Line 6 BackTrack Instant Replay for Guitar

[Jon Chappell]

BackTrack ($100), BackTrack+Mic ($150)

Every songwriter or improvising musician has wished at least once that he could rewind his life to capture that moment of inspiration that got away. That one second of perfect poetry that sped fleetingly by, never to be repeated. Well, the Line 6 BackTrack aims to ensure that your epiphanies never escape again by offering up a small, cleverly designed and surprisingly functional recording device that’s about the size of a cellphone and a lot lighter.

The BackTrack goes in between your guitar and amp/pedalboard, and features battery-powered always-on recording to capture anything and everything you play. If you opt for the BackTrack+Mic (as I did for this review), you can expand the function to record vocals, speech, or anything going on in your ambient surroundings. The mono microphone (and preamp circuitry) is quite good — much better than any digital memo recorder from RadioShack. The sound quality is excellent, and the range of signals the BackTrack can handle is surprisingly wide-ranging. It also interfaces easily with your computer via USB, allowing you to manage files, tweak settings, and more.

Before we get into the details, take a look a couple of photos to help you get oriented. The BackTrack and BackTrack+Mic are similar physically, with the mic version having a silver-ringed grille on the control panel side. As stated, I used the BackTrack+Mic for this review, but the units are similar in all functions except two: the BackTrack+Mic records with a microphone in addition to its 1/4" guitar input (though not at the same time), and it has more memory than its mic-less sibling. So if you just need your guitar recorded, you can save $50 and opt for the BackTrack.

Here you can see how compact the unit is in my hand.

http://jonchappell.com/hc/BackTrack/BT_Main.jpg

[Jon Chappell]

Here's a shot of the front panel, with (from left to right) the mic, the play selector (for files that you mark, or tag), the Play/Pause button, Track Skip Up, Track Skip Back, and mode switch (Off, Play Only, On). The slot above the Play button is a multi-colored LED that tells you what the BT is doing at any given time. And it does a lot!

http://jonchappell.com/hc/backtrack/bt_front.jpg

[Jon Chappell]

On the rear are two pushbuttons that incrementally boost and lower the headphone level. The 1/8" stereo jack is to the right of the volume controls and heaphone icon.

I was quite impressed with the headphone amp. It was plenty loud when driving my AKG K271 Mk IIs (55 ohms).

The little blades underneath the unit are part of the belt clip.

http://jonchappell.com/hc/backtrack/bt_rear.jpg

[Jon Chappell]

The 1/4" mono output and input jacks. They're next to each other, but it's easy to fit even bulky cord connectors here.

The fact that this is a mono unit (except for the stereo headphone out) is why Line 6 is touting this as a guitar unit. Having said that, its input impedance is optimized for guitar, so it won't load your pickups and sound like crud.

http://jonchappell.com/hc/backtrack/Bt_inout.jpg

[Jon Chappell]

The only picture I'm not showing is the side of the BackTrack that has the USB connection. It's the small, trapezoidally shaped jack, like you'd find on a camera. So though it's not "standard," it's the next best thing, and you should have no trouble replacing the included cable should it be lost, stolen, or mutilated.

This being a USB device, there's a little software utility that ships with the BackTrack. It's resident on the BT itself, so you always have it available, even if you're on a borrowed computer. When you plug the BT in, you get the prompt, just as if you were plugging in any other USB drive. (The BT can, in fact, act as a recordable drive and copy any kind of file for transport.) So if you go to open the "drive" labeled "BackTrack," you find the documentation, your recorded audio files, and the setup utility. You don't need the utility to operate the BT, only to change settings. Similarly, you don't need to introduce the BT to the computer before using it (that is, there's no installation routine). The computer comes in handy for file transferring (and you can drag-n-drop files from your computer, which we'll get into), but you can still use the headphone out to get an analog signal (dual mono) from any file resident on the BT.

So you plug in the unit, navigate to the Backtrack directory, open it, and then launch the utility. Up pops one screen with several pull-down menus, which you use to set the sample rate and bit depth (up to 24-bit/48 kHz), the sensitivity of the 1/4" input and mic, and the various parameters of the auto-record mode. It also allows you to navigate to and access the files on your computer and the unit itself. Note the loop checkbox, which is good for playing back a clip continuously for rehearsal or just woodshedding. I wish you could elect to activate and deactivate the loop from the unit itself, though.

Here's a screen shot of the setup utility.

http://jonchappell.com/hc/backtrack/bt_utility_screen1.jpg

[Jon Chappell]

Line 6's manual are always really good about providing diagrams and clear explanations on how their stuff is used in real-life situations.

So they provide hookup scenarios which I thought I'd re-purpose here.

Both the BT and BT+M allow you to plug in your guitar and use the output to drive an amp, effects unit (here shown as the silhouette of a POD), or floor unit. This is the routing option show at the bottom of the diagram.

If you have the BT+M, you can only output and monitor the mic recording from the headphone jack, as shown mid-page.

At the top, you see that the unit can be powered by either your computer or an AC adapter.
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http://jonchappell.com/hc/BackTrack/BT_hookup_1.jpg

[Jon Chappell]

Okay, this puzzled me for a second until I realized what was going on. In the second hookup scenario, shown below, the BT and BT+M are divided and it looks like you have to use the BT and BT+M differently to record and listen to your sound over headphones.

In fact, you can use both the BT and BT+M for the scenario on the right, but only the BT+M for the scenario on the left. So the BT+M is more versatile, having two ways to monitor your processed audio.

I added red type so that you could see more clearly the intended message here. (Line 6, if you're seeing this, you may want to consider adding that text in the next iteration of the manual -- but you don't have to put it in red on my account :).)

What this hookup does is allow you to monitor with effects. If you have the BT and want to employ the scenario on the right, you'll need a 1/4" to 1/8" adapter to plug the BT's output into the POD's (or whatever device you're using) CD/MP3/Aux/Other Line-Level input.

The advantage of using the BT+M (other than the doubled memory capacity and the ability to record over a mic) is that you don't need an extra cord -- or that bloody adapter. :thu:
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http://jonchappell.com/hc/BackTrack/BT_hookup_2e.jpg

[Jon Chappell]

I found that the best way to use the BT+M, for most of my daily work, was with the mic. It provides excellent fidelity and you can't overwhelm it easily, unless you have the sensitivity set up wrong for the particular application at hand.

For example, I was playing guitar through a 50-watt Marshall JVM210C combo and blasting out the backing tracks over Alesis M1 monitors. I used the setup utility to set the mic for the middle setting (Medium/Electric, which was in between Soft/Acoustic and Loud/Full Band) and I didn't overdrive the mic once. Nor did the mic drop any audio in the quiet passages. Impressive.

Then I switched the mic setting to Soft/Acoustic and tried some unamplified acoustic guitar and un-miked vocals. Again, good pickup, and no low-level noise on the quiet passages. Again, I'm liking this thing.

Here's a graphic of the settings. These are the options that lie under the pull-down menus in the setup utility's one window (see post #5 above).

