most incredible writing experience!

[bulldawgu812]

i was on my bed just reading my bible and spending some time w/ God... i was reading Jeremiah 1, and i was just overcome by it, because of how much it applies to my life right now... i just started praying that God would give me words for a song, all the sudden this song just flowed out of me. i dont need anyone to critique it because i know the words are just how God wanted them. but i was wondering how many other christians have had experiences like this? here are the lyrics if you want to check them out.

O Lord, I long for faithfulness
How I long for knowing you
Show me your guidance
Let your love shine through verse
Touch my mouth
Give me these words
Watch over me
To see that I fulfill your word

Make me a prophet in this world
Cuz its time for God in this land chorus
Make me a prophet of your word
For this is your command

I can’t deny it
Can’t hide it
This is what you told me to do
bridge
I can’t deny it
Can’t hide it
I will follow through

[bulldawgu812]

disregard the bridge, chorus, verse labels... those arent supposed to be there

[SatanizmyMotor7]

well i am not a believer by any stance. i guess thats why my sn is Satan. i was raised catholic and i guess thats what i am or was told to believe. i don't believe that alone, one person (or spritual being) could have put this world together. just like we can't live our lives alone, we need someone to help put together the peices. So yea and no i dont believe in god becuz i used to feel that whenever i prayed, no one answered so i stopped going to church and shut out the idea. but i have now found that everything happens for a reason. fate is what i believe in. sometimes i get this feeling that everything is planned out for me. like this is were i belong. i dont know if i am making any sense but, i have gotten urges to write songs about why i think things happen. i hope i answered your question. if i didn't oh well at least i know where i am at.


caits

[Lexanderole]

Believe in yourself

[bulldawgu812]

why do people think they are born into a religion? i would go check out a baptist church or something, just to check it out. i live in texas so we are real non-traditional. i would at least go see what its about.

[SatanizmyMotor7]

well i think most people dont want to disapoint there family. therefore they try to make it work for themselves.


caits

[ebowist]

Sorry to be blunt, but catholisicim has strayed far from the truth, bogged down in ritual and circumstance. Priests have no power over your soul, they can not pardon your for your sins. Their whole idea of saints is twisted, there is only one mediator between God and man, thats Jesus. Check out a bible or baptist church, you will find that their method of worship is much different, much more spiritual and emphasizes on the closeness of God, and his love.

[Jeremy Ian]

Why do you ask " how many other christians have had experiences like this"? Can people of other religion not get moved by or understand lyrics containing the word "GOD" in them? This is why religion is f**ked up - stubborn bastards like yourself think that what you believe in is the only way to live life and if someone doesn't believe in every word the Bible says then they can't be as good of a person as you and can't understand life as well as you. Basically, what I'm trying to say is you're an ass-hole and your song sucks.

P.S. I am a Christian, just like you, and feel that our religion is the biggest load of shit in the world.

[Knuuckles]

Jeremy- dude, he just posted his song. I would guess why he said "any other Christians" is because, I dunno, he was reading the fucking BIBLE when he wrote it. And, if you honestly believe its a load of crap (which I'm not saying you do or you dont) then your not a Christian. Going to church every day of the week wont make you a Christian without believing in god.

But no, I'm not a Christian...I simply believe in god, or supernatural powers. I dont believe that we can truly understand anything complex or powerful enough to create the universe, so I dont read the bible, the torah, go to church, anything...I tried, but I dont anymore.

But its a nice song.

[bulldawgu812]

im not saying im any better then anyone... i mess up just like people who aren't christians, however i strive to be better and live like Jesus did. you know what being a chistian is? i think the problem w/ christianity, is that people think its a "religion" and that you have to follow certain guidelines to get to live forever... religion is nothing, its just about u and God... you put ur faith in God and try to live like his son did.. thats it, u dont have to go to church, you don't have to do anything like that... but church does help and encourage you. christianity wouldn't get so much crap if people didnt say they were christians, and not even know what it means. please don't say your a christian if you don't know what it means, or you just believe some of it.. you either are a christian and believe it, or your not..

