9:30 is the starting point with any gain setting for me on the red channel. If the volume is too loud I use either a volume device in the loop or an attenuator, either of which work much better than lowering the master.

As far as using OD out front really depends what you're after. I use different pedals out front but not as a replacement for the f50 red channel drive but rather to get different sounds to simulate another amp or toadd another channel. No pedal I've tried has matched the quality of tone I get from the red channel. Tweaking the controls and using the right guitar/pickup combo is the key for me.

[Flannery]

Thanks for the suggestion Markman. I'll pull out the volume pedal and give it a go!

[Dann'sTheMan]

A couple of points to quickly respond to:

markmann, yep that's the mike placement technique that I was describing. I often have the mike at quite a severe angle - in your diagram my mike's barrel would be at say 4 o'clock. I also use other mike placement techniques including perpendicular to the grille (like Tommi) - indeed the majority of my clips were recorded this way. I also use another interesting one shown to me by an Australian sound guy that was flown in to engineer a TV satellite show I was recording. The barrel of the mike is at the centre of the dust cap, but the mike is pointing out towards the edge of the dust cap at quite a severe angle (e.g. 3.30 o'clock in your diagram).

Flannery, I take it for granted that I'm using loop attenuation. This allows me to set the amp's Master Volume where I want (usually 11 o'clock or more), and then bring the overall volume level down using the loop. Let us know how you get on with your volume pedal in the loop. :)

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Jaggery]

Allright guys No more pre sales questions from me. I just came back with an F-50 Combo. Alchemist I got your pm and hopefully I made the right decision.

Here are some points.

I tried both F-50 and F-30 for about an hour.

1) I chose F-50 over F-30 because of the Clean channel. This is as good as I have heard. I am comparing the clean to a DR and a Booteek clone. Close very close.

The F-30 had a great clean sound, I guess the bigger cab of F-50 gives it a bigger sound.

2) I chose the F-Series over the Rivera Pubster/Clubster because I didnt want to buy and amp and have to use pedal. Though I would have preferred a marshall flavor with the rivera.

3) I will definetly be going thru this thread for settings for the Channel 2 and with Contour. My first Mesa amp, so I will have to spend some time getting the most marshally sound I can.

4) Quite loud on Ch 2, I doubt I can play this for long periods with the master anyway beyong 9 o clock.

5) Very Fat on Ch2. Mid Knob has subtle influence even at full tilt.

6) Reverb is fine. Too extreme at full. Has to be kept at 1/2 or less.

7) A Little noisy. I am guessing tubes have some noise (is it called white noise) and will go away with some playing.

8) Overall all a big sounding amp. maybe a little too big for home use, esp on the distortion channel.

9) I chose Mesa because the dealer is 10 minute drive from my house and 5 year warranty, quality and what not.

Here is a pic.

[Alchemist]

Cool man, glad you got what you liked. The F-30 combo can sound a little weak because its small cab doesnt project as well. Thats why I prefer the head, pushing a 4*12 its a little monster. As far as your noise issue. I do not have any on mine so it could just be tubes that were rattled as it was transported to the store?

[musicdog400]

I looked at the pic. That's interesting, I don't think mine says Mesa Boogie on the front. I'll have to check.

[Alchemist]

Originally posted by musicdog400
I looked at the pic. That's interesting, I don't think mine says Mesa Boogie on the front. I'll have to check.

Not all production runs came with that extra logo. I forget which serial numbers have them and which dont. My head does not have it either.

[Dann'sTheMan]

Welcome to the brotherhood, Jaggery. The F-30 can certainly sound quite British whereas the 6L6 F-series wear their American voicing with proud (although there are admittedly some Marshall-esque tones in there :p).

Whilst you're going through the thread, keep an eye out for posts regarding attenuating the F-50'S volume in the loop (with a volume pedal, multi-fx unit or even a home made project box). I use this approach, at it turns the F-50 into a very home friendly amp (and saves your hearing too).

Regarding the noise issue, my F-50 has always been a touch noisy. Some have been bothered enough to experiment in locating the culprit tube (often pre-amp). You might try this, if you have a spare known quiet 12AX7 or equivalent. :cool:

I hope you have as much fun with your new Boogie as I do! :D

Big smiles,

Andy.

[Flannery]

I tried out the volume pedal in the effects loop, and it works great! I'm not too sure of the science behind it, so I'll have to check some of the old threads. I assume you are attenuating the preamp signal, since the effects loop sits between the pre-amp and outout stage. That way the pre-amp tubes are at whatever gain setting you choose and the power stage just ends up with a smaller signal to amplify...so you can run it hot without killing yourself..:). Am I close with this theory?

I haven't had a chance to record since I hooked up the volume pedal, but once I have I'll post the results!

Oh and one other question, is it a huge hassle to switch from 6L6's to EL34's or KT 77"s?

Thanks!

[Tommi Inkila]

Originally posted by Flannery
I tried out the volume pedal in the effects loop, and it works great! I'm not too sure of the science behind it, so I'll have to check some of the old threads. I assume you are attenuating the preamp signal, since the effects loop sits between the pre-amp and outout stage. That way the pre-amp tubes are at whatever gain setting you choose and the power stage just ends up with a smaller signal to amplify...so you can run it hot without killing yourself..:). Am I close with this theory?

I haven't had a chance to record since I hooked up the volume pedal, but once I have I'll post the results!

Oh and one other question, is it a huge hassle to switch from 6L6's to EL34's or KT 77"s?

Thanks!
Yep, the theory is there.

It's quite big hassle to change those tubes... you need at least to mod the amp to have bias pot/switch. Also some other modding may be necessary since 6L6's draw very much more voltage than EL34's so that simple bias pot won't be enough. I can't say anything about KT77's, but I guess the story is the same.

Please, correct me if I'm wrong.