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View Full Version : Third Eye Blind...business expose. A MUST READ!!!


EcHoplex
06-21-2002, 12:18 PM
Remember the band Third Eye Blind? Well, here's an article on their former guitar player Kevin Cadogan - who's been involved in a lengthy 2 and a half year court battle with the band. You'll definitely want to read this. It gives us all a music biz lesson to think about.

New York Times copyright 2002.

What is a band? To most rock fans (and dictionaries), a band is a group of people playing music. But to lawyers and record labels, a band is something that exists on paper, a business relationship with owners, employees and sometimes even shareholders. Some bands function as a democracy, with each member owning an equal share and having an equal say. Others are more like a monarchy (or in the worst of cases, a dictatorship), with one leader in charge of a bunch of hired guns. And then there's Third Eye Blind, the rock band that struck success in 1997 with the hit "Semi-Charmed Life."
The band, several people who worked with it said, was presented to some of its members and its associates as a democracy, but behind the scenes was set up as a corporation with a single owner and shareholder, its singer, Stephan Jenkins.
For the past two and a half years, its former guitarist, Kevin Cadogan, has been mired in a lawsuit with the band. In the suit, he accused the group of fraud, wrongful termination and breach of contract. On Tuesday, the day the lawsuit was set to go to trial in Federal District Court in Oakland, the parties reached a financial settlement and agreement, the terms of which have not been disclosed.
Two weeks before the settlement, however, Mr. Cadogan, who records and produces music in Berkeley, Calif., visited Los Angeles to discuss his experiences with Third Eye Blind. His stories showed just how complex the inner workings of a group can be.

Like many band relationships, the problems boiled down to the metaphor of who gets to hold the controls, who gets the credit for holding the controls and who gets paid for holding the controls. The band formed in Berkeley in 1994, shortly after a hip-hop duo that Mr. Jenkins was in broke up. Soon, he and Mr. Cadogan were working together as Third Eye Blind, agreeing, Mr. Cadogan said, to an equal partnership in the band and its earnings.
As record labels began to show interest, the mood began to change. Five days before the band signed with Elektra Records, Mr. Jenkins established Third Eye Blind Inc. as a corporation, naming himself as the corporation's sole owner and shareholder, without telling anyone else in the four-member group, Mr. Cadogan said. The record deal, then, signed Mr. Jenkins and Mr. Cadogan as artists "professionally known as Third Eye Blind," but the payments were made to Third Eye Blind Inc., which in effect meant to Mr. Jenkins.
In fact, it wasn't until three years later, Mr. Cadogan said, that he even realized that he wasn't an equal partner. Some of the band's business associates, however, feel that Mr. Jenkins deserved to control the group, since it was his vision and ambition that was largely responsible for its mainstream success.
Jason Slater, the original bassist in Third Eye Blind, said Mr. Jenkins often declined to record a good song of Mr. Cadogan's because it meant giving him credit. "Stephan's been doing that same thing to everybody forever," Mr. Slater said. "He doesn't want to lose the façade of him being the musical genius, so he surrounds himself with people who are talented to pump himself up."
Right or wrong, Mr. Jenkins's musical and business instincts paid off, and the band's self-titled debut album went on to sell some six million copies.


Business problems, however, weren't the only tensions within the band. "They were at odds with each other almost the entire time they were working together," Eric Valentine, a co-producer of the band's first album, said of Mr. Jenkins and Mr. Cadogan. "They were two very strong personalities. But the stuff they collaborated on was my favorite of everything the band has done. That tension created a lot of good music but ultimately destroyed their relationship."
Mr. Cadogan said the breaking pointcame in 1999 when he discovered that Mr. Jenkins had issued every share in Third Eye Blind Inc. to himself. Mr. Cadogan then declined to sign a deal that would give the band $1 million to record an EP, or mini-album, until he and Mr. Jenkins could straighten out their affairs. Around the same time, one of the band's early guitarists, Tony Fredianelli, was brought back into the fold, originally to play keyboards and guitar in concerts.
The EP deal was then renegotiated to exclude Mr. Cadogan, and on Jan. 18, 2000, the money was transferred to Third Eye Blind Inc. Exactly one week later, after a performance at the Sundance Film Festival in Utah, Mr. Cadogan was told that he had been cut from the band, replaced by Mr. Fredianelli. Mr. Cadogan said he returned to his hotel room to discover that, adding insult to injury, his hotel bill for the four-day stay had been put in advance in his name, not the band's. The band's manager, Eric Godtland, did not return repeated requests for comment, and the spokeswoman for its record label was unavailable.
Since leaving the band, Mr. Cadogan said, he has not been paid a penny in royalties. Third Eye Blind is working on its first album in three years, due out this fall.
Looking back on his experiences, Mr. Cadogan, who now leads the rock band Bully, said, "We're taught algebra, geometry and calculus in school, but what we're not taught is basic law."
"I walked around as a kid with that shirt from the Clash tour that said `Know Your Rights,' he said, "but unfortunately I only saw the letters in the mirror and they were backwards, so I couldn't read what they said."
The lesson learned, he said, for fledgling rock stars is: "Learn about law, and about statutes of limitations.
"Then get good lawyers."
Copyright 2002 The New York Times Company