[GrungyOtter]

why would ANYONE want to live like jesus did?
i mean, that guy never played guitar, never had any fun, and im almost sure he never went out with any chicks, oh and he died when he was 32(33?)!!
i mean, i know it sounds really stupid and ignorant, but who would want to live like that?

[bulldawgu812]

when I say live like Jesus did, i'm not saying live the exact things he went through... but he had no faults, he was perfect. thats what i strive for. and im sure if there were guitars then, Jesus would play them!lol

[moorst]

Hey GrungyOtter. I know you think that's what God was like on earth but read the Bible! Jesus was continually going to party's and hanging out with all kinds of what we would consider dirty women! Sin was as distasteful to Him as eating a fresh dog crap would be to you. But He didn't have to eat sin to clean it up. Come on! Who killed Jesus? It was the Priests and parasees! It was the people who were living perfect little lives and ignoring God while doing it. So when Jesus came it partying and hanging out with sluts that offended their "moral concience" so they killed Him! YOU DON'T KILL A GUY YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH!

[moorst]

bulldawgu812, I agree with you, Jesus probably would have made a pretty mean guitarist. And don't think I'm saying it's not good to try and act like Jesus, but well... you never will. None of us will. None of us can. That's what grace is all about. We will be doomed to a cycle of sin untill Jesus comes back and raises us all to life to be with Him. Sin is more than actions, it's more than Satan. Satan didn't even know what he was getting into when he was messing with it. It has substance. It's like tar, and as long as we are stuck in mortal sin saturated bodies WE WILL SIN. That's why when Paul was struggling with his sinful addiction, his "thorn in his flesh" and wanted God to take it away, God told him "My grace is sufficient." I'm just saying, don't spend your life persuing Jesus's actions, or his faultless state because you can't achieve it and when you realize that you are in danger of losing faith. Spend your time persuing Jesus Himself. The better life here on earth is just a perk of chasing Christ. Persuing TRUE EVERLASTING LOVE (Which is an exact synonym for God) is what being a Christian is all about.

OKAY!!!! ENOUGH THEOLOGY! I'm on vacation and I get plenty of that in my major! ON TO THE FUN STUFF.

Like the song. And yes I have had a similar experience. One night I came back to the dorm and found out that my Greek tutor's friend from when he was a student missionary was dieing and very near her well "sleep" is I guess how Jesus would describe it. She was in a hospital in Maine and we all go to school in Washington. (The state not the city) When my greek tutor learned that she was almost gone he just jumped in his car with two other friends from Phonpei (where they were missionaries together). They then proceeded to drive to Maine to try to say goodbye. That struck me as so awesome that he would be so comitted to his friend. The next morning I just picked up my guitar and wrote a song for him as if I were copying it from a book. That day I went to my computer and recorded it, then my boss (the college chaplain) overnighted it to her funeral. It was waiting for him when he got there and they played it at the service. I've never felt so humbled. No feeling like it.

Just the night

Well I got the news last night
That you'll be leaving soon
and I'm coming just as quickly as I can
When you're far away and struggling
I'm wanting to be with you
And the pain is far too much for me to stand

So please don't go to sleep untill I get there
I have something I have got to say
I want to tell you just how much I'll miss you
So please hold on no don't you go away

(Chorus)
Cause I love you
And the tears are coming harder now
A well from deep inside
It's so true
The confusion's growing larger now
The further that I drive
And my God
Please tell her that she's not alone
That you are by her side
So when she's caught
Won't you be there with her
Hold her hand
And tell her it's alright...
It's just the night

I am looking at the sunrise
Coming cross the rolling plains
To some this scene is hardly worth a dime
But if they were in your shoes
If they knew they'd soon be leaving
They'd give everything to see it one more time

If you're about reach your're destination
Then don't you worry I'll be coming too
The next thing that we'll see is our salvation
And the grace of God will finally pull us through

(chorus)
I have heard that death is just a sleep
for those who trust the name
It's a comfort my heart chooses to ignore
And I have heard about the people killed
in distant war torn lands
But now it's knocking on my friendships door

With the answers few and all my questions many
I am standing here and trying not to cry
And here I know I'll never know the reasons
But someday they'll be written in the sky...