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http://jonchappell.com/hc/BackTrack/BT_presets.jpg
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Of course, these are just presets, or templates. You can choose any combination of parameters, and things like "minimum silence" are continuously adjustable. If found if you set the minimum silence too short, the recorder cuts in and out at the slightest pause. You don't lose any audio -- the auto-recorder's response is very quick -- but you end up getting a bunch of separate files. But then again, you want the auto-on/off feature engaged at some level, or you just end up recording everything non-stop. And you'd run out your available recording time just as if you'd pushed the record button on your digital memo recorder the minute you walked in your studio. You're not only running out your storage availability, you're creating a lot of work for yourself when it comes time to reviewing the material.

So the varied settings the BT provides are quite useful and are necessary to master for efficiently "recording your life." Speaking of available storage, here's a graphic showing how the BT and BT+M break down with respect to audio quality and storage capacity.

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http://jonchappell.com/hc/backtrack/BT_quality_settings.jpg
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As you can see, the BT+M offers twice the storage of the BT. What I use as my benchmark is "master quality for an evening's worth of music." In my world, that translates to 16-bit/44.1 kHz for four hours. As a gigging musician, I typically play four-hour engagements -- 9:00 p.m. to 1:00 a.m., 8:00 p.m. to 12:00 midnight -- that sort of thing. Our band typically plays four 45-minute sets, but sometimes there's in-between music I want to record (house music, another act alternating with us, break music supplied by the band, etc.). So I know I'm covered with a recorder that has four hours. Your mileage may vary.

From the chart, you can see that I would need the BT+M to cover just the storage needs, but I also -- by definition of my usage -- need the mic option the BT+M provides. (You could take a board feed via an available mono out -- or bring an adapter that shorts the stereo to mono, but that's assuming a lot.) You need to study this chart carefully, because, alas, the BT and BT+M do not offer the option of removable media (SD cards, and such). But in Line 6's defense, this helps them keep the price down. BT owners get 3 hours at the "minimum master quality" setting -- a phrase of my own coinage, but one that works, because you can't create an audio CD file with anything less (unless you up-covert, of course). That's still quite a lot if you consider that that exactly equals four 45-minute sets. But it's not the margin of comfort I'm looking for.

So it's the BT+M for me, and that can serve as my all-purpose practice aid and memo recorder.

[Jon Chappell]

One cool thing about the BT is that it's a stereo .wav player. You can load it up with four hours of music via your computer, go on the road, and enjoy 16-bit 44.1 kHz stereo .wav music. Good as CD, better than mp3.

You tend to forget this (though it's stated in the manual) when using the BT to record via its inputs (mic, guitar), because these are of course mono inputs and then dual mono on the headphone out.

But drag 'n' drop files from your computer into the BT, and you'll enjoy good-as-CD audio with a lightweight device that has no moving parts! (Good for the gym, running, and car rides with really bad suspensions.) There's no display (as is true of an iPod Shuffle), so you'll need to print out a track list if you need to know where you are in the program.

Speaking of the manual, it doesn't tell you its "memory reclamation priority" when you run out of room. For example, let's say I load up my BT+M with four hours (the maximum at CD resolution) of music for a road trip to the gig. Then I want to record the band when I get to the gig (also four hours).

As I start to record the band, which files already resident on the BT get erased first? What if I record only one hour? How many computer-transferred files will remain, and in what order? The manual doesn't say. This could affect how you load your files in the first place, when preparing for, say a long time away from the computer. You'd like to know which files have the highest priority, as they'll be the last to be written over. And you know that these will only be written over only as necessary.

I could figure this out myself through experiment, but I've found an easier way: I've got a call into Line 6. I'll let y'all know.

[Jon Chappell]

This feature was important, so I'm putting it in its own post (rather than including it in the previous one).

The BT will not only record in .wav formats up to 24-bit/48 kHz, it will play back files in these other formats, too. That means better than CD-quality playback right from your BT.

So if you're recording in a DAW and like to keep your files in, say, 24-bit until you're forced to dither down to 16-bit for CD production, you can at least enjoy your music's 24-bit quality in a place other than the computer. Nice, huh?

For a portable player (where I'm usually in less-than-ideal listening environments and monitoring over headphones), 16/44 is fine. But if you had to, say transfer files from your workstation to another one, you could use the BT to not only transport the files in the high-res state, but listen to them that way on your trip over to the other studio. Pretty hypothetical, I know, but still kind of cool because it is an option.

[Anderton]

Jon, this is very cool...I'm surprised it's out so soon after being announced.

Question: You said it can handle a wide range of signal levels, but can it take line levels? One use I could see for this would be hooking it to the monitor outs of my audio interface when cutting synth parts, vocals, whatever...whatever I was recording, it would pick up.

And if anyone from Line 6 is listening, I'd like to see a "MIDI backtrack" as well that would patch between a keyboard's MIDI out and an interface's MIDI in. Just think how much MIDI data you could record with a couple Gigs of RAM!! Don't know if there's much demand for this type of thing, but I sure could use it.

[Jon Chappell]

Jon, this is very cool...I'm surprised it's out so soon after being announced.

Yes, would that other manufacturers followed Line 6's lead. I'm still waiting for stuff I saw at Winter NAMM 08 to ship. Kudos to L6 on this.

Question: You said it can handle a wide range of signal levels, but can it take line levels? One use I could see for this would be hooking it to the monitor outs of my audio interface when cutting synth parts, vocals, whatever...whatever I was recording, it would pick up.

Excellent question, and one I can't answer right now, because the input impedance isn't listed in the specs. (In fact, there is no specs page at all.) But since it handles guitars so well, and because "guitar" is in the tagline ("BackTrack - Instant replay for guitar"), I'm assuming it's on the order of 1 MΩ. But I'll put in another call to Line 6 (I've got some of my own questions pending), and in the meantime, I'll try experimenting with audio levels myself. To remind the readers, these would be mono, but as you said, Craig, for instrument parts and selected other parts coming from a monitor out, pre-fade aux send, or direct out of a buss, etc., the BT could be just the ticket.

And if anyone from Line 6 is listening, I'd like to see a "MIDI backtrack" as well that would patch between a keyboard's MIDI out and an interface's MIDI in. Just think how much MIDI data you could record with a couple Gigs of RAM!! Don't know if there's much demand for this type of thing, but I sure could use it.

Brilliant! :thu:

[Jon Chappell]

I heard back from Mike Murphy of Line 6, who answered a bunch of my questions. First, about the line level issue. They don't recommend it, even with padding the input with the sensitivity controls in the software. It's not that the unit will blow up or anything, it's just that Line 6 just didn't test the BT with any line-level gear. They developed the BT as strictly an inline guitar device.

Fair enough. But it still may not stop anyone from trying! ;)

Second, Mike confirmed that the input impedance is 1 MΩ on the 1/4" input. That makes it a guitar device, all right, just like the input of your amp. (Though, again, the more "guerrilla" among us have done a lot worse than put a line level signal into a guitar amp input and "gotten the job done.")

I also asked Mic about the microphone, which I was very impressed with. Here's what he said.

"It’s an electret condenser mic that we sourced because it has extremely consistent response and we were able to hit it with close to 140 dB (outside of the BackTrack circuit) with zero distortion. Working within the circuit we were able to get up over 115 dB without any clipping at all -- and because it was so consistent, we were able to put a simple filter on it that gives it a very SM57 type curve."