ozraves
06-21-2002, 01:03 PM
Thanks for the article.

Great info for sure. I knew one band where the leading creative force in the group couldn't get anyone else to pay attention to business. So, everything got set up in his name b/c he couldn't prod the rest of the band to go to the lawyers to sign papers.

After they recorded their debut album, the rest of the band fired him for being too demanding. Unfortunately, they fired the person who owned everything including the copyrights.

Scheming Demon
06-21-2002, 01:54 PM
Interesting read. If this article is accurate this guy Steve Jenkins is a real scum bag to screw over his bandmates like that. Assuming he actually went behind their backs and did it without them knowing about it or agreeing to such an arrangement.

Also, if it's true he didn't allow other "good" songs to be recorded because he didn't participate in their creation. What a tool and total loser.

It's people like him that give the music business a bad name. It's bad enough with all the other scumbags outside of a band trying to screw you over but when it's inside your own band.

EcHoplex
06-21-2002, 02:16 PM
Scheming - not only is this article accurate but, it's one of the many lawsuits the band has been involved in if you can believe that. I couldn't agree more with you that it's shit like this that makes a person really think about getting into this business at all.

The record biz seems to be one giant over-sized circus. Once, Benjamin Franklin makes an appearance everyone starts crawling out of the woodwork to collect.:D

cavemanic
06-21-2002, 07:11 PM
Here's a couple of classic quotes I just found looking on the Third eye blind site.

As for his role as the band's producer, Jenkins says, "People might think it's a control-freak situation where I sit around telling the rest of the band what to do, but it's not like that. We all write the music, and Arion, for example, got more involved in the production this year."


Jenkins says of touring, "There are times when you have a headache or you're stuffed up and you feel like 'I don't want to do this,' and hotels can get depressing. But once you walk out onstage, it becomes totally worth it."

(Yeah I guess hotels would be pretty depressing when you have to pay the bill.....)

UPDATE FROM STEPHAN--1/31/02

Back from Paris. I assure you all the glamorous life of fashion is a ridiculous cavalcade of bullshit filled with silly adjectives that adorn unwearable clothes. It was fun, though. It reaffirmed to me that making rock records in San Francisco is the coolest thing in the world. I am looking forward to spending the next few months at work in the city of my dream. Peace out.

He concludes, "I don't write songs based on sales projections. I took the same approach on this album that I've always taken: to write songs that are exciting and authentic."


Their 1997 self-titled debut album represents the coda of their do-it-yourself ethic. The fiercely independent band eschewed a bidding war by choosing Elektra, which guaranteed them complete control and the kind of creative home where 3EB could launch their musical assault.

Ten of the album's 14 songs were written by Jenkins and Cadogan, with the remaining four written by Jenkins. But all agree it's the musical embellishments that the entire band makes that bring the songs to life.



I'm thinking of posting this article on there board ,people like that should be exposed for what there are.....

EcHoplex
06-24-2002, 08:37 AM
I'm surprised that more people haven't commented on this article. I figured a bunch of you would be gobbling this one up...hahahahah.

An interesting fact: You'd think that with all the stories and " tell all" books out there today that bands would learn more effective ways to communicate and that stories like Third Eye Blind's would be passe' but they're not.

Scheming Demon
06-24-2002, 12:48 PM
Originally posted by EcHoplex
I'm surprised that more people haven't commented on this article.

Me too. Too many musicians are totally ignorant when it comes to the business side of things. Of course anyone can be screwed if they get mixed up with an unscrupulous band member and don't realize it until it's too late.

So many musicians get taken advantage of because they don't want to deal with anything other then making music. It's a shame there's so many people out there just waiting to take advantage of the unsuspecting.

I would bet a lot of money that this lesson is learned the hard way by almost every successful musician out there.