(chorus)

Sorry this is so long. I'm just use to writing essays. God Bless. :)

[the anti stick]

You're all wrong. God is a myth, and so is Jesus. The Bible is fiction, and when I hear/read people talking about any of these things as though they were true and factual, it makes me wonder: What's wrong with your brains??? It's not so bad when someone is ignorant as a result of simply following what they were brought up to believe, but I find it especially distasteful when people purposely choose those delusions to help them cope with their lives.

No offence :p

[bulldawgu812]

your basing that off what?

[moorst]

I try to let people have their oppinions "the anti stick" and I try to make my post's about song writing (Mostly) But what can I say YOU ASKED FOR IT. READ IT IF YOU WANT TO LEARN SOME OTHER PEOPLES POINTS OF VIEW!

Okay, let's say the Bible is fiction. God is a myth. Where do you think we all came from then? It's very uneducated and shallow to go throughout your lives without thinking about anything deeper than your own twisted messed up relationships. It's also very uneducated to go throughout life without a theory of where it all came from and how we got here. You really have very few options. It's either you believe in some supernatural force (I don't care what that force is, it's still all about some kind of god or god force) Or you can go off the theory of evolution, which is really a scientific impossibility. I don't have to tell you why either. I'm sure you know what the theory of evolution "About 250 billion years ago all of the matter of the universe compressed to the size of a dot no bigger than the period at the end of this sentence. This matter spun and broke apart the matter decompressed and became all of the elements we now know of." Okay genius, answer this... A black hole has an incredible amount of mass in a very small space. Much like "All the matter in the Universe" was 250 billion years ago. Here's the thing, NOTHING ESCAPES FROM A BLACK HOLE! NOT EVEN LIGHT! So how is anything going to break off and escape from a dot the same size as a black hole but with infinately more mass? Or even better, where do you think the speck of infinate matter came from? Wait let me guess, "It has always been here" So I believe in the beginning God, and you believe in the beginning infinitely dence speck of dirt. I don't have to explain where God came from cause I believe He is infinite, therefore I don't claim that nothing is inexplainable. Evolution is a human attempt to explain everything and in doing so they came up with an explaination that was the more stupid than the explaination they had in the beginning. There are more reasons why the "Big Bang" is an impossibility. Like the first law of thermodynamics which states that everything moves toward decay as time passes. EVERYTHING! A world with creatures is much more complex than an infinatly dence dot. (Unless you're an evolutionist, then I guess that the dence dot is more complex.) The idea of an organism evolving from a rock or even a bowl of muddy water is stupid! Okay everyone let's watch the bowl of mud and maybe something living will suddenly appear! That's what we in the real world call a fairy tale. Magic, wow, what are you living in the stone age? Get with it! Nothing that has design has ever been designed with out a designer! Name something that has if you think I'm wrong. The only thing we know was here before we were was nature. So it only stands to reason that something designed nature. Or maybe if we all sat around long enough a space shuttle will just happen to come together from a bunch of atoms because we waited for 250 billion years for it to. I'M NOT A CHRISTIAN BECAUSE I WAS BROUGHT UP THIS WAY. I'M A CHRISTIAN BECAUSE I DID MY HOMEWORK AND STUDIED ALL THE OTHER POINTS OF VIEW, ALL THE REST OF THE POINTS OF VIEW DON'T MAKE SENCE WHEN COMPARED WITH ALL OF THE SCIENCE WE REALLY KNOW, NOT MAKE UP! SO WHO'S MORE STUPID? YOU CAN JUST GO AND BELIEVE IN YOUR SPINNING DIRT THEORY AND I'LL JUST BELIEVE IN MY "MYTH" AS YOU CALL IT BUT DON'T SAY THERE ARE THINGS WRONG WITH MY BRAIN WHEN YOU BELIEVE IN SOMEING SO INFINATELY STUPID! ACTUALLY TRY STUDYING FOR YOUSELF SOMETIME AND GO OFF SOMETHING THAT MAKES SENCE NOT SOMETHING YOU WERE "BROUGHT UP TO BELIEVE!"