That explains why you can slam this thing so hard and it won't distort. It's built for abuse! At the same time, it doesn't "fizz up" when picking up low levels. It's nice and quiet in those passages where the audio is just barely above the auto-record threshold.

[Anderton]

So are they going to do a MIDI BackTrack? Inquiring minds want to know!

[Jon Chappell]

So are they going to do a MIDI BackTrack? Inquiring minds want to know!

Mike didn't comment on that when asked. But he did get "circumspectfully optimistic" in general, and replied thus: "As for what’s possible in the future: While we wanted to stay focused on this project and come out with something revolutionary for the creative guitarist, we have left the door open.…"

And they've just come out with another guitar-based USB recording device, the POD Studio UX2 (http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/Line-6-TonePort-UX2-USB-RecordingModeling-Interface?sku=249701). (Love those VU meters!) So they've been busy fleshing out the guitar end of the spectrum. But a line-level BackTrack, a MIDI BackTrack, and perhaps an all-purpose preamp/interface may well be in the offing.

Craig, let's button-hole our Line 6 buds at NAMM and really put the screws to them on this! :)

[Jon Chappell]

Initially, I was unclear about how the BT loaded files from the computer. I needed to know this in order to determine how storage space got reclaimed when using the BT to record over pre-existing files. So I emailed Mike Murphy again, and he got back to me. Following is our correspondence:

Jon: Mike, I discovered that the BT sequences your loaded tracks by name (alpha, numerical). No matter what order you load the songs (and have them display in the directory on the computer screen), they are actually stored by name priority. So if you’re going to load this thing up as a music player, you should know your tracks will play back that way, or take steps to number the file names.

But now I’m wondering if the BT observes the same procedure when erasing files to claim space — starting at the top (with "A" or "01.TrackName.wav")? And does it delete the whole wave file (one would presume so). Even if it needs, say, just 500k more, would it wipe out a 20M file to write itself a new file?


Mike: Jon, Re: sequencing. Yes, they are sorted by name (for files in the USER folder). The order that they appear on the screen actually has nothing to do with the order of the files on disk, Windows (and OS X) just allow you to rearrange the visual layout while the disk is mounted. Numbering the file names is the best solution, many music management programs do this already when assigning file names based on metadata.

When reclaiming space, the BackTrack will choose the "oldest" file in the UNMARKED folder, where "oldest" is determined by the internal database (it does not use the file timestamps or file names). (Files that are added by the user to the MARKED or UNMARKED folders are first sorted by name, then added to the database as "new" files when the device is disconnected from the computer.)

When files are deleted to reclaim space, the entire file is deleted.

Note how Mike clarifies the use of USER, MARKED, and UNMARKED folders. These folders are important for two reasons:
1) USER and MARKED files are protected. They do not get erased when the BT needs more disk space to record.

2) There's a Play Marked switch on the BT's front panel. If you need to play back just certain files, you can drag and drop them in the USER and MARKED folders (if using a computer) or hit the Mark button when playing back a recorded segment. So these folder designations help you protect as well as organize for playback the files on the BT (either copied or recorded).

This works out well in real life. I'm obviously loading just good stuff when I use the computer, so I generally want those files saved. If I don't, then I load those files into the Unmarked folder, where they're free to be erased if necessary. Then when I'm recording, I may or may not get "keeper" stuff. The stuff that's obviously good gets Marked (via the press of a front-panel button) and goes into the Marked folder. The other stuff is still there, but it hasn't moved into my "finals" folder.

This way, I can play back just the good stuff on the car ride home with bandmates, or efficiently scroll through just the keeper files in a meeting (no more having to listen for several seconds or minutes to determine if that's the right take). Since there's no fast forward or rewind (nor a display), having a track skip function -- married to a scheme that allows you to transfer and then exclusively play just those files -- makes for quick navigation through your recorded material.

Boot Time
One thing I wasn't fond of (till I learned the workaround, described below) is the boot time. It takes about 14 seconds for the BT to power up and be in record-ready mode. This reminds me of the shutter-lag woes of early compact digital cameras. I found out the boot-time delay the hard way: a couple of times when I was trying to capture stuff off of the radio in my car, I'd have to wait for this delay. To put that in a musical context, if you hear a good song, grab your BT and power up, about 8 bars of music will slip by (at q=120) before it's record-ready.

Now to be fair, Line 6 has gone to great lengths to get around this by making the auto-record functions so deep. And because recording time is plentiful (6 hours at 16/44), and battery life is long (over 8 hours of continuous operation), you should use the Mark button and the Audio Capture settings to ensure nothing escapes your BT's watchful ear, not the Power button.

The lesson I learned in the car: Don't power off. Ever. Let the BT record all the junk it wants. If a good song comes on, I crank the volume to ensure a good recording level. I know the BT has picked up that cue faster than any of my fingers could press a record button. Then I hit Mark. At home, I don't even listed to the Unmarked folder; I just copy the contents from the Marker over to my computer.

And this is the way of the BackTrack. You have to change the way you think of and use a field recorder. If you want manual control, you can find that in the new crop of high-quality portable digital recorders that have sprung up recently. The BT is meant to be used with an "always on" mentality. But that requires an adjustment on the part of the user. Then you realize that that's actually the faster way to grab the ephemeral, fleeting moments of goodness in a steady stream of audio junk that fills our everyday lives.

[Csapo]

Great review and thanks for taking the time to post all of this info.

I've been intrigued with the BackTrack for the last few weeks, so your thread is perfect timing for me.

I see that the BackTrack is used in line with a POD. Can this be used in a live situation on a pedal board and if so, I assume it would be placed last in the chain? If so, would any tone loss occur with this placement?

I'm not really concerned with having the levels of the entire band correct, but I would like to be able to capture my improv playing in our live performances.

[Jon Chappell]

I see that the BackTrack is used in line with a POD. Can this be used in a live situation on a pedal board and if so, I assume it would be placed last in the chain? If so, would any tone loss occur with this placement?

That's a good question, and one that's not accounted for in the setup scheme nor elsewhere in the manual. So I went back to my helpful source at Line 6, Mike Murphy. Here's his response:

"The BT can absolutely be placed in the chain like that -- as long as the user understands that you don’t want to overdrive the input on the BT like you may want to on an amp … you obviously won’t get the same effect."

This makes sense, because there's an A/D converter for the leg of the circuit that splits off to the recording circuitry. Overdrive that with too much gain from pedals upstream in the chain, and you'll have a nasty surprise waiting for you when you go to play back your files. As for tone loss in your live sound -- from the bypass leg in the BT that sends your signal through to the rest of the chain -- a simple A/B comparison (taking the unit in and out of the chain as you test it) should confirm whether or not you're overdriving the input or losing any volume (a sign that things are not as they should be) or getting any change in tone (indicating that you're losing certain aspects of the signal, like the high frequencies).

But it's good to know that Line 6 designed the unit with that purpose in mind.

[Joe Vocht]

This looks like just the thing to go with the spyder Jam re mono wave files.

[Csapo]

That's a good question, and one that's not accounted for in the setup scheme nor elsewhere in the manual. So I went back to my helpful source at Line 6, Mike Murphy. Here's his response:

"The BT can absolutely be placed in the chain like that -- as long as the user understands that you don’t want to overdrive the input on the BT like you may want to on an amp … you obviously won’t get the same effect."

