Mackie Hotwire VT12: Most "under the radar" gear at NAMM???

[Controverse]

C'mon people, this amp was the most hyped piece of gear pre-NAMM, and got absolutely NO PRESS. Did it suck that much? Were there any demos at all?

Need info, FEED ME pleeeeze. Craig Anderton, did you see it? Opinions? Bueller?

all kidding aside, thanks for any input!

[Trextomb]

http://news.harmony-central.com/Newp/2008/Mackie-Hotwire-VT12-Guitar-Amp.html

that has facts/pics...but no demoes yet..the price seems rediculous.

[MikeRivers]

C'mon people, this amp was the most hyped piece of gear pre-NAMM, and got absolutely NO PRESS. Did it suck that much? Were there any demos at all?It's Mackie, so hype was expected, though frankly I didn't see much hype, though I didn't spend too much time around that side of the Mackie booth, and they didn't have any famous guitar players coming in to play it for an audience.

I predict that if it catches on at all, it will be more popular among session musicians and arrangers who need to have a wide range of tone coming from a real speaker available to them on demand. But even the Line 6 Variax didn't really put the cartage companies out of business, so I don't expect that the Hotwire amplifier will either. The few licks I heard through it at the press conference sounded nice and clean, but not being a real electric guitar player, I couldn't appreciate any subtlety that might have been demonstrated there (though I doubt that it was).

I actually thought that the Blackheart story was a little more interesting. This is a new company for Loud, combining an old and simple tube design that's been around as a "boutique" amplifier for years and applying the manufacturing engineering and marketing that went into Crate amplifiers (which Loud has owned for a few years) to bring the price of a simple tube amplifier in line with what the parts really cost rather than making it something exotic. It's a good foray into honest engineering and marketing, something that we don't see a lot any more.

[zekmoe]

Maybe the underlying technology is new, but the amp presents itself as just another Line6/ValveTronix modeler. Been there, done that, relegated to the office practice amp. I'd be interested if they felt real and responded like my tube amp, but I won't be first in line this time.

[Electric I]

At first glance it seems to have all the right features, but at $1499 street...well ...good luck with that.

There's a post or two at the gear page that don't exactly rave about it...

[Duardo]

I don't think that the price seems out of line at all...we're talking about a real tube amp here..not another digital modeling amp, but one that switches different analog components in and out of the circuit to recreate different sounds . As I understand it, the only thing digital in the amp are the effects, controls, and the USB output...but the main signal path is all analog...

[Controverse]

Agree, Duardo. It can also work as an acoustic amp, or grab-and-go vocal PA, so to me, 1500 dollars is not an obscene price point -provided it delivers the goods.

[larryguitar]

I don't think that the price seems out of line at all...we're talking about a real tube amp here..not another digital modeling amp, but one that switches different analog components in and out of the circuit to recreate different sounds . As I understand it, the only thing digital in the amp are the effects, controls, and the USB output...but the main signal path is all analog...

Of course, a Peavey Bandit is 'all analog', as well. We're talking a solid state amp with some preamp tubes, AFAIK.

[MikeRivers]

I don't think that the price seems out of line at all...we're talking about a real tube amp here..not another digital modeling amp, but one that switches different analog components in and out of the circuit to recreate different sounds . It's half of a tube amplifier, the inexpensive half, made more expensive because of the digitally controlled switching. To my understanding, the front end, with exception of the effects, isn't modeling anything, it's using different circuit topologies for different flavors of distortion and different tone control characteristics.

The expensive part of a tube amplifier, because of the high power, and hence large power supply, is the output section. In the Hotwire, that's a FET amplifier, most likely using the classic circuit that behaves like a pentode. I suspect that the light weight is a result of using a switching power supply for the relatively low voltage but high current output stage rather than a large power transformer that's necessary to get the typically 450 volts at a couple of hundred watts for a tube outputs stage.

At the AES show, Line 6 was showing sort of the opposite design concept - a real live tube power output section with a modeling front end.

As far as the $1500 price tag (maybe $1000 in stores?) that doesn't sound out of line to me if it's really a good and useful amplifier, particularly for studio use where versatility with good sound is worth more than high volume. Didn't a Fender Twin cost about $600 back 30 years ago? Are guitar amplifiers falling into the same slag heap as recording equipment, where people expect them to be cheap so there are a lot of cheap ones, which establishes a much lower entry level price? More Music for More People - BAH HUMBUG! ;)

[Dylan Walters]

I'm seriously considering buying this amp as soon as it hits the street. I'd kill for some sound clips or hands-on reviews! The price tag of $1500 doesn't seem unreasonable condsidering the features, IMO.