"No offence" :)

[moorst]

I owe you an apology "the anti stick", I didn't act like I should of and I'm sorry I dumped on your statement. I believe God is still working on me and someday maybe I'll shut my mouth before I let Him down. You have your oppinion I have mine and neither of us are going to move so... Yeah, I'm sorry I went off on you. Hope you can accept.

[SatanizmyMotor7]

ok then what do you believe in ??............. sticks ?



caits

no offense:D

[SatanizmyMotor7]

ok that was a joke if you thought i was trying to be mean........ lame attempt to be funny in a serious subject


sorry

caits

[bulldawgu812]

u did ur research moorst.. thanks man, i will try to research some of that. i didnt mean for this to turn into people trying to justify their beliefs, so lets quit that... o and moorst, can u recommend any books that i can read about evolution and why it can't be true... i have a friend that i think would like to read one.

[moorst]

There are many, but the thing I found most of the information compiled into nice neat packages (Otherwise you'd have to read ton's of material, and most of it is quite complicated Christian Opollogetics stuff.) http://www.drdino.com/ they have videos and lot's of other books. But realize this, there are scientific refutals to everyone of our arguments. There is stuff blasting us all over the place. But there will be scientific refutals to the scientific refutals. If you let your faith hinge on science like many Christians would like to do, than you're going to get let down then get drug up and then let down, a constant roller coaster. Because God never gave us proof of His making this place. Faith is absent in the lack of all doubt. If something is an absolute fact, than why do you need faith? The point is "Faith is the evidence of things unseen." The biggest argument against evolution in your own life is just this... what draws our hearts to believe that there is something bigger? I don't really have "major" problems in my life. I think I'm very lucky. It would be very easy for me to claim all of the credit and say "I can do it on my own with out any God" but there's something that goes beyond what I was just brought up to believe. There's something in (most) all of us that loves it when the good and fair side wins in movies. Hey, geniouses like J. R. R. Tolkien who created his own language for his book series, and C.S. Lewis who has written tons of books on philosophy, they believed in God. Even Albert Einstien believed in God. There are men who will be flexing their brains at eachother for as long as this world is here. But hey, if we're wrong we have much less to worry about than if they're wrong. Creationist scientist's are very outspoken in many respects. But they do bring some evidence for the Bible. I've heard stuff from both sides and I've made what I think is a intellegent decision. Let sticks and all the others think they're right. I like your faith, bulldawgu812. Let's get back to writing about what we believe in and they can go write about what they believe in. Love, God, Others, these sum up the law and the prophets. Peace bro. (or sis) or what ever.

P.S. Hey bulldawgu812, you never told me what you thought of my song!

[moorst]

A song I wrote a while back bulldawgu812

Have you ever stopped to look at the stars
and wondered if we are alone
wondered if our God is far and have you
ever seen some people live and others die
and have you ever asked the questions
Where the ultimate is why

(Pre Chorus)
There are some who think they have the answers
At least they act as if they do
And I'm not quite that brave
To make those wild crazy claims
But God here's something you could do

(Chorus)
Could you please answer me only these questions
Where are we going? and how do we know?
When the world is coming up with wild suggestions
Of where we all came from and where we will go
Like the apes in the trees and I'm down on my knees
Hello

Human kind has been researching so long
and digging up their old remains
seeing what their bones contain that I've
Come to think that the answer's not here
That it's not in our universe
That it cures a sinful curse and I think

There's a time when we have to stand back
a time to know there's a limit
there's a knowledge we lack and we're
Not so smart there's so much that we don't get
And there are things in this world
That we haven't found yet

[moorst]

tell me what you think

[rickenvox]

Originally posted by the anti stick
You're all wrong. God is a myth, and so is Jesus. The Bible is fiction, and when I hear/read people talking about any of these things as though they were true and factual, it makes me wonder: What's wrong with your brains??? It's not so bad when someone is ignorant as a result of simply following what they were brought up to believe, but I find it especially distasteful when people purposely choose those delusions to help them cope with their lives.