This makes sense, because there's an A/D converter for the leg of the circuit that splits off to the recording circuitry. Overdrive that with too much gain from pedals upstream in the chain, and you'll have a nasty surprise waiting for you when you go to play back your files. As for tone loss in your live sound -- from the bypass leg in the BT that sends your signal through to the rest of the chain -- a simple A/B comparison (taking the unit in and out of the chain as you test it) should confirm whether or not you're overdriving the input or losing any volume (a sign that things are not as they should be) or getting any change in tone (indicating that you're losing certain aspects of the signal, like the high frequencies).

But it's good to know that Line 6 designed the unit with that purpose in mind.

Thanks very much. One more thought then.

Based on Line 6's response (and their recommended POD set up chain), when using a POD, a heavy OD setting should not be used in front of the BackTrack either? Or is the difference because POD is digital and stompbox OD pedals (used for pushing an amp) are analog? (hopefully this is not too lame of a conclusion!!!)

[Anderton]

It might also be possible to put it in a guitar effects loop if the loop is stomp box-level instead of line level...

[Jon Chappell]

... [W]hen using a POD, a heavy OD setting should not be used in front of the BackTrack either? Or is the difference because POD is digital and stompbox OD pedals (used for pushing an amp) are analog?

It's not that it's "analog vs. digital" in the signal. It's all analog at the output (whether a POD or a Tube Screamer). It's that the POD is more predictable and adjustable with respect to its output because of the way digital modelers work. On the POD, you get your sound from the interplay between the Drive and Channel Volume controls. Once you get that together, you determine the total output with the Output control. (On a POD, the Output has no effect on the sound; it's there to optimize your signal level.) Any other digital modeler that has these stages (Drive, Channel Volume, and Output), or ones similarly named, works the same way.


It might also be possible to put it in a guitar effects loop if the loop is stomp box-level instead of line level...

That's a great idea, assuming of course your floor controller or multi-effects has a loop or aux out optimized for a stompbox -- the way the Vox ToneLab LE does, for example. The POD doesn't, but you could use the POD's headphone out. The only caveats here are that the POD's headphone out is 1/4" stereo and the BT's input is 1/4" mono, and again, the BT is expecting a guitar signal not a headphone-level out. But Csapo, you had said previously you weren't concerned so much with tone, and you could probably get this to work reasonably with some tweaking.

____

And Cspao, your original question was, "Can it be used last in the chain." The answer is still yes, because the BT's input is just like a stompbox or amp's (with respect to impedance), and because that's the way Line 6 designed it to be used. You just have to be careful not to overdrive the input, as Mike Murphy said. Sure, the BT is an extra step in the chain, and one that can be abused, but if you take a little care, the BT will be completely transparent.

[Csapo]

Jon, thanks so much for all the answers and taking time to research and review the BT.

Just an awesome job. http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f399/Csapo/Avatars/appl.gif

Now I guess I gotta go get me one. http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f399/Csapo/Avatars/the29f1c0e7.gif

[Anderton]

I'm sure you're not the only one thinking "I gotta go get me one."

Hey Jon - one more thing. Do you need to connect it up with both input and output? What I'm thinking is that you suppose you want to use it to take notes at a conference or something. If you had a mic capable of driving the BackTrack properly, could you just plug the mic into the BT, set it to record, and let 'er rip?

[Jon Chappell]

Do you need to connect it up with both input and output? What I'm thinking is that you suppose you want to use it to take notes at a conference or something.
If you had a mic capable of driving the BackTrack properly, could you just plug the mic into the BT, set it to record, and let 'er rip?
Yes.

Sorry if I wasn't clear on this: You don't need anything plugged into the output for the unit to record -- either from the onboard mic or the 1/4" input (whether that's a guitar or mic you have plugged in there).

I used the BT+M in the manner you describe, Craig, for the monthly meeting of my RC model airplane club last Monday. The meeting takes place in a large, live-sounding room (a library basement with paneled walls, hard floors, and low ceilings) and there are about 60 people talking (not all at once) from various locations in the room. So it's similar (or worse, acoustics-wise) to a seminar you'd find at a trade show, hotel ballroom, or college campus. I usually record these meetings, so this time I brought my trusty Olympus VN3100 PC (a digital memo recorder) as I usually do, and put it next to the BT+M and had them duke it out for recording-fidelity dominance. Stay tuned for the A/B comparison.

The diagram that addresses the scenario Craig describes is listed in post #7 (http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showpost.php?p=30944293&postcount=7) above, and I've copied a portion of it below. But that diagram shows just the guitar (the headphones indicate you're monitoring the sound, but you don't have to be monitoring to record), even though the routing also applies to the onboard electret mic. Of course, you can plug your own mic into the 1/4" input, which allows you to be more selective -- using a mic with the optimal pickup pattern (and perhaps other characteristics) for the task at hand.
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http://jonchappell.com/hc/backtrack/bt_record_only.jpg
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[Anderton]

Thanks Jon! This is sounding better and better, especially for under $100.

[diazepam]

It might also be possible to put it in a guitar effects loop if the loop is stomp box-level instead of line level...

That is how I am using it, at the end of the effects, after a Boss RC-2. This allows me 2 things: 1. save a loop session from the RC-2 in the BT and 2. overdub with the RC-2 and get all saved in the BT.

[Anderton]

That is how I am using it, at the end of the effects, after a Boss RC-2. This allows me 2 things: 1. save a loop session from the RC-2 in the BT and 2. overdub with the RC-2 and get all saved in the BT.

That's pretty clever. It reminds me of how Guitar Rig includes a "tape deck" you can put at the end of the signal chain to capture what you're playing - I find it very handy for stand-alone mode, where there's no sequencer to do the capturing.

[Jon Chappell]

That is how I am using it, at the end of the effects, after a Boss RC-2. This allows me 2 things: 1. save a loop session from the RC-2 in the BT and 2. overdub with the RC-2 and get all saved in the BT.

Yes, clever. Since you can't overdub with the BT, a looper is the perfect complement. With only a 1/4" input (and no aux input for rhythm tracks), I think you need something to help put the guitar in context. Otherwise you're just recording your solo guitar.

[Jon Chappell]

Two nights ago, Doyle Dykes played a Taylor Guitar clinic not far from my house, at G Guitars in New Haven, CT. I went to see him and brought my trusty BT+Mic.

Here's a two-minute excerpt of his playing, saved as an mp3 and a wave file.

Doyle_Excerpt.mp3 (http://jonchappell.com/hc/Doyle_Excerpt.mp3)

Doyle_Excerpt.wav (http://jonchappell.com/hc/doyle_excerpt.wav)

The mp3 is about 3.2Mb, the wave about 24Mb. Both are in mono. The sound on the mp3 is a little distorted, but I think the sound of the wave file is incredible, seeing how it was just a P.A. system in a store, and not optimal acoustic conditions. But listen to the beginning of the file and then at about the 1:00 mark when he medleys into another tune. That "clicking" is his foot tapping (he's wearing cowboy boots) on a hardwood floor.

Because the mp3 sounds a little distorted, if you're really considering the BT+M -- or a Doyle fan! -- download the wave file and hear how the sound was originally captured before being insulted by mp3 compression.