EcHoplex
06-24-2002, 01:00 PM
Scheming - So True!!! But I guess they deserve it when they choose to look the other way.

I know one thing...before I invest one more penny into my band..we will have a band agreement signed by everyone. I won't do another thing until that's in place.

If there's one thing that I've learned...is that you can never be too cautious in this bizzzznessss.:D

IsildursBane
06-24-2002, 01:33 PM
>He doesn't want to lose the façade of him being the musical
>genius

Am I the only one who finds that statement amusing?

-Dan.

EcHoplex
06-24-2002, 02:10 PM
Dan - I'm not sure what you mean or if you're just being incredibly sarcastic?:D

Wareyin
06-24-2002, 04:40 PM
Originally posted by EcHoplex
I'm surprised that more people haven't commented on this article. I figured a bunch of you would be gobbling this one up...hahahahah.

An interesting fact: You'd think that with all the stories and " tell all" books out there today that bands would learn more effective ways to communicate and that stories like Third Eye Blind's would be passe' but they're not.

I haven't said anything because to me right now, it's just a he said/he said kind of thing...like it is almost everytime someone leaves a band. You just don't know how much is true from either side.

Terry Allan Hall
06-25-2002, 06:43 AM
Food for (much) thought!

IsildursBane
06-26-2002, 10:44 AM
>I'm not sure what you mean or if you're just being incredibly
>sarcastic?

They think there are people who consider the work of 3EB to be "musical genius" ??? That would be like someone on the Montreal Expos maintaining a facade of being a great baseball player. Who are they kidding? :-)

-Dan.

EcHoplex
06-26-2002, 10:56 AM
Ahhhh yes....sarcasm rules.

Chriss
07-01-2002, 05:20 AM
I saw Third Eye Blind playing live on some awards show a few years back and remember thinking to myself, "This singer looks like a complete jackass."

Always go with your first impression.

Skarekrough
07-02-2002, 11:13 AM
The most important contact a band can make is with a good entertainment lawyer.

A little over a year ago my band signed a management deal; it was essentially a year in length and stipulated that the manager would pay 5 grand for us to record a CD and would get a year to shop us around to labels and would get a certain percentage of the take when we got signed.

First off the original contract had ALL sorts of issues. The most notable one involved the contract continuing on for another 2 years past expiration of the 1 year if we didn't notify him via certified mail of dismissal.

I ponied up the money while the band harped on me that i was souring the deal. They said he could be trusted and that i was screwing things up. Now that it's over they admitted that there was talk of disamissing me for someone that would of signed immediately. Either way me and my lawyer fought for a contract that we wanted and got it.

The manager worked pretty hard up until about two weeks after the CD was released. The CD release party was one month after we signed the contract. I've yet to see hide or hair of him since. He's burned 2 other artists that didn't have the smarts to go to a lawyer out of money and rights. But for about 10 months the only time we heard from him was when he was attempting to woo the lead-singer from the band and into a solo project. He also attempted to cause unrest among the band members hoping that by someone leaving and breaking up the band we'd be in default of the contract and have to reimburse him for the five grand.

The lead-singer, to his credit, remained true to his friends, us. A few weeks ago I sent off a letter certified mail stating that we wouldn't be renewing with him....not because I needed to...but because I wanted him to remember that he tried to screw us in the beginning, middle and end.

As far as we can tell the manager put in the work thinking that we'd get signed to a label on the strength of the performance at teh CD release party. When that didn't happen he just gave up and signed other artists (which he proceeded to screw). He also screwed the owner and engineer of the studio we recorded in to the tune of a couple grand.

I got a phone call from the lead singer yesterday. Our former manager is in jail currently...not sure for what...but I'm willing to bet it has something to do with fraud. I'm just gald he got the certified mail before he landed in the clink.

SomeGuyNamedRob
07-02-2002, 11:43 AM
Originally posted by IsildursBane
>I'm not sure what you mean or if you're just being incredibly
>sarcastic?

They think there are people who consider the work of 3EB to be "musical genius" ??? That would be like someone on the Montreal Expos maintaining a facade of being a great baseball player. Who are they kidding? :-)

-Dan.

The Expos are probably the greatest farm team ever. Their problem is no one wanted to pay good money to have a decent team, so guys like Randy Johnson and Pedro Martinez get traded to teams that can use the talent.

GiantBunnySuit
06-17-2004, 02:03 PM
third eye blind owns.

SpiderFingers
06-20-2004, 05:32 PM
I guess Satch didn't teach him anything about the BUSINESS of music when he was taking lessons from him. Good post.