No offence :p

You should do a little homework before proclaiming everyone is "wrong". They are, but so are you. Jesus certainly existed, it's just that the only information about him that we have today was written well after his lifetime and the first century AD - and those writings have blended myth with probable events surrounding his life. The snippets of writings that the "gospels" are based on do not exist anymore - the Q document. The funny thing is that there were a bunch of people running around in those days doing the exact same things - miracle workers, casting out demons, etc. It was like a profession back then. The early church destroyed most of the information of some of those people who also had large followings - like Apollonius (some of the writings about him have survived and have been published).

What catapulted Jesus to international fame and divinity was the attachment of the Roman world to that little cult of Christianity. Constantine making it an approved religion in Rome and the Holy Roman Church to follow is the major reason all of you white people with euro-pagan ancestors think that you're going to hell if you don't get covered by the blood sacrifice (think about that! - it's roots are in animal sacrifice, which was a late Hebrew replacement for human sacrifice - Abraham and Isaac!).

As far as God being a myth - it's unprovable by definition. But the growth of monotheism does parallel the same time that human beings developed major civilizations and worshipped and obeyed "single" ruling monarchs. Before Egypt and Mesopotamia, religions were mostly polytheistic. The rise of a single ruler over a nation was the pattern for the belief in a single god. Even OT scriptures reflect the belief in the god of the tribe, and other gods for other tribes. The contest between Elijah and "his" god against the "other" gods is a prime example. Without reading modern bible interpretations that are intended to prove the bible always had the same message - the story is clear. It wasn't until the later prophets of the OT that the concept of the hebrew god being the only God came about. And that was due to the influence of Egypt and Babylonian religions. The Hebrews didn't have a concept of hell until their captivity in Bablylon - whose religion had a hell that predates the Hebrews.
So in the sense that you can trace the duplication of stories (creation myth and flood stories) through many different cultures and religions (most of whom are much older than the Old Testament writings) - then you could make the case for that concept of God being a myth. But that doesn't rule out the existence of a spiritual being or beings that have an influence on our world. It's funny that the notion of such an existence has stuck around with no physical support with such persistence.

P.S. - Jeremiah ate his own shit.

[bink_02]

I personally am a devout Christian and Catholic. In response to an earlier statement, mayn Catholics HAVE perverted the religion, but a lot of Catholics HAVEN'T. I happen to be one of those. I believe that only God can absolve sins and that Jesus is His mediator - I go to confession more for counseling and to get things off my mind - it really does help.

As for the guy who said that he's all mad that we belieev Christion living is the only way and we're close minded or whatever... first of all you can't be a Christian because you think Christianity is a piece of crap. Second, the thread starter wanted to know if others had had previous experiences - he was reading the Bible so that narrows it down to Christians and Mormons (tho less possible for Mormons).

To Moorst:
You are absolutely correct about Jesus, you DON'T kill people you're comforatable with. Word... Jesus was killed by religious people protecting their turf. But oh, isn't it good that they did? Salvation is a pretty awesome thing.

So anyways, to the original posting, great song, I'd like to hear it to music.

Ahh yes, and in reference to the Catholic thing - its just that people got too religious and not enough spiritual. It happenes everywhere, Baptists, Methodists, Church of Christ, Islam, Mormons... - the uber-religious give religions a bad name. Follw and love God - then you'll be alright...

[rickenvox]

now let's talk about politics! :D

[bulldawgu812]

moorst, i love both of the songs... ur very talented. i was wondering if you are into worship music and stuff? i lead worship for our youth group on sundays and wednesdays... its kinda weird being in 9th grade and leading people who are older then me into worship... but its one incredible experience.

[the anti stick]

Where do you think we all came from then?
Monkeys

It's very uneducated and shallow to go throughout your lives without thinking about anything deeper than your own twisted messed up relationships.
Completely agreed, although "uneducated" is not used correctly here. It's more being close-minded or naive. Being uneducated would be the result of not educating oneself in those matters.

It's either you believe in some supernatural force ... Or you can go off the theory of evolution, which is really a scientific impossibility. I don't have to tell you why either.
Those are just 2 possible choices for how life came to be on this planet, not necessarily the origin of the universe. One could, for example, believe completely in the theory of evolution, and also believe that the universe was set in motion by some divine being. I am interested to know why you consider evolution to be a scientific impossibility.