And if you're not familiar with Doyle, keep in mind that's a solo guitar you're listening to. He does his great dead-thumb thang, then lickety-split chicken' pickin', then some behind-the-nut bending. Awesome!

I recorded the whole night, and the BT+Mic performed brilliantly. At one point I saw the clip indicator flashing red, so I knocked the input level down two clicks. But when I checked the spot in my waveform editor, the level change was smooth; the attenuation was seamless.

Also, I noticed that even when the waveform was squared off in the display of my editor, there was no audible or harsh-sounding clipping. And the meter in the software read exactly zero in the LED ladder. So the mic is precisely calibrated, the clipping gentle and musical, and the input attenuator glitch free.

[diazepam]

Yes, clever. Since you can't overdub with the BT, a looper is the perfect complement. With only a 1/4" input (and no aux input for rhythm tracks), I think you need something to help put the guitar in context. Otherwise you're just recording your solo guitar.

Right, that is why BT works so well with the RC-2 (or any looper you like fwiw) BT 1/4" input's 1MΩ, perfect for this type of pedals. And most of these looper pedals also have an AUX IN so if you think about the options are endless.

[Jon Chappell]

Right, that is why BT works so well with the RC-2 (or any looper you like fwiw) BT 1/4" input's 1MΩ, perfect for this type of pedals. And most of these looper pedals also have an AUX IN so ... the options are endless.

I boldfaced that phrase above because I agree with diazepam here, and his point is absolutely critical in understanding the complementary nature of the BT and a looper (or other device that offers a basic mixing capability).

The BT has no aux in. You can't record your guitar and your (pick one) mp3 player, band (via a board mix), rhythm machine, etc. You have to mix in any aux device upstream. I actually pondered whether to list the lack of an aux in on the BT as a gripe, but decided against it. I do think it's important to know that with only a 1/4" in (as the BT w/out Mic is), you get just your guitar sound. So if you're playing in a band, it's going to be solo guitar -- no band context. The BT+Mic fares better here, but of course, you're recording over an onboard electret (albeit an excellent one) mic.

To capture your full-band, in-context jam sound, you have to solve the problem of mixing. And diazepam is right that with a 1MΩ input impedance, the BT seems purpose-built to go inline in your guitar's signal chain.

[Anderton]

Hey Jon - I got a BackTrack + Mic and I must say it's a cool as it seemed from your description. Maybe cooler, because the thing is just so light and simple and functional that it's hard to fully grasp those qualities solely through words and images.

One really great application is when you're using an amp sim, like the GearBox software, Guitar Rig, etc. in stand-alone mode. Sometimes I find it difficult to play and tweak at the same time, for several reasons: First, of course, is I only have two hands. Second is that when I'm sitting in front of the computer, I have to be careful that the guitar neck doesn't bash into something. But with BackTrack, I can record the EXACT riff I want to process, then put the guitar on its stand and play back the riff while adjusting the controls until everything is tweaked up just right.

If BackTrack weren't so easy to use this might not make sense, but compared to booting up a DAW, installing a plug in, recording a track in the DAW, etc., BackTrack is so simple I've been able to save a lot of time when programming patches. In fact, I'm doing a patch set for a company over in Europe, and plan to bring the BackTrack with me to expedite the process. I bet everyone at the company will buy one after seeing how I use it :)

Anyway Jon great job on the review. Line 6 definitely deserves some serious kudos for this baby.

[Hard Truth]

How does the mic work outdoors? Is a good windscreen included?

[Anderton]

No windscreen - the mic is built into the case itself, it's not external. However, I haven't used it outside yet. I do plan to do some serious sampling with it, though, so let's see what happens...even though I don't think that's the intended application.

I don't really see BackTrack as a replacement for say a Sony D50, but on the other hand, it's so easy to carry around it might capture a sample you'd otherwise miss.

[Jon Chappell]

No windscreen - the mic is built into the case itself, it's not external. However, I haven't used it outside yet. I do plan to do some serious sampling with it, though, so let's see what happens...even though I don't think that's the intended application.

I don't really see BackTrack as a replacement for say a Sony D50, but on the other hand, it's so easy to carry around it might capture a sample you'd otherwise miss.

I think you'll find it a great audio-capturer. It's not only easy to carry around and light, it's durable. I've dropped it twice -- once onto a linoleum floor -- and it didn't glitch (though on playback the audio result was jarring!).

Also, the mic preamp is well-designed. I've monitored the input meters and waveform peaks in WaveLab, and found that even when the waveforms are squared off, the results are quite usable. I concluded the BT+M has some clever approach to handling clipping.

I've received a few PM's from shy watchers of this forum that say perhaps L6 is being conservative when they stop short of recommending the BT+M as a line-level sampler. Some users have reported that that's how they use the unit exclusively. Imagine what L6 will come up with when they produce a purpose-built unit for this task!

No, it won't replace a D50, but it already has replaced my digital memo recorder, just on audio quality alone. It makes me think, "Why do these RadioShack recorders (and their ilk, not to single out RS) remain so poor?" It's the same reaction I have when I encounter bad P.A. systems (NY City subway, Oakland, CA, airport). They are unintelligible, and there's no excuse for it.

The only caveat, of course, is that the BT+M has very few playback features or other interface niceties. I would say to folks, if you do a lot of capturing with this device, make sure there's a computer in your near future. Your material is all there, of course, but it's a lot blind scrolling. Because you can't tell how many file divisions the unit has made for you, you'll be hitting that track advance button a lot. Still, I treat this as a rugged device that accompanies me through my capturing day, and am delighted with the results at the end of the day and in front of the computer. (I learned to use the time-stamping feature to help me navigate around the many files created by the BT+M.)

[Billyzoom]

Two nights ago, Doyle Dykes played a Taylor Guitar clinic not far from my house, at G Guitars in New Haven, CT. I went to see him and brought my trusty BT+Mic.

Here's a two-minute excerpt of his playing, saved as an mp3 and a wave file.

Doyle_Excerpt.mp3 (http://jonchappell.com/hc/Doyle_Excerpt.mp3)

Doyle_Excerpt.wav (http://jonchappell.com/hc/doyle_excerpt.wav)

The mp3 is about 3.2Mb, the wave about 24Mb. Both are in mono. The sound on the mp3 is a little distorted, but I think the sound of the wave file is incredible, seeing how it was just a P.A. system in a store, and not optimal acoustic conditions. But listen to the beginning of the file and then at about the 1:00 mark when he medleys into another tune. That "clicking" is his foot tapping (he's wearing cowboy boots) on a hardwood floor.



Just so I understand, you simply plopped your BT on a table, let it record, and the end result was that awesome sounding WAV? Were you near the PA or monitors of any kind? Where was the BT actually placed?

And btw, a) this Doyle Dykes fellah is phenomenal! and b) Buddy, Line 6 should hire you because your thread has convinced me to buy this gadget.

Thanks a bunch!

r

[Jon Chappell]

Just so I understand, you simply plopped your BT on a table, let it record, and the end result was that awesome sounding WAV? Were you near the PA or monitors of any kind? Where was the BT actually placed?