[k2m]

I've been lurking around for a while and just saw this thread...you guys may be interested in this video of the pricey mackie hotwire:

http://www.delamar.de/musikmesse-2008-mackie-vt12-hotwire-video/

[Scott Anders]

It smacks of intrigue...

One reason companies like Mackie make prototypes, besides working out bugs and getting user feedback, is to hype the new product before they go into production. That allows them to purchase the right number of components and materials to keep costs down and maximize profit. The early "hype" is just to "test-the-waters" and see if the product gets market attention. Having early interest in a new product drastically reduces the marketing costs too, thereby also maximizing profit.

But there is a more sinister side to this mysterious Hotwire amp and its slow release: …Patent infringement.

Read the specs carefully and you'll find that the Hotwire boasts "Patent Pending" circuitry. I am sure most of you know about "B" companies that "ring your ears" with cheap knock-offs. If an "A" company like Mackie has a new, unique, therefore patentable item, they want to protect their intellectual property.

The “B-ring-your ear” companies have obviously stolen their most successful product designs. They simply buy a few early models of any electronic product, (mixer, amp etc.) take it apart, and then retro-engineer their version of the thing with cheaper parts, cheaper foreign labor and production methods. They alter a few details to provide a little legal leg-room for when the inevitable infringement suit comes. They sell thousands of these items at drastically reduced cost and offer late-pay financing scams to over-burdened retailers with cash-flow problems. Their strategy isn’t clever or unique. The same kind of international copyright and patent theft happens in many other businesses besides musical equipment.

Copyright thieves absolutely count on inefficiencies of the legal system. That painfully slow system is further retarded by complex international laws, unethical lawyers and multinational language barriers. It takes years of expensive international legal wrangling to force patent thieves to “cease and desist.” By the time that happens, if it ever does, the original product is practically obsolete or forgotten for the “latest-thing.” Technology changes fast these days, so if someone like Greg Mackie has a unique product now, he needs to protect it against those who are less innovative or unethical.

Don’t forget that China is a highly corrupt regime… yes, even more corrupt than the US, …if that is imaginable.

Far Eastern manufacturers do not have the same “play-fair” attitude or nearly the legal system of redress that the USA does. As such, when a cash-cow client brings several of their manufacturing facilities lucrative contracts, they “bend-like-a-reed” to make the deal work. If that includes forging contract details, stalling for court dates, answering legal letters in broken English or outright LYING, they are all for it. Until you have personally dealt with “The Eastern Mind” it is impossible to understand just how corrupt and clever they can be.

So, release of the new Mackie Hotwire MAY be on hold until all the patent paperwork comes in. Prototypes are kept under lock-and-key. No one except certain studio musicians, recording artists and a few trusted employees are likely to get a close look at this thing until every conceivable legal protection is in place.

The good news is: All this secrecy and intrigue tells us that there definitely IS something unique about this new amp. If the circuit is patentable, it must be unique in a number of ways. You might also notice that Greg C. Mackie has put his personal signature on this product. Look at the close up views of the top. His signature is next to the power switch.

Given his track-record and his company’s recent acquisitions, (Crate, Ampeg, Alvarez, EAW, Knilling) I suspect Greg is cash-flush, credit-strong, internationally connected and out for blood against the patent thieves, wherever they may be.
(Don’t F—K with Mr. Mackie, …M’kay?)

The fact that Mackie is producing a low-cost line of decent gear in China under the Tapco Brand, tells us he is making inroads into their manufacturing and negotiation systems. The fact that the amp isn’t coming out until “spring has fully sprung” also tells us that he is waiting… for something. I’ll bet dollars-to-donuts it ain’t the vernal equinox either.

If a product bears the Mackie name, it is always good. If this guitar amp bears his signature, I’ll bet it is really amazing! If he is as smart as I think he is, Greg Mackie will protect his next “brain-child” … the Hotwire V12.

I hope he is smart enough to make it true stereo and get the cost down too.

I am only providing this little reply to elucidate a few points that I haven’t seen brought up yet regarding this thread on the Hotwire. Of course, the same kind of “James Bond” corporate espionage happens all the time in other businesses. Some of those businesses are serious. Patent infringement and technology theft seems pretty innocuous when we’re talking about guitar amps. But if left unchecked, those same mechanisms of technology theft can have devastating effects in international trade and politics.

I find it funny that a friendly, guitar-playing, Woodinville audio-guru would have to develop into a “double-O” international “Man of Mystery.”

I can just imagine the scene:

[Beautiful Asian temptress with an inscrutable smile speaks to the scruffy American]

“My name, she is, Luck Luck Poon… And you are?”

[Greg] “Mackie… Greg Mackie!” (Insert Bond-ish guitar riff here.;-)

Scott

[southpawraph]

Almost a year after the 2008 Winter NAMM who still cares about this amp?