Okay genius, answer this... A black hole has an incredible amount of mass in a very small space. Much like "All the matter in the Universe" was 250 billion years ago. Here's the thing, NOTHING ESCAPES FROM A BLACK HOLE! NOT EVEN LIGHT!
Black holes do in fact radiate energy ("Einstein Radiation" I believe it is called).

So how is anything going to break off and escape from a dot the same size as a black hole but with infinately more mass?
I don't think all the properties of black holes are currently understood. Despite that, the main issue is that it was the universe itself that was compressed to a quantum dot, and not just all the matter in the universe, which are quite different situations. I suppose the difference could be related to the difference between looking at a black hole from our relatively undistorted space-time, and observing from withing the black hole (an extremely distorted space-time). I personally don't know the properties of space-time in a highly compressed state when it is collapsed in on itself to the point of a being a singularity. Unless I'm mistaken, nobody does.


Or even better, where do you think the speck of infinate matter came from? Wait let me guess, "It has always been here" So I believe in the beginning God, and you believe in the beginning infinitely dence speck of dirt. I don't have to explain where God came from cause I believe He is infinite, therefore I don't claim that nothing is inexplainable.
This is where I feel that "God" is the cop-out answer. Don't understand it, so some magical being must have done it! I would say that for one, the state of existence cannot be determined before the "Big Bang", as any information from beforehand would be lost in the singularity. Our existence itself is inside this universe, and therefore it makes no sense to remove ourselves from our existence to look at our universe, as there would be nothing for us to exist in outside of it: existence as we understand it is inside that universe.


Evolution is a human attempt to explain everything and in doing so they came up with an explaination that was the more stupid than the explaination they had in the beginning.
God is a human attempt to explain everything that is not understood. As science advanced throughout the ages, less and less has been granted as being "God's doing". I'd say God is really running out of things he can reasonably be held accountable for!

Like the first law of thermodynamics which states that everything moves toward decay as time passes.
Thermodynamics is concerned with the movement of energy ("heat", in the scientific use of the word).

First Law of Thermodynamics: Conservation of Energy
Second Law of Thermodynamics: Entropy
Third Law of Thermodynamics: Absolute Zero

It sounds like you're actually talking about the second law here. For any spontaneous (no energy added to the system) process, entropy (disorder) increases. You apparently don't understand the concept of entropy. A single point is absolutely simple (it only has one possible state), and the explosion was a definite increase in entropy. Granted, life is a more ordered state than not having it, but life on Earth is on a very small time scale with respect to the universe, and in support of the entropy argument, the natural process for life is to die. If no energy is added to keep a body alive, it dies.

Nothing that has design has ever been designed with out a designer! Name something that has if you think I'm wrong.
In line with this discussion, I will give the universe as an example, but that won't do with others attributing it to God. How about our solar system? Or our sun? These were both assembled based on the nature of gravitational forces between the matter from which they are constituted.

Or maybe if we all sat around long enough a space shuttle will just happen to come together from a bunch of atoms because we waited for 250 billion years for it to.
The probability of that occuring are infinitessimally small, based again on entropy arguments. I'd estimate it has a similar chance of occuring as you suddenly appearing on the other side of a wall due to all of the particles that make up your body quantum tunelling through the wall and ariving in the precise arrangement they staring out with.

You believe in gravity? You believe that electrons respond to an applied electric field? You believe that the planets in our system orbit the sun? You believe that particles are merely probability distribution functions? You believe that all the galaxies are accelerating outwards from a central location? You believe there was a "Big Bang"? I'll assume that you would answer "yes" to the first question. Now, at some point along the increasing complexity of science, you (and everyone) reaches a point where they don't understand enough to follow up their "yes" answer with a reason based on knowledge or understanding of physical laws, and then that is when they turn to other sources for their answers. Some choose at some point that they don't care to know any more "science" and attribute everything beyond to "God", while others reach an actual point where they cannot grasp the more abstract concepts required to understand certain phenomena, and give their god the credit for those things. And of course there are many more than those 2 ways for dealing with those things...

