Time Signatures

[TheRaindropReligion]

I've written a song and put it in Guitar Pro and it's time signature is 21/8? Can this be converted into an easier time sig? Its just I've never seen 21/8 before.

Any help would be good thanks

[billsworld]

Your other option would be to call it 7/4, with a swing type shuffle, but that's not really any easier, is it? I have seen some 21/8, mostly in 20th century "classical" music.

[macafied]

Why didn't you write the song in the time signature you wanted?

What is 21/8 time? Never heard of it before.

[prettyvox]

Hi !

I know Pat Metheny has a song with that time signature but I can't recall the name of the song.

[prettyvox]

You can view this time signature like this..


21/8 = 10/8 + 11/8 = (6/4 + 4/4) + (6/4 + 5/4) or if you want..

(3/4 + 3/4 + 4/4) + (3/4 + 3/4 + 5/4)



this is just one of the ways of simplifying the 21/8.

[storm_in_heaven]

hey, you wrote it, why change it? time signatures are not things that must be x or y, they are wonderful things that can be experimented with. to do away with 21/8 just cuz you've never seen it before its just plain wrong. However, if you would like to simplify it to make it easier to understand, the triplet feel 7/4 sounds the best option.

SiH

[Taylorman]

Originally posted by storm_in_heaven
hey, you wrote it, why change it? time signatures are not things that must be x or y, they are wonderful things that can be experimented with. to do away with 21/8 just cuz you've never seen it before its just plain wrong. However, if you would like to simplify it to make it easier to understand, the triplet feel 7/4 sounds the best option.

SiH

[prettyvox]

This s just my humbe opinion but a 7/4 with a triplet feeling still sounds like a 7/4. I usually see time signature like 21/8 like aggregations of simpler time signatures, as described above.

[prettyvox]

For anyone interested on these weird time signatures seach for a learning method called "GAMALA TAKI".

[Flat Fifth Fury]

21/8 is essentially 3 bars of 7/8 so if you can program that, then it's the easy way. Many programs won't let you go beyond a whole notes worth of metronome. So you get 4/4 or 8/8 or 16/16 but no more than that in a measure.

[prettyvox]

hello...

Sorry but I'll have to disagree on this one... in my humbe opinion 3 bars of 7/8 or playing a triplet in 7/8 it's still a 7/8 and not a 21/8...

A 21/8 to me is a fusion between different time signatures.

Some major jazz bands and artists from the ECM recording company as well as some other world music artists use this kind of time signatures and it sounds totaly different from a 7/8.

[prettyvox]

Of course if you want to simplify a 21/8 on your computer you can do this way...

well 3*7 = 21... so if you have 7 bars of a 3/8 ... or 3 bars of 7/8... you've got your problem solved.

But keep in mind that 21/8 it's not a 3/8 nor a 7/8.


There's a pretty good book called "Gamala Taki" by Karl Berg.. it's awesome stuff for drumers as well as for other musicians

[punkmunky]

im a guitarist but like when i write stuff i never think of oh this is in a certain time signature i just write stuff the way it comes out and the way i like it the way it sounds. I think i just do this sub consciously but like what about bands like dilinger escape plan how do you know what time signature they play in, cuz alot of their stuff sounds off beat and the crazy drumming just throws my mind off can anyone help me with this.

[billsworld]

We've all been assuming that the 21/8 subdivides into all groups of 3, which may in fact not be the case, and if that's so then all this discussion becomes not terribly important. How do the 21 beats group? Is it all groups of 3, or are there some 3's and some 2's? And what's the pattern of those groupings? Your 21/8 may easily divide into several smaller measures, but it might not be evenly divided. Don't know why I didn't think to ask before.

[prettyvox]

I don't know those bands... but since they are playing different instruments perhaps some may be playing a 4/4 and the drummer playing 5/4... kind like a polyrhytm

About the 21/8 there are different ways to do it...


21/8 = 10/8 + 11/8 and pay attention that you can play a 10/8 or a 11/8 in different ways, so there's lots of combinations...

ex 1.

21/8 = 10/8 + 11/8 = (3/8+3/8+2/8+2/8)+(3/8+3/8+3/8+2/8)

21/8 = 10/8 + 11/8 = (2/8+3/8+2/8+3/8)+(2/8+3/8+3/8+3/8)

Get a book called "Gamala Taki" by Karl Berger... it's awesome stuff to practise this kind of stuff