I was sitting in the front row of the audience with the BT+M on my lap. There was a P.A., though I was so close to the performance area (there was no stage, just a space in front of the folding chairs where Doyle performed) that I was in between the small P.A. speakers. The speakers were small and placed on the floor. It was not the best sound setup I've ever seen, frankly, and I was a little surprised that a store sporting such good gear and exhibiting otherwise high-end taste would be lacking in creating a decent soundstage -- even a small one.

Still, the sound was pretty good for what it was, and Doyle is experienced in showing his best self, regardless of the circumstances.

[Billyzoom]

Thanks for getting back to me. The less than ideal sound set up is a testament to how functional the BT+mic is. I can't believe it was actually sitting in your lap! Thanks for all this info and for posting both WAV & mp3 formats of DD's performance. The BT+ will be my holiday present to myself this year. I’m also going to look into Doyle’s recordings and touring. I’m totally blow away by this guy’s talent.

Again, much obliged, Jon.

[Jon Chappell]

Thanks for getting back to me. The less than ideal sound set up is a testament to how functional the BT+mic is. I can't believe it was actually sitting in your lap! Thanks for all this info and for posting both WAV & mp3 formats of DD's performance. The BT+ will be my holiday present to myself this year. I’m also going to look into Doyle’s recordings and touring. I’m totally blow away by this guy’s talent.

Again, much obliged, Jon.

I'm glad you like Doyle. Here's another wave file (41Mb) from the same night, where he's playing the Taylor T5. He gets such a funky sound out of this -- like Jerry Reed on steroids! You'll hear Doyle do his patented behind-the-nut string bending, too. And again, it's hard to believe it's just a solo guitar. Enjoy!

Tennessee Stomp.wav (http://jonchappell.com/hc/tennessee stomp.wav)

[Joe Vocht]

I have the backtrack (without the mike) and used it with my digitech vocalist 4. The sound was great and the harmonies came through very well as I played it back via the polytone mini-brute II and played my guitar over that, and so...this thing is incredible even without the built in mike!!

[edgedude]

Jon, can you compare the Line 6 BT w/ mic with the Zoom H2 and the Tasman DR-1? I intend to buy one of these for my son for Christmas. He plays mostly electric guitar. He wants to lay down rhythm guitar and play lead against it. Do any of these devices overdub recordings? Thanks!

[Jon Chappell]

Jon, can you compare the Line 6 BT w/ mic with the Zoom H2 and the Tasman DR-1? I intend to buy one of these for my son for Christmas. He plays mostly electric guitar. He wants to lay down rhythm guitar and play lead against it. Do any of these devices overdub recordings? Thanks!

The short answer is that I can't compare them, because I don't have either the H2 or DR-1 in my possession. But on paper those two units are really in another category from the BT+M. They can't really be compared directly fairly. The Zoom and Tascam units are full-featured, stereo recorders with nice interfaces. They're also more expensive ($180 and $285, respectively). The BT+M is an inexpensive (albeit excellent) "capturer."

[Billyzoom]

Okay, I have my Backtrack Plus Mic on order and should have it before Xmas. Now if it turns out that this puppy sucks, I'll be looking you up, Mr. Chapelle!!!

[Jon Chappell]

Okay, I have my Backtrack Plus Mic on order and should have it before Xmas. Now if it turns out that this puppy sucks, I'll be looking you up, Mr. Chapelle!!!

If it "sucks" (for your purposes, anyway), just send it back for a refund. :)

[Billyzoom]

If it "sucks" (for your purposes, anyway), just send it back for a refund. :)

Ha! I'm just messing with you. Actually I've been somewhat looking for a very simple digital recording device for ideas and figured a small digital dictation machine was in the future. In the meanwhile I've been using a cumbersome mp3 player with recording capabilities. This thread has been a tremendous help. My BT+ hasn't come in yet, but I feel confident this is just what I've been looking for. It’s likely I wouldn't have even considered this were it not for your generous info.

So, thanks again, Jon!

Ron (Billyzoom)

[raggedtelecaste]

First, you have done a MARVELOUS job of describing this unit.
I bought the one with the mic. I did not seem to get the setup utility with the unit.
Would it be poss to send it to me and I will make it available for anyone like me that needs it. It is not available on Line 6 site so some of us are out of luck unless we get some help from you.
I appreciate your consideration.
John - Ohio
Email: raggedtelecaster@gmail.com

[Meowy]

If I got the model without the microphone, can I plug a microphone into the 1/4 input, or are the recording levels going to be off?

[Arodnap]

Jon,
So far, I am very interested in the BackTrack but have found no info on the battery. Is it replaceable? All batteries die after a while. I know it's rechargeable via USB. My question is just about whether it can be replaced or not.
Thanks a ton for this review. My wife and I are looking for something to replace our little mini-disc recorder for taking musical notes. How hard have you found it to be to find something particular when not connected to a computer. There is no display on the BT, so how hard is it to find your way?
Thanks,
Joe

[songsterus]

The lead guitarist in our band bought a BT+mic a couple of months ago and we have done several recordings of our gigs with great results. We have a three piece band and everything goes through the mixer. We first tried to use the built in mic and placed the unit in front of a speaker with just ok results. Now we go direct out of our mixer and into the BT. It took a few gigs to adjust the sensitivity correctly and you cannot eat the vocal mics or it tends to distort. If you stay off the mic a bit it's great.

This has been an invaluable tool for listening back to gigs and we are accumulating some very good individual songs that we can use for demo cd's and may eventually create a live cd to sell.

This works for us because we have a three piece band (no drums) and everything goes through the mixer. We have been together for several years so we have our mix down and don't overdrive anything. We run the electric guitars through POD systems, acoustic guitar and vocals go direct. We play a mix of rock, country, blues and Irish and it all works. Our mixer has built in compression on the vocal channels and of course we have compression on the POD's so we can control the peaks - though it's still important not to eat the mic.

Songster

[Anderton]

Jon,
So far, I am very interested in the BackTrack but have found no info on the battery. Is it replaceable? All batteries die after a while. I know it's rechargeable via USB. My question is just about whether it can be replaced or not.

It is not a user-replaceable battery...it's like an iPod, or Microtrack II for that matter. My experience is that these types of batteries last about 3-5 years...however, one other item of interest that I learned while using a Microtrack at the Frankfurt show a couple years back is that some of those cell phone "extra power" boosters will work with audio recorders that are powered by USB. You can get more info here (http://www.harmony-central.com/articles/reviews/maudio_microtrack/).

[Anderton]

First, you have done a MARVELOUS job of describing this unit.
I bought the one with the mic. I did not seem to get the setup utility with the unit.
Would it be poss to send it to me and I will make it available for anyone like me that needs it. It is not available on Line 6 site so some of us are out of luck unless we get some help from you.
I appreciate your consideration.
John - Ohio
Email: raggedtelecaster@gmail.com

The setup utility is built into the unit itself - one of the really genius aspects of the device. As I said in my review in EQ magazine: "Transfer material from either folder to your computer using USB 2.0 (which also charges the non-user replaceable battery) and the software that resides in BackTrack—yes, you can install the software on any connected Windows/Mac."

So no worries - you DID get the setup utility. It's just not WITH the unit, it's WITHIN the unit!

[Anderton]

If I got the model without the microphone, can I plug a microphone into the 1/4 input, or are the recording levels going to be off?