No, I was not offended by any of your replies, and just to be clear, any time I use "you" (when it's not a direct reply to the quoted part I guess), it is merely inteded towards whoever the reader currently is, not anyone in particluar (despite having quoted one response). I mean no one any personal offence... general offence is fine by me :D

And thank you rickenvox for the post. I am aware that there may indeed have existed the character referred to as "Jesus", but I doubt very greatly any actual "miracles" being performed by him. I do believe folk were a tad more superstitious in those times than they are today. I would have to do more reading into some reliable historical accounts of those times. Preferably one that does not use as its main argument "because the Bible says so".

[rickenvox]

Originally posted by the anti stick
[BAnd thank you rickenvox for the post. I am aware that there may indeed have existed the character referred to as "Jesus", but I doubt very greatly any actual "miracles" being performed by him. I do believe folk were a tad more superstitious in those times than they are today. I would have to do more reading into some reliable historical accounts of those times. Preferably one that does not use as its main argument "because the Bible says so". [/B]

I actually disguised my post as a retort to yours so that it might get read. I wouldn't imagine the frequency of miracles has changed from 2000 years ago to today. Personally I haven't seen any that defy physical laws. I have had moments of inspiration and possibly psychic syncronicity with loved ones, but that's it. Definitely more people have seen ghosts than have seen god. My wife's family are Vietnamese buddhist/catholics and have pictures of their departed loved ones on their household altars. That seems nice to me.

[moorst]

To anyone out there who WASN'T listening. As I said, there are scientific rebuttals to every one of the arguments I MENTIONED. And I've heard all of the counter arguments YOU'VE mentioned AND a whole lot more. THEN I've heard more rebutals from the creationist side. THEN I've heard more rebutals from evolutionist side. AND back AND forth. But guess what I DON'T CARE! I DO NOT BASE MY BELIEF ON THE LATEST SCIENTIFIC DATA! MY FAITH WOULD BE A YO YO IF I DID THAT BECAUSE NO ONE WILL EVER CONVINCE THE OTHER SIDE SO THE ARGUMENTS WILL KEEP GOING BACK AND FORTH untill (The sun engulfs the earth when it becomes a dwarf star in your belief.) (Or untill Jesus comes in my belief.) The only thing the arguments do for me is make me realize that there is evidence for both. So I keep believing in my belief and I'll let you keep believing in yours. That's what the constitution is all about. People having the right to believe what ever they want to. And since I can't spend my whole life glued to this forum chain, and feel I've said all I need to say. I'm going to go to other chains and keep learning new techniques for writing songs and sharing techniqes for writing songs. And as C.S. Lewis wrote (loosly paraphrased) "Say that there is no heaven and no second coming and no Jesus and not even God Himself. And say we've made this whole thing up over thousands of years. If this is true than it seems like the made up things are a good deal better than the real things. I'm going out to find my myths and I'm going to keep living like a Christian even though there might not even be a Christ. And if your explaination for a world is just that it's just the product of a cosmic burp billions of years ago, than it's a pretty poor excuse for a world." Go ahead and call me ignorant. The thing is that you let my beliefs bother you, this means that you feel threatened by them and are afraid of them. If you really believed that there is no God, then you wouldn't even bother arguing with us because it doesn't matter what anyone believes there is no God anyway. The reason that I argue with you is that I DO feel threatened, not by your beliefs. By your attitude of "I just have to wonder what's wrong with their brains." That's what Hitler's very premise was based on. It's your kind that try to force your beliefs on others just like Christians did to the Muslims in the Crusades and just like comunism did to their countries. I say I'm a true Christian, I'm not afraid to say that. I'm also not afraid to say that anywhere where Christianity has forced people to believe as a Christian or die, it wasn't real Christianity. True Christianity is really about freedom to choose, to accept God deny God or even to deny He exists. So hey, if you really believe what you believe, than you don't even need to argue it. I do, because if we don't argue for it, people like you some day down the down in the bowels of time will lock people like me in insane asylums claiming that we're all nuts. Plus you'd have had to lock up Einstine, Newton, Aristotle, all the Muslims, all the Hindu's all the Budhists anyone who's ever believed that they're not the top of the chain. Then you'll not have any basis for moral laws and you'll just blast the world to a pulp with nukes because HEY IT WOULDN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE IN YOUR REASONING. So I'm leaving now to study what I came here to study. Lyrics! And I'm going to share my lyrics about God because I want people to critique my style of song writing NOT MY BELIEFS.


(To my friend who asked about worship leading. You can start another string, brand new and all those God doesn't apply to don't have to show up to it. I'll give you any advice I can. But my time is to important going round and round in circles at this string.)

[rickenvox]

Originally posted by moorst
To anyone out there who WASN'T listening . . .

so stop replying. wwjd - not waste all day on the internet probably. I don't believe so wasting time is not a problem.;) :D

[bink_02]

i ask some of the Christians in here to please help defend our position in the "Lets do away with al things Christian..." thread in the open jam forum... :D

[the anti stick]

Originally posted by moorst
The thing is that you let my beliefs bother you, this means that you feel threatened by them and are afraid of them

Not really. I just react in a similar fashion as if someone were saying they were hardcore racist or practiced a religion that was more generally accepted as being out-to-lunch than, say, christianity (current alien cloning group comes to mind, although you could replace "alien" with "god" and "clone" with "make out of mud" and you'd have pretty much the same story). I simply wonder how and why anyone could believe things that make no reasonable degree of sense. And I also hope that something clicks for those people I feel sorry for, and they realize some things on the nature of existence.

And just because one doesn't buy into mystical happenings and their assosiated religions, it does not imply that they will also be devoid of moral sense of right and wrong and for fair and equitable treatment of their environment (annimate or otherwise, sentent or not). It's sort of sad that some people feel that they need some book to tell them they shouldn't steal, or kill others, or that it's ok to impregnate your own mother then marry your sister/daughter (I just found out about *this* implication... of course I hope most would know it's not ok to do this even after reading their bible).

I would probably draw the line between sanity and admitting someone to a mental health facility at when they are not able to understand their "creator" to be a figurative, or make-believe creation, much like elves and vampires and magic. In other words, when they no longer see the difference between fantasy and reality.

BTW, I, on the other hand, have plenty of time to waste :D

[bulldawgu812]

you can say all you want, nothing will ever change my mind.. everyday i see God working in the world... if you could only spend a day in my shoes you would run towards God and never look back.

[Jordan]

Honestly, i know I'm new to this topic, but it's going to lead to nowhere.

No views or opinions will be altered by "posting" your beliefs and reasons on a chat board. Moorst the effort is appreciated, and i know you are truly sincere in your beliefs as well as the others on this board.

The truth is the arguments only lead to other arguments.

[moorst]

Yip, that's about the size of it.

[HoHum]

Originally posted by the anti stick
You're all wrong. God is a myth, and so is Jesus. The Bible is fiction, and when I hear/read people talking about any of these things as though they were true and factual, it makes me wonder: What's wrong with your brains??? It's not so bad when someone is ignorant as a result of simply following what they were brought up to believe, but I find it especially distasteful when people purposely choose those delusions to help them cope with their lives.

No offence :p

I always find it very funny when those who don't believe in God say things like.. it's all a myth" and "What's wrong with your brain?" and go on and on.

Two Questions: What do you know the rest of us don't? and where did you gain this incredible information?

Unless you know exactly how we all got here, and how and why the universe is expanding, and what happened when it stops, and what's out their in space a gazillion miles away, and about ten million other answers to lifes questions then you only sound dumb by saying things like .. "It's all a myth"

I don't know the answers but, I used to think like you until I realized unless I can back my beliefs up with some kind of proof then who am I to think I know more about life then the other 6 billion people in the world.

[ebowist]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by the anti stick
[B]Where do you think we all came from then?
Monkeys

you think we came from monkeys? Im sorry friend, but no modern scientist, even evolutionist agree with that, in fact most of what darwin taught is no longer believed by evolutionists.

[st. michael]

Wasn't this thread about songwriting? Just asking, is all......

[moorst]

Yeah, I believe it was about song writing.