I haven't tested this myself, but I assume that if the mic produces an output that's roughly equivalent to a guitar, you'll be okay. But since you have the unit...why not plug in a mic and let us know what happens?

[Jon Chappell]

Getting the battery replaced seems to be a difficult question for Line 6. I scanned their forums and no one answers the question directly.

Check out the discussion here:

http://line6.com/support/thread.jspa?threadID=49026&tstart=0

But it doesn't really answer the question. At least with an iPod, you can send it back to Apple for a replacement and there's a clear procedure on how to do that. No such similar plan is given here. So I'll follow up and report back.

Incidentally, there's some misinformation about the battery on the L6 site (if you have to go looking there). One poster says that Lithium Ion batteries suffer from the "memory effect." That's not true. The memory effect is a property of NiCad (nickel cadmium) technology.

Stay tuned.

[Arodnap]

It is true that Lithium Ion batteries do not have a memory effect like Ni Cads.
However, they do go bad after a time. The ones in a hand cranked flashlight we had only lasted about 3 years.
So I hope that Line6 has a plan for replacement when the time comes.
Joe

[Jon Chappell]

It is true that Lithium Ion batteries do not have a memory effect like Ni Cads.
However, they do go bad after a time. ... So I hope that Line6 has a plan for replacement when the time comes.

Yes, and of course, you can always have a battery that has "bad chemistry" to begin with, shortening the life span further than its nominal rating. Here's a copy of the note I left on the Line 6 support forum:

I know that the BT's battery is not user-replaceable. But in the event that it should wear out or fail (as all batteries eventually do), how do you get it replaced?

L6 doesn't acknowledge this scenario in the manual or the forums. Other companies that have units with non-user-replaceable batteries (e.g., Apple iPod) give clear instructions on this.

I'd like to know:

1) Where do I send my unit, and how should I prepare the package (e.g., "Attn: BT Battery Service"). Do I need an RA# prior to shipping?
2) What is the cost and typical turnaround for a battery replacement?
3) In the forums, an answer to a question regarding the battery's lifetime says that the battery "should last the lifetime of the unit." A more helpful answer would be given in charge cycles or even years (e.g., "5-7 years with normal, everyday use").

The idea is to make the BT part of your everyday creative life, the way I do my guitar, iPod, and cell phone. Serious musicians (which are the core of L6's audience) could conceivably wear out the battery under these conditions and need to know what to do to replace it and get their BT up and running again.

I did hear back from a product specialist that they received the post and were working on the answer. True, they didn't have an instant answer, but I believe the effort to find a solution is sincere. So stick around, and I'll let you know what they say.

[Anderton]

It may be that in a few years' time, the cost of the battery and the labor required to replace it may be projected to exceed the manufacturing cost of the unit. With my MicroTrack II, M-Audio will replace the internal battery for about $70. Assuming the same type of battery and difficulty of replacement, for the end user it may not be worth replacing the battery from a cost standpoint.

[Jon Chappell]

It may be that in a few years' time, the cost of the battery and the labor required to replace it may be projected to exceed the manufacturing cost of the unit. With my MicroTrack II, M-Audio will replace the internal battery for about $70. Assuming the same type of battery and difficulty of replacement, for the end user it may not be worth replacing the battery from a cost standpoint.

That was my sense too, Craig, and the Line 6 product specialist intimated as much. I could see meeting Line 6 half way on this: they tell me how long the battery will last (they must have some idea), and I understand that I will probably just have to replace the entire unit after that time. For about $100 or $150 (typical prices for the BT and BT+M, respectively), it's still a good deal. It's not like a hard drive that's going to fail with a lot of stuff on it; it's a capture device that you'll be offloading regularly.

I just wish the issue were addressed in some way up front. Having said that, the Line 6 folks have been candid. I'm awaiting permission to quote them, and I'll let everyone know what they say.

[Trojan_Hearse]

I was searching online for information about the BackTrack + Mic and found this review. Thanks a lot for all the details! I have a really good idea of what this tool is all about and I think it would be great for me.

This isn't very important but I was wondering something. Let's say I am messing around with the BackTrack at home with my guitar plugged straight into the BackTrack and I play something just perfectly how I want to play it. Can I take the BackTrack to the studio later and plug the output into an amp and play what I recorded previously into the amp so I can mic it? Would this sound like I had played it through the amp to begin with or is it going to sound bad?

Regardless of the answer I think this item is going to be the perfect scratchpad for me. A lot of times I lose decent ideas just because I was too lazy to set everything up to record or I didn't have any way to record at that moment.

[Jon Chappell]

Here's the response from Line 6's Mike Murphy regarding the battery:

The short answer is that both the battery and the flash memory in BackTrack have an average life expectancy, but neither are replaceable or even serviceable by Line 6. Because the units are relatively low cost, the cost to return, repair, and resend them to an end user does not make it cost effective. At this point, Line 6 does not offer an out of warranty battery replacement program like Apple, although I can discuss that possibility with our service department. With that in mind, we chose batteries and flash memory with a high level of recharges/rewrites as well as optimized the onboard management of these resources by the main processing chip. I’ll dig up our calculations to help the guys post a more complete response next week. Please let me know if you have any other questions or if there’s anything else I can do to help.

[Anderton]

Thanks for following up, Jon. I did not take the flash memory life into account, but Mike's reply makes a lot of sense. I'm sure the battery and the flash memory together account for the vast majority of the BackTrack's price. If you add in shipping, the cost of replacing the parts, labor, and the admin necessary to track the repair (and answer the occasional "Where's the box? UPS says they can't find it" question), the cost probably equals or exceeds that of a new BackTrack.

I would be interested in seeing the life expectancy figures, though. If you get five years, then that works out to $20 a year...not a bad deal. Better than Starbucks coffee, for sure :)

[falmatrix2r]

Hi,
I had a question about BT+Mic. I just got it for my birthday and it’s really good playing acoustic guitar. I’m having issues recording my electric guitar with amp effect. I have a MG100DFX marshall amp and I use the Emulated Line Out but the sound isn’t optimal there. I wondered if you could help me with another configuration maybe. And also I try playing with amp and recording thru mic but result is I can hear very little…the voice comes clear whatever the distance.
Thank you for your help in advance

[Jon Chappell]

I have a MG100DFX marshall amp and I use the Emulated Line Out but the sound isn’t optimal there. I wondered if you could help me with another configuration maybe. And also I try playing with amp and recording thru mic but result is I can hear very little…the voice comes clear whatever the distance.

It sounds like a level-matching problem. The BT is designed to take a guitar signal, not a line level (which is what the emulated line out is), though one of its setups shows going through a POD first. But that doesn't mean it will sound good, only that it's possible.

Try varying the input level settings, which you do using the software utility, and which I describe in post #5 in this forum. Try varying both the guitar's output and the BT's input

[falmatrix2r]

It sounds like a level-matching problem. The BT is designed to take a guitar signal, not a line level (which is what the emulated line out is), though one of its setups shows going through a POD first. But that doesn't mean it will sound good, only that it's possible.

Try varying the input level settings, which you do using the software utility, and which I describe in post #5 in this forum. Try varying both the guitar's output and the BT's input


how can i vary the input level with the software? it only has to do with capture settings
i read you talked about setting level pressing "play" and "-" or "+" on the device is that it?
i tried to pick up amp with MIC but i can barely hear it that way...it does a good job recording acoustic guitar and amp set to clean but having problems with effects from amp

[Jon Chappell]

how can i vary the input level with the software? it only has to do with capture settings
i read you talked about setting level pressing "play" and "-" or "+" on the device is that it?
i tried to pick up amp with MIC but i can barely hear it that way...it does a good job recording acoustic guitar and amp set to clean but having problems with effects from amp

You're right, you can't vary the input level with the utility. I remember now that the input on the BT is wide-ranging, but not optimized for line level signals. This comes up in the early posts, where people are wondering about hooking it up to a mixer, getting a stereo feed, etc. So the answer is, it's not optimized for line level input, though the manual shows the line out of a POD, implying that with some tinkering on the input side -- that would be you feeding it different signal strengths -- you could get something workable.

I don't know why you can't get a good sound from the amp; again, it may be clipping the input stage in a weird way, such that the unit is knocking down the sound to a level it can deal with. If the BT sound okay on your acoustic but not an amp sound, that would be my suspicion. Try it either with a clean electric sound, or with a distorted sound but with the master volume low enough that it's not much louder than your acoustic.

It may be that you need a more sophisticated front end system with regard to level control. When I need that, I use a USB-powered interface (like the Line 6 UX2 or M-Audio Fast Track Pro) that gives effects, level control, and phantom power for a condenser mic, and has output and input levels enough to feed something like the BT. (But at that point, I'd probably just record into my computer.)

I'd stay with the mic input on the BT. Chances are you'll get a better sound with the mic than using the line in. Good luck.

[falmatrix2r]

yes i seen line level ain't that great...i prefer recording with mic but the only thing is that its hard getting something loud playing with amp....i'm pretty sure i don't have clipping problems...it's just that you can barely hear the recording, acoustic has a better volume than electric or distortion on the .wav file
I had a friend today and we recorded some samples bass/guitar...i played around with software and i had slightly better recordings (higher volume) when i had the mic preset set to soft...i think it probably has to do with the gain between 1 and 8...too bad there's not higher than 8 though

[Anderton]

I was recently contracted to do an amp mod on an imported amp which was pretty decent except...well, let's just say the overdrive sounded buzzy and harsh. So I came up with a mod, and gave instructions to the company how to mod the amp. Only problem was they didn't have any amps left to mod, so they asked if I could send some MP3 before-and-after comparisons.

Obviously I needed to make for a fair comparison, so I hooked up a Previs condensor mic (it's a very sweet mic indeed - info at http://www.brandtaudiodevices.com/) because it's a condenser mic with a high end that could reproduce the buzziness (or lack therefore), has really good transient response, and can handle decent SPLs.

This is where BackTrack was invaluable: I recorded several audio examples into BackTrack going through the modded amp, cut a few amp wires in strategic places to "unmod" it, then played back the same audio examples from BackTrack with the same mic, mic placement, etc. All I then needed to do was a little touchup editing in Wavelab, and...mission accomplished!

Yet another reason why I find BackTrack really cool :thu:

[StarGeezers]

Jon , our humble little neighborhood band has been needing to make a CD demo so we can get better gigs... The idea of going into a Studio is both daunting and expensive to us ... After reading about the BT+M , it would seem we could just record the gigs and pick the best songs for a CD... and be a true representation of what the band actually sounds like ... Our old cassette recorder sounded kinda' "thin"... but was easy to use... This device seems even simpler... Do you think it would work well for our needs... ????

I do have Garage Band on my Mac , if that is needed????

PS, we fly RC too ;)

[Jon Chappell]

Jon , our humble little neighborhood band has been needing to make a CD demo so we can get better gigs... The idea of going into a Studio is both daunting and expensive to us ... After reading about the BT+M , it would seem we could just record the gigs and pick the best songs for a CD... and be a true representation of what the band actually sounds like ... Our old cassette recorder sounded kinda' "thin"... but was easy to use... This device seems even simpler... Do you think it would work well for our needs... ???? I do have Garage Band on my Mac , if that is needed???? PS, we fly RC too ;)

Fellow RC flyers, eh? Glow or electric? :)

Certainly the onboard mic (one of the BT's best attributes) will be better than the cassette recorder you used. You can get a decent recording of the whole band this way provided you take extra care in positioning the unit (Think equilateral triangle from the PA speakers, far enough back from the band that the onstage amps don't overbalance the PA). You could even use masking tape to lash the BT to a mic stand placed in the center of the "house" (or listening area).

When you plug the BT into your Mac, you'll be able to offload the files and import them into GB.

Sometime back, a band called the Cowboy Junkies advocated a similar approach, eschewing multiple mics and tracks in favor of a single (or stereo pair) mic that captured the whole band. They may have used a slightly better mic than what the BT has, but the aesthetic is the same. Good luck!

[StarGeezers]

Jon, Thanks !!! Will have to give it a try!!!

Electric Foamies ... http://www.rcgroups.com/foamies-scratchbuilt-428/ AKA gpw

[StarGeezers]

Gentlemen , we've been using the BT+M to record the band live ...The first attempt with the Mic gain set at 2 produced a rather low signal .... Re adjusted to a gain of 4 made the signal a perfect level , but then the BT wouldn't cut off between songs , producing one long song (1G ) per set ... the background noise was enough to keep the BT recording ...
Difficult to deal with a large size file ... going to try importing to GB for editing ... Any Ideas ???

[McPhin]

I know it does'nt run off the mains electricity supply but if it charges through the USB then those IPoD type chargers (travel) seem to work fine with my BT+Mic.

The Question

If you mostly use it connected and 'charging' all of the time then the battery does not go through the cycle as often thus extending the life of the battery.

Correct or incorrect?

I find the BT+Mic pure dead brilliant for practising scales using a G-DEC as the backing. Unfortunately , it does pick up my many tangles and mistakes rather too well! Both items of kit are so simple to use, allowing you to get on with the work.

Regards

McPhin:bor:

[gc24]

I haven't read through all of the posts here about this, but I need to ask this question. Say I want to record a rhythm backing track so I can play lead to it, how much time would I get on the BT+ mic for one song, and also how would I be able to play those tracks back (multiple songs), so I can go from one song to another assuming that I am going out to the output of a Mixer.

[Anderton]

I know it does'nt run off the mains electricity supply but if it charges through the USB then those IPoD type chargers (travel) seem to work fine with my BT+Mic.

The Question

If you mostly use it connected and 'charging' all of the time then the battery does not go through the cycle as often thus extending the life of the battery.

Correct or incorrect?

Incorrect - I believe the battery is a lithium-ion type. Different battery types have different needs. You're thinking of ni-cads, which require periodic deep discharges.

Lithium Ion batteries have a finite number of charge/discharge cycles before they die. If you discharge the battery all the way one night and then re-charge, that would be one cycle. If you discharged the battery by one quarter then re-charged, and did that four days, it would be equivalent to one charge/discharge cycle.

These batteries like to get a little exercise, and don't need to be charged all the time. If you use the BackTrack often, after it's fully charged disconnect the charger. If you use it rarely, disconnect but if it's not used for a few weeks, you may need to "top off" the charge before you use it again.

Hope this helps.

[McPhin]

Anderton

Thank you:idea:

